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Randomuser

Junior Member
Registered Member

FairAndUnbiased

Brigadier
Registered Member
That's not the problem.

The point of that writing style is to persuade or convince of a point, and the whole point of citations is so that it's not just based on unverifiable personal observations.

In itself I don't see that as a problem. That's the whole point of academic writing: provide proof to support one's assertions. The problem is when confronted with evidence that conflicts with their preconceived notions they don't re-adjust their views to match the evidence and instead choose to reject the evidence.

Case in point:

1. Assumption: "Asians can't innovate"
2. When confronted with evidence of innovation:

Rather than go "Oh, we were wrong. They innovated", they go "They must have copied because we know they can't innovate."

That is the problem. It is the refusal to adjust views to fit reality, and instead a rejection of reality.
But that's the point. If you teach that finding citations about your views is all that's needed then as long as enough people reject reality, then you have a sound basis for it. How do you know what's real? If a citation says the economy is doing good but I see it doing bad then the citations are right and you should reject the unreliable personal evidence of your eyes. If China is doing well and citations say it isn't then it just means everything bad is hidden because citations from Harvard say so.

This is not what's taught in Chinese. 议论文 is only 1 aspect. Out of the 4 main styleof writing, also including 记叙文 (narrative), 散文(descriptor) and 说明文 (instructions), Chinese teaches much more about writing narratives and descriptors about own observations.

Most SAT essay problems are about convincing someone else of a viewpoint. but Gaokao essays are often about personal experiences.

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People are taught to think in different ways, don't be surprised when they keep thinking that way.
 

Chevalier

Captain
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There is no heinous crime grievous enough that the Anglo mind cannot conjure up to transpose and transfer onto the evil dastardly Chinese.

Damn, does this mean when I go the shooting range, to practice on targets, that I must be planning a school shooting? The imbecility of the U.S. political elite, indeed. This genius is at best naive as opposed to irredeemably racist and arrogant as pottinger.
 

Randomuser

Junior Member
Registered Member
That's not the problem.

The point of that writing style is to persuade or convince of a point, and the whole point of citations is so that it's not just based on unverifiable personal observations.

In itself I don't see that as a problem. That's the whole point of academic writing: provide proof to support one's assertions. The problem is when confronted with evidence that conflicts with their preconceived notions they don't re-adjust their views to match the evidence and instead choose to reject the evidence.

Case in point:

1. Assumption: "Asians can't innovate"
2. When confronted with evidence of innovation:

Rather than go "Oh, we were wrong. They innovated", they go "They must have copied because we know they can't innovate."

That is the problem. It is the refusal to adjust views to fit reality, and instead a rejection of reality.
Or they'll just move the goalpost and hope you don't notice.
 

Iracundus

New Member
Registered Member
But that's the point. If you teach that finding citations about your views is all that's needed then as long as enough people reject reality, then you have a sound basis for it. How do you know what's real? If a citation says the economy is doing good but I see it doing bad then the citations are right and you should reject the unreliable personal evidence of your eyes. If China is doing well and citations say it isn't then it just means everything bad is hidden because citations from Harvard say so.

This is not what's taught in Chinese. 议论文 is only 1 aspect. Out of the 4 main styleof writing, also including 记叙文 (narrative), 散文(descriptor) and 说明文 (instructions), Chinese teaches much more about writing narratives and descriptors about own observations.

Most SAT essay problems are about convincing someone else of a viewpoint. but Gaokao essays are often about personal experiences.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

People are taught to think in different ways, don't be surprised when they keep thinking that way.


The plural of anecdotes is not data. That is why personal observations are not persuasive because it is so easy for those to be made up, false, or even if not false they could be an unrepresentative 1 data point. Just because one person's personal circle of friends might be busy buying houses doesn't mean the whole housing market is necessarily good. Why do you think advertising sometimes tries to bring up people to give "personal accounts" of the product working? It's because psychologically people are often vulnerable to such personal accounts by supposed ordinary other people. That is how those old "snake oil" scams worked. They would get people to claim the fake medication worked for them and induce the gullible to buy. That is why modern medication trials do not go just by personal accounts of just one person. Maybe that one person was unlucky and got side effects but the medication still might work for many others.

The issue is that when it comes to economic aspects, virtually everyone is going to be dependent on other sources of data because nobody is going to be able to go around personally verifying every aspect of an economy, and it is not possible to personally construct and run a replication trial the way one could try to replicate a drug trial or other scientific trial.
 

pmc

Major
Registered Member
Russia may want to step up its economic relationship with NK, but even the Russian economy needs China to stay as strong as it is. China is the economic bedrock for both nations. Both cannot do well without China in the picture.
NK has small economy. Russia can easily hire all its population at multiple of its salaries. but based on Arabic news coverage this visit has some thing to do with making NK less belligerent so it does not mess with SKorea and Japan. Gulf Arabs have success fully integrated South Korea and Japan where there weak currencies provide product and services according to Gulf Arab requirements. Putin gave Kim Aurus auto (Arab funded), dagger (famous in Arab world) and was escorted by Lexus V8 SUVs which are common in Mideast. Arab wealth and importance will keep increasing in this divided world.
Just look at the long public conversation Putin and Qatar Emir had at SCO or this infrastructure upgrade that keep coming up because. this is to give Arab options if they want to tighten screws on other muslim countries.
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July 3, 2024 2:39 PM
Ilham Aliyev: Azerbaijan is determined to expand the infrastructure of the North-South International Transport Corridor on its territory
when i said integration of SKorea and Japan with Gulf Emirates i didnot mean just for economic reasons. there is that Gulf Arab support for the right beyond Trump.

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