PLA air operations in westpac region
- Thread starter Deino
- Start date
Unfortunately these aluminium fragments weren't enough to damage their engines significantly. An upgrade in the quantity and size of these aluminium fragments is necessary I think.
If Australians are so brave to fly close to China, then they better be sure that their engines are capable of dealing with "flares with Chinese characteristics"
Do it once or twice and after their engines suffer such damage they will soon learn to stay away. What's cheaper, producing new flares or repairing/producing an engine..
escobar
Brigadier
Oh, you think so? Let's see Australia do it.
I’ve read that the P-8 not only ignores PLAAF warnings but tried to initiate close approach with the J-16, which in and of itself is an unsafe maneuver. J-16 released flares and chaffs to persuade it to back off.
China needs to proactively disseminate it's side of the story or else Australia will continue to win the information war. In the end, people will only remember the initial version of the story.
You think the people reading it cares if it is true or not? They'll just see it and ignore the rest in order to confirm their biases.
escobar
Brigadier
Where is the PLAAF vid to prove that...
This is kind of the story only a couple of national security nuts online care about. However, Western military establishment has been unleashing a whole litany of anti-China messaging. Keeping quiet in the face of such propaganda simply makes China look bad. There is nothing to be gained by remaining silent.
Even if they don't have video, they need to release their side of the story. Then, it becomes he said, she said.
lcloo
Captain
The Chinese ship was in international water doing FoN, with the closest point at 50 NM away from Australian shore. This is nothing compare with US and their allies did in South China Sea.
Also, here is an old factual story of Australian submarine HMAS Orion, entering Chinese territorial water off Shanghai doing spy work for USA, and their lucky escape from Chinese territorial water.
The intelligence strengthened the alliance between the US and Australia. The missions were kept classified as they kept feeding information much needed by the Western counterparts of the Soviets. The missions also produced one of the finest Collin-class submarines that became vital to the Australia’s navy.
But the HMAS Orion also had one story of failure to tell. It was on the last mission on October 22, 1992. The Orion proudly left Sydney Harbor on a mission to Shanghai. The operation involved gathering information of the Chinese navy. Manning the submarine was commander Rick Shalders who was keen on making surveillance on the new Chinese subs. He was eager to complete the mission and return home making another mark for the Australian submariners. He later on became commander of the Collins-class submarines.
The US sought the support of Australia in gathering intelligence on the Chinese navy. The US subs were large enough to make it easily detectable in East China waters. The Australian subs, however, were ideally small to sneak into the shallow waters.
The Shanghai Harbor was a very strategic area located at the mouth of the Yangtze River. It was also China’s biggest mainland harbor. The water that feeds the Chinese marine waters was shallow and murky. Civilian vessels such as local fishing boats and ferries were also dispersed along the busy water. Eyes were everywhere.
It was difficult to do espionage without getting seen by military and non-military vessels. Any detection could compromise the mission. It would also antagonize or distress international relations between Australia and China.
The Australian navy greatly prepared to make the mission a success employing the best photographic and top-notch marine technology for intelligence gathering. They also hired translators to join the mission and interpret Chinese navy communications they could gather.
The mission, however, proved more difficult than the submariners planned for. The civilian fishing boats provided a natural local defense against espionage. The local fishermen with their nets were watchful of any catch and a slight movement of the submarine could also attract their curiosity, alarm and attention.
The local setting proved a dilemma as it was necessary for Shalders to raise the Orion’s periscope to gather the necessary intelligence they were ordered to. Shalders, however, could not risk surfacing the submarine or get it near the surface without alarming all of China.
Shalders fears were actualized. The Orion suddenly got in tangle into some fishing lines and nets. A fishing boat reportedly sank when its net became snarled into the submarine. The fisherman had to cut the net from the boat with an axe to escape from the mesh.
They were desperate to get out of the critical state they were in. Shalders was aware of the risks of detection and capture by the Chinese Peoples’ Liberation Navy. Shalders knew that the disturbance in the shallow waters would impel the Chinese navy to look into the matter. The consequences would be fatal. They, for one, would be captured and tried as spies.
Aside from the safety of his crew, Shalders understood well the international and political implications of the discovery of their presence in Chinese territory as well as the purpose of their presence. So, he chose to abandon the mission.
He maneuvered the submarine out of the busy shallow waters into a less dangerous area around the East China Sea. They left the Chinese territory to head for home with a breath of relief even without completing their task.
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