PLA Anti-Air Missile (SAM) systems

Blitzo · May 13, 2024

LKK815 said:
Would they need a heavy lift truck to move a model though? Looks really detailed for just a model.

Also if it was a model a bit strange for the tires to be flat.

What do you think is more likely -- the idea that Russia managed to capture an intact patriot system and ship it to China and have it be hauled around China on a truck in broad daylight without any visible military escort in proximity to it... or that it's a particularly accurate looking metal model which could be made for any number of reasons (for a tv show, for a theme park, for use as a representative target for military sensors/identification)?

Unless there is strong evidence to the contrary, it should be beyond the pale to even entertain the idea that this could be an actual patriot system.

supersnoop · May 13, 2024

Blitzo said:
What do you think is more likely -- the idea that Russia managed to capture an intact patriot system and ship it to China and have it be hauled around China on a truck in broad daylight without any visible military escort in proximity to it... or that it's a particularly accurate looking metal model which could be made for any number of reasons (for a tv show, for a theme park, for use as a representative target for military sensors/identification)?

Unless there is strong evidence to the contrary, it should be beyond the pale to even entertain the idea that this could be an actual patriot system.

Are we even sure it's mainland China and not Taiwan?
You can see Chinese, but to me it is too blurry to see if it is Traditional/simplified
License plates doesn't look like anything

Blitzo · May 13, 2024

supersnoop said:
Are we even sure it's mainland China and not Taiwan?
You can see Chinese, but to me it is too blurry to see if it is Traditional/simplified
License plates doesn't look like anything

Here's a higher resolution version:

There are lots of permutations we can go about this, but all of them should be enough for us to conclude that "a patriot system is in China" is not one of the possibilities we can entertain.
In a way it's almost not worth digging into the detail of this because it ends up giving this photo more oxygen than it deserves.

coolgod · May 13, 2024

supersnoop said:
Are we even sure it's mainland China and not Taiwan?
You can see Chinese, but to me it is too blurry to see if it is Traditional/simplified
License plates doesn't look like anything

Tianjin plate, the original story was Russia shipped it via Tianjin port.

Blitzo said:
What do you think is more likely -- the idea that Russia managed to capture an intact patriot system and ship it to China and have it be hauled around China on a truck in broad daylight without any visible military escort in proximity to it... or that it's a particularly accurate looking metal model which could be made for any number of reasons (for a tv show, for a theme park, for use as a representative target for military sensors/identification)?

Unless there is strong evidence to the contrary, it should be beyond the pale to even entertain the idea that this could be an actual patriot system.

Blitzo said:
There are lots of permutations we can go about this, but all of them should be enough for us to conclude that "a patriot system is in China" is not one of the possibilities we can entertain.
In a way it's almost not worth digging into the detail of this because it ends up giving this photo more oxygen than it deserves.

I have a question, by model, do you mean like a model made in China meant for PLA training or do you mean a Patriot Model made in US meant for NATO/customer training that somehow arrived in China?

Blitzo · May 13, 2024

coolgod said:
I have a question, by model, do you mean like a model made in China meant for PLA training or do you mean a Patriot Model made in US meant for US training that somehow arrived in China?

Made in China is overwhelmingly more likely.
A better question is why would we consider any other option as being more plausible to begin with, unless there is credible evidence to consider otherwise.

Think about how simple it is to know what a PAC-3 launcher actually looks like, and think how simple it is to create a metal mockup that has broadly accurate details.
The idea that they would somehow want or need to acquire a US made PAC-3 mockup (btw the missile tubes on the side clearly says "inert" and each quad pack of missile tube is obviously a single large tube meaning it is definitely not a real system) is just silly and seems like a waste of time and energy.

A good test is to consider if one saw this picture in isolation without any rumours, what would the natural conclusion be?
I for one, my natural overwhelming response is "oh, someone in China made a PAC-3 mockup".

TK3600 · May 13, 2024

The flat tire and needlessly realistic model does give a different feeling than a model. Too fancy for military mock ups. pointless for movie mock ups. No point so realistic when tire is flat.

But transporter has no mil plate. If real it is carried too casually.

Kejora · May 13, 2024

coolgod said:
View attachment 129530

Tianjin plate, the original story was Russia shipped it via Tianjin port.

I have a question, by model, do you mean like a model made in China meant for PLA training or do you mean a Patriot Model made in US meant for NATO/customer training that somehow arrived in China?

If Russia actually captured a Patriot launcher they would've bragged about it on social media, paraded it in Moscow and sent it to their own research institution instead of giving it to China.

Atomicfrog · May 13, 2024

Blitzo said:
Made in China is overwhelmingly more likely.
A better question is why would we consider any other option as being more plausible to begin with, unless there is credible evidence to consider otherwise.

Think about how simple it is to know what a PAC-3 launcher actually looks like, and think how simple it is to create a metal mockup that has broadly accurate details.
The idea that they would somehow want or need to acquire a US made PAC-3 mockup (btw the missile tubes on the side clearly says "inert" and each quad pack of missile tube is obviously a single large tube meaning it is definitely not a real system) is just silly and seems like a waste of time and energy.

A good test is to consider if one saw this picture in isolation without any rumours, what would the natural conclusion be?
I for one, my natural overwhelming response is "oh, someone in China made a PAC-3 mockup".

Model to train AI of loitering ammunitions ?

Strange to have flat tires... Flat tires is just for lowering it to pass under bridge ???

coolgod · May 13, 2024

Atomicfrog said:
Model to train AI of loitering ammunitions ?

Strange to have flat tires... Flat tires is just for lowering it to pass under bridge ???

Chinese netizens say it's standard to transport vehicles with flat tires to prevent it from rolling off the truck.

didklmyself · May 13, 2024

coolgod said:
Chinese netizens say it's standard to transport vehicles with flat tires to prevent it from rolling off the truck.

Huh? Aren't they chained or something? If they are chained then why the flat tires?
Anyhow, there is no way China would allow transporting a real patriot system uncovered.
I also think they shouldn't spend this much money just making models for targeting.

PLA Anti-Air Missile (SAM) systems

Blitzo

Lieutenant General

supersnoop

Major

Blitzo

Lieutenant General

coolgod

Colonel

Blitzo

Lieutenant General

TK3600

Major

Kejora

Junior Member

Atomicfrog

Major

coolgod

Colonel

didklmyself

Junior Member