Movies in General

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victoon

Junior Member
Registered Member
solarz said:
Funny that you think 倚天屠龙记 has good acting. I remember watching it as a teen and thinking it was an atrocious butchering of the novel. The only reason I won't diss it is because it starred Jet Li.
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Sorry I wasn't clear. I meant the pinnacle of wuxia character development would include those actors/roles. To me they owns the character, brought the characters to life, and I just can't imagine anyone in the future will be able to do a better job.
solarz said:
In the 40 years of Jin Yong movie (not TV series) adaptations, I would say the only one that would count as a good movie is 东方不败. Everything else was just crap.
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I would definitely add 林青霞 in 东方不败, and 王祖贤 in 倩女幽魂 as unforgettable characters.
solarz said:
ANYWAY, if you or anyone else reading this is looking for something new to watch, I highly, highly recommend this:


Probably the best show I've seen in a long while.
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watched a couple of episodes at 2X. interest twist on a classic time loop story. But it is not conducive to character development. If you shuffle the actors around, it will still be fine.

it just shows that different people are looking for different things in movies/TV shows. Some are captivated by the characters (like me). some are more into stories.
 
V

victoon

Junior Member
Registered Member
ht1688 said:
I think looking for great acting in wuxia movies is difficult. There is not enough time in 2 hours to develop the characters and also insert enough fight scenes. If they have to remain faithful to Jin Yong (金庸) masterpieces, it's practically impossible. I think the level of acting in wuxia movies when compared to those in Marvel movies or Star Wars or X-Men are not all that different. I don't know if you are fluent in Chinese. If you are, on some levels, many Chinese movies are deeper in that there are a lot of cultural references that are just not available to non-Chinese viewers. Anyway, it could be just me, but I even get bored if the actions slow down too much! :p
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I like this convo! The western movies you listed are syfys, so not directly comparable. I'd compare wuxia to the lord of the rings. I think the lord of the rings have much better acting and convincing characters. BUT, I also realized that Jin Yong has such incredible character development and attention to detail in his writing that they just float out of the pages. He also creates characters in a way that idealize them, which leads to the problem that no real actor can measure up to the characters he created. 小龙女, who is extremely pale, disinterested, beautiful, and athletic, is probably the best example in this case. But actually thought Shcherbakova could work (小龙女doesn't talk much) ;)
Also, I see a lot of Chinese movies/TV shows are still crap in the department of cinematography, lighting, costume, and makeup, all of which could contribute to a more realistic look. Like anything else, these will take a long time to mature and Chinese industry is making progress.
ht1688 said:
I also don't think the number of good actors has anything to do with "freedom." There are and have been plenty of excellent actors, even when Chinese censors were stricter than now. I particularly like the older 張藝謀 (Zhang Yimou) films like 大紅燈籠高高掛 (To Raise the Red Lantern) or 活著 (To Live). In fact, in some sense modern idol worshiping may have taken away from the focus on good acting. But the base is so large in China that there are still plenty of good actors now.
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I love those movies. I also really liked 'let the bullet fly.' Character development was really good. I especially appreciated the symbolism and abstractness that's quite unique to Chinese films and the technique of showing a few discreet scene and let the audience connect the dots.
ht1688 said:
If you like this, you might like the remake, 龙门飞甲 (the movie, not the tv series). Unfortunately, I can't find it on youtube currently (used to be there but might have been taken down). You can find lots of online streams if you google it. Even though it's rated lower on douban, I like it better because of its more modern filming techniques. At any rate, you should check out the movies (绣春刀) I suggested above. The acting should be fine.
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thanks! will definitely check them out.
 
H

ht1688

New Member
Registered Member
victoon said:
I like this convo! The western movies you listed are syfys, so not directly comparable. I'd compare wuxia to the lord of the rings. I think the lord of the rings have much better acting and convincing characters. BUT, I also realized that Jin Yong has such incredible character development and attention to detail in his writing that they just float out of the pages. He also creates characters in a way that idealize them, which leads to the problem that no real actor can measure up to the characters he created. 小龙女, who is extremely pale, disinterested, beautiful, and athletic, is probably the best example in this case. But actually thought Shcherbakova could work (小龙女doesn't talk much) ;)
Also, I see a lot of Chinese movies/TV shows are still crap in the department of cinematography, lighting, costume, and makeup, all of which could contribute to a more realistic look. Like anything else, these will take a long time to mature and Chinese industry is making progress.

