Moderated Taiwan Invasion Wargame

im the commander of the plan south sea fleet. as an emergency measure, beijing has just given me command of all plan warships arriving from the north and east sea fleets.

my ships:
51cx2
52cx2
52bx2
51bx2
52x2
51gx15
54ax2
54x2
53x10
sovremennyx4

this makes the punny taiwan fleet look pathetic, especiialy when i throw in subs

kilox12
songx10
yuanx4
93x4
94x2

now, i order all of my subamarines and surface warships to fire a saturated missle attack on taiwans fleet. 95% of the roc ships are destroyed, and the rest are badly damaged.

i also order in my naval air arm of h-6's. jh-7as, and mkk2s to begin pulverizing taiwans near coastal air bases.

your move, ute

as for the american issue, 2008 is the elction year. hilary clinton has been elected, and she promptly begins "pacifying" the u.s, pulling troops out of iraq. she also cancels americas defence pact with taiwan.

donald rumsfeld, who is enraged, orders a single small cvbg in against the presidents orders.the cvbg has one carrier, and appropriate escorts. its only to make the game fair. otherwise, it may get too slanted. i think poeye should play the u.s cvbg commander.

Utelore does have a pretty good doctrine I'll give him that. Inflicting the most casualties upon the PRC until the US can come and finish the job. Couldn't have thought of that better myself.

The ROC still lacks a BVR capability so they will be taking tremendous losses. My AWACs will provide consistent coverage of the air war and attacks against my naval assets would not go unpunished. I would be able to coordinate with great precision counterattacks that would make the ROC lose even more aircraft using combinations of aircraft, SAMs, and air defense destroyers. And since the ROC doesn't have a reliable BVR capability (those Aim-120's would be more useful if they weren't in Hawaii), ROC aircraft would face some huge losses. The ROC won't be able to conduct offensive operations after such massive losses and would have to conduct air defense instead.

Next, it would be time to take out Taiwan's air defense system. My side has a very capable SEAD missiles (the Kh-59 and any other future variant). Furthermore, many of Taiwan's PAC-3 batteries would be engaged trying to shoot down incoming ballistic missiles and cruise missiles which would probably number in the hundreds. Also, Taiwan would have to face the wrath of my Harpy missiles. I would continue to aggresively attack Taiwan's remaining aircraft, hit ground based radar systems with cruise missiles, and try to cripple Taiwan's air defense system using my own deadly HARMs (and I have plenty of these missiles HAHAHAHA!!!!). I would also order JH-7A fighter bombers to conduct saturated missile attacks against Taiwan's Kidd Class destroyers and other naval assets of the ROC.


We need more players playing for the ROC. BD Popeye, Gollevanein, etc. please join.

LessonsBoo said:

Well, things don't just happens overnight.

While I do agree with what utelore said, I think that's the best chance of Taiwan to put their air asset to its best use. The surprise factor will no work.

Weeks before the election even begins, PRC would've more or less guessed at the outcome of it, and would have prepared to strike/to defend way before the election is over.

Important sites would be fortified, or even moved to new locations(To avoid PB mode HARM), more SAMs brought in, more aircraft divisions moved to the strait. Essential crews would be on stand by mode.

Before giving taiwan the 72 hours warning, PRCs naval asset would already be mobilised to take up defensive positions on strategic points. Air patrols would accompany those ships too. All balistic missiles would be launched at a finger click away. And pilots would be sitting in their aircraft on rotational basis ready to take off at first sign of trouble

So I'm saying that 90% of the attacking force won't even reach Chinese shore. Most casualty would occur in the taiwan straits itself..

MY PLAY as PRC.
After which, the PRC can choose to NOT EVEN attack taiwan, to NOT EVEN launch their BMs, UN security council will definitely be brought in. The chinese would call for sanctions and etc. As ROC will be seen as the agressor the US would be in a hard position to defend them.

Talks will be held, for maybe weeks, the ROC freedom corp/armies would be confused at the political battle ensuing, most will even lost morale, blaming themselves as the agressor.

My agents planted long before the attack would now have the fuel it needs to sway public opinion. The population would be angry at the administration for causing 'shame'/sanctions on taiwan.

And if talks doesnt turn out well, I'll use force to attack. Now after weeks of 'diplomacy' surprise would now be in my hands, morale would be lower on ROC due to the negative international image/pressure/news coverage on them.

All the roadside bombs that utelore took days/weeks to prepare would've been discarded, as life went back to normal during the weeks of diplomacy.

Click to expand...

beautiful!!! :china:
The best victory is when the opponent surrenders of its own accord before there are any actual hostilities...It is best to win without fighting.
Sun-tzu
Chinese general & military strategist (~400 BC)
PRC didn't even have to land PLA in Taiwan to win

Uh, this is getting crazy, should we report our roles and assets first?
Crazy and MiG are both grabbing JH-7As.

As for AIM-120, it's 2008, maybe Taiwan has the AIM-120s in their hands. But don't count on the 8 diesel subs I'd say.

sumdud said:

Uh, this is getting crazy, should we report our roles and assets first?
Crazy and MiG are both grabbing JH-7As.

As for AIM-120, it's 2008, maybe Taiwan has the AIM-120s in their hands. But don't count on the 8 diesel subs I'd say.

