PLA AEW&C, SIGINT, EW and MPA thread

Blitzo

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The same but bigger and clearer diagram of GaoXin-6 posted by joshuatree eariler. From dingsheng 南十字星空.View attachment 16696

So from this cutaway, it says the sonobuoy launchers are directly aft of the weapons bay, and there appears to be four of them.

I'm not sure if the rest of the cutaway's internal arrangement is accurate (such as console placement) but it's definitely plausible for the sonobuoy launch tubes to be where they are depicted, and they're most definitely present on the actual aircraft if one looks at the recent higher quality pictures of GX6.
 

SpicySichuan

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Hey, =GT (I assume same from CDF), I think one needs to have a certain number of posts until they can start attaching images... but I assume this is the picture you meant to post (from the post over on CDF of course)

edit: nvm, it looks like you are able to attach.

u5YsRMU.jpg
Given how many advanced and quite subs the JMSDF and USN have, I guess China probably need more than 100 of these sub hunters. Even Japan has nearly 100 P-3s and P-1s.
 

Jeff Head

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Given how many advanced and quite subs the JMSDF and USN have, I guess China probably need more than 100 of these sub hunters. Even Japan has nearly 100 P-3s and P-1s.
Last time I checked, the JMSDF was operating the following for Maritime Patrol:

P-3C - 73 for Maritime Patrol
P-1 - 7 for Maritime Patrol

That's a total of 80 currently in use purely for Maritime duties.

The JMSDF also operates ten E/O/UP3-Cs for ELINT, Recon, and test, and three UP-3D for training.
 

SpicySichuan

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Last time I checked, the JMSDF was operating the following for Maritime Patrol:

P-3C - 73 for Maritime Patrol
P-1 - 7 for Maritime Patrol

That's a total of 80 currently in use purely for Maritime duties.

The JMSDF also operates ten E/O/UP3-Cs for ELINT, Recon, and test, and three UP-3D for training.
Doesn't China probably need at least twice the JMSDF number, given that the PLAN needs to patrol both the South and East China Seas?
 

Jeff Head

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Doesn't China probably need at least twice the JMSDF number, given that the PLAN needs to patrol both the South and East China Seas?
It all depends on what the particular country wants to patrol, and how far out.

Arguably, since Japan is completely surrounded by international waters which provide potential adversaries an avenue to use to get close to the islands, you could easily say that Japan has a larger expanse to patrol.

At the same time, China also has a long coast, but it is shielded by numerous island chains.

The amount of territory to patrol to the 1st island chain is one thing. The territory out the second island chain is another. And then, of course, depending on how far out beyond that China would be talking about.

I would say both nations, if they want to establish a viable threat from maritime patrol aircraft out to long ranges would both need similar large numbers of aircraft.
 
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Blitzo

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Doesn't China probably need at least twice the JMSDF number, given that the PLAN needs to patrol both the South and East China Seas?

Not quite that simple -- Japan in terms of geography is surrounded by water on all sides, so in a way there are more vulnerable to naval and undersea threats than countries which are semi land locked, so the JMSDF may technically have a higher requirement for ASW MPAs than the Chinese Navy in terms of patrol area.

It also wouldn't be entirely accurate for us to believe that facing a large number of adversary submarines necessarily means one has to have more ASW MPAs, as if all the adversary submarines are operating within one location that all your ASW MPAs can reach from shore without difficulty and remain on station for a long time, then one can use simply a single ASW MPA to prosecute multiple targets. Conversely, if the opposing submarines are very quiet and unable to be detected by your sensors, then sending in ten times the number of ASW MPAs in one location will not necessarily mean you can prosecute it easier.

The size of the ocean in which one wants to sanitize of submarines is very important in determining the number of ASW MPAs one needs, I think, so it's absolutely poor logic to think that China's required MPA number should be "twice" the JMSDF's given China has less waters than Japan to watch over.

In the medium term, I expect the Chinese Navy to field maybe 60 ASW MPAs with 20 or so for each fleet, which I think seems like a reasonable number and sufficient to provide the Navy a substantial increase in fixed wing ASW capability that allows them to maintain a good presence in their respective areas of responsibility.

In the long term, I expect maybe somewhere around 90 ASW MPAs in total operating from the mainland, and if the Chinese Navy starts to establish overseas bases with their own MPA requirements then it may be viable for them to forward deploy some of them around the world. But for the forseeable future a triple digit ASW MPA fleet is not entirely necessary IMO.
 
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