I love those movies. I also really liked 'let the bullet fly.' Character development was really good. I especially appreciated the symbolism and abstractness that's quite unique to Chinese films and the technique of showing a few discreet scene and let the audience connect the dots.

thanks! will definitely check them out.
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When I read Lord of the Rings as a kid, I did feel it was as close to a wuxia novel as a western novel could get. If you add The Hobbit, it took more than 12 hours to tell the story (and to develop the characters) in a movie format. Right now, the wuxia genre is just not getting the type of investment it needs; the many wuxia movies filmed nowadays are really subpar. I have a feeling it's passe. TV series are really popular though. They are a mix of 古裝 drama with some wuxia elements. They have lots of international viewership too. Just read some of the comments of this popular series from 2021 (13M views on youtube):


If I may make another recommendation, one of my favorite recent wuxia movies is 師父.
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Again, it's not on youtube but has plenty of streaming sites if you google. You would need to be fluent in Chinese though to understand this movie. It's a satire on wuxia itself, very 耐人尋味, very thought provoking.
 
G

getready

Senior Member
ht1688 said:
I think looking for great acting in wuxia movies is difficult. There is not enough time in 2 hours to develop the characters and also insert enough fight scenes. If they have to remain faithful to Jin Yong (金庸) masterpieces, it's practically impossible. I think the level of acting in wuxia movies when compared to those in Marvel movies or Star Wars or X-Men are not all that different. I don't know if you are fluent in Chinese. If you are, on some levels, many Chinese movies are deeper in that there are a lot of cultural references that are just not available to non-Chinese viewers. Anyway, it could be just me, but I even get bored if the actions slow down too much! :p

I also don't think the number of good actors has anything to do with "freedom." There are and have been plenty of excellent actors, even when Chinese censors were stricter than now. I particularly like the older 張藝謀 (Zhang Yimou) films like 大紅燈籠高高掛 (To Raise the Red Lantern) or 活著 (To Live). In fact, in some sense modern idol worshiping may have taken away from the focus on good acting. But the base is so large in China that there are still plenty of good actors now.


If you like this, you might like the remake, 龙门飞甲 (the movie, not the tv series). Unfortunately, I can't find it on youtube currently (used to be there but might have been taken down). You can find lots of online streams if you google it. Even though it's rated lower on douban, I like it better because of its more modern filming techniques. At any rate, you should check out the movies (绣春刀) I suggested above. The acting should be fine.
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Great acting can definitely be found in wuxia films. It's the staying true to the novel part that is impossible. Because as you mentioned there is no way a 2 hr or so long film can cover the entire novel while fleshing out all the different characters and their development .

Even 40 episodes long TV series cannot do this when adapting from an epic length jin yong novel like the famous condor trilogy, tian long babu or xiao ao jiang hu. All of them had to delete some minor novel characters and scenes, or combine some of them into one. A good series can get away with this if they stay true to the novel overarching themes and iconic characters and scenes though.

The best jin yong adaptation that's captures the spirit of the original novel I have watched is lian cheng Jue.

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Aniah

Aniah

Senior Member
Registered Member
Maikeru said:
Or don't ban. Let the market decide. Bans are for losers!
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The market has already decided for years. Hollywood barely makes money from China outside of a few. I do not like the let the market decide strategy because these things are dangerous to China. It's like sparing your enemy when you beat them. They will come back and bite you in the ass again and this is America we're talking about. They will never stop trying. At least by banning them my heart would feel a lot safer.
 
Maikeru

Maikeru

Major
Registered Member
Aniah said:
The market has already decided for years. Hollywood barely makes money from China outside of a few. I do not like the let the market decide strategy because these things are dangerous to China. It's like sparing your enemy when you beat them. They will come back and bite you in the ass again and this is America we're talking about. They will never stop trying. At least by banning them my heart would feel a lot safer.
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No need to ban then! Bans are still a loser move.
 
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