Click to expand...

do they even have enough ammo to DEFEND and ATTACK? :coffee:
well if it's 2008, then i dips VARYAG!!!! :china:

The scenario was wrong to start with. First it stress that ROC's strike was successfully, which is highly unlikely given the level of readiness mainland forces in the area. Secondly, all of Taiwan's airspace are constantly monitored by long range sensors deployed by mainland, any massive air movement would be picked up the minute it left the ground and interceptors would be on their way. In that sense, we need to go back to the drawing board and re-think the scenario over.

Now that I've mentioned the flaws in Utlore's tactics, let's look at it from a political point of view. Taiwan declares independence and expect military aid from the United States is foolish to say the least. Whatever international support oo sympathy the independence movement might have will be lost the moment it attacks mainland. United States supports the current status quo between the two sides, not independence. The odds are against Taiwan militarily and politically.

Shall we begin this over?

Its hard to post on this scenario when it is so unrealistic.

China would simply not go to war with Taiwan in 2008. 2008 is the year that China gains alot of international prestige hosting the world Summer Olympics.

Likewise, no country would ever give a deadline for conventional war as that would just invite a pre-emptive attack. At the very least it announces when the the defender ought to be most prepared. Deadlines threatening nuclear war are an exception.

I recommend changing the timeframe to the very near future (say 2006), as this eliminates a lot of guesswork on what assets both sides would have. And throw away the deadline.

Organizing the rules would have to consider four phases:

Phase one:
each team must agree upon a defense/offense strategy.

Phase two:
each team must inform wargame arbitrers of their initial deployments, using the most up to date information we have on these two countries rosters and keeping their strategies in mind.

Phase three:
Arbitrers must decide who takes the initiative, and the circumstances wherein a war erupts based upon the deployments and stated intentions of the teams.

Phase four:
Arbitrers must determine outcome of this intiative (specifically the casualties) and inform the defender (whomever currently lacks the initiative) of the situation to solicit a reaction

Further phases of the game are just a repeat of phase four: arbitrers must determine the outcome of each reaction and solicit the counter-reaction until either both sides lose the initiative (stalemate) or one side is declared the loser.

Now for this to work the Arbitrers must be the supreme judge and jury of the game and these arbitrers must be the most knowledgeable and experienced in both military operations and equipment. I recommend the Forum moderators for this role, the more the better. The forum mods already have a hierarchy among them anyways, so decision making is simplified.

Not so simple is decision making among the two opposing teams. Ultimately, somebody has to be in charge of each side. No doubt this will stir a lot of conflict and debate. I for one want no leading role, just a position to observe. I suspect, if this wargame transpires, that it will be the first of a series.

Oh, one last thing, each team must maintain secrecy! Especially in phase one and two. How they wish to dicuss amongst themselves and communicate orders to the arbitrers without revealing their plans must be pre-determined. emails, and private chatrooms will be needed. This message board should primarily be reserved for the arbitrers as it is a public channel.

Posting a regular update, including a map of the region with battlelines, would be very entertaining for the readers of this forum.

I have launched 5 707 airbuses. it will be announced that these aircraft are taking forigners out of the ROC. these aircraft will skirt Japan then head towards Tianjin. This is called operation Devine wind 2. these aircraft each are loaded with 4 tons of TNT. The mission is to attack the Shipping berths at Tianjin. The same mission will be conducted with 2 707 against the main naval base at Haikou. They will claim they are heading at first to the Philippines. The pilots are current cancer patients who family will be given 1million in gold coin.

Yes, I think that it will be time to announce our roles. Mig said that he is the commander of the PLAN and so is Sumdud. Well, I'll be in command of China's air force, defense system, and missile command (others can "share command" of my assets if they wish). Someone else can take on China's land forces. Also utelore, those civilian airlines would be shot down miles before they even reach their targets by either SAMs or aircraft. Trust me, as the commander of Chinese air defense system, I am not going to allow any unidentified plane even near the Chinese naval airbases or any other military asset and the international community would understand my actions very well.

Also, let's say the ROC does have Aim-120's, but not in very large numbers. I guess the game should be more even then.

GERAT my airbus feint seems to have gotten you attention. I have now launch 34 F-16 and 45 IDF against various oil uploading termanals and coastal storage sites using maverick missiles. I have also moved a merchantship that has been made to look like a PRC merchantman. These ships will cary 2 cobra attack Helo with Hellfire, A airdefence and special forces Unit that have launched an attack on the Port city of Beihai near Vietnam. the Two hundred special forces will be dressed like Chineese Civ/PAP and Army. The mission will be to split up once ashoar into 20 man hunter killer teams. They will take controll of larger buildings near the city center and kill as many PRC responce forces as they can. The cobras will go to street level operations about 12 feet off of ground and invert towards the sea and attack targets of oppertunity. The Merchant ship will also will dock near the largest ship tending pier and with more than 20 1,000lbs aircraft bombs and more than 200 155mm Arty rounds set to detonate together once all SF units have departed the ship. The Huge mushroom cloud can be seen for miles and has caused great concern for the populace in the area. some of the special forces that have landed near Beihai are equip with 60mm morters with none lethal High strenth CS gas rounds these rounds will be fired into parts of the city and give the impression of nerve agent being used to cause unholy panic in the city and hopfully make the responding troops go into MOP gear to cause further distress..