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Bellum_Romanum

Brigadier
Registered Member
I think that even today, not many people in China, the US and across Southeast Asia realize just how critical things were in the SCS - Or just how close things were getting to WW3 - During those couple days in July 2016.

The only official public announcement that even remotely hinted of the seriousness of the confrontation at that time is this poster:
View attachment 114058

Behind the scenes, China and the US pretty much engaged in a stare-down contest across the Philippines and the SCS during those few days. While the US assembled two carrier strike groups around Ronald Reagan and John C. Stennis to the east of the Philippines, China pretty much had to scrape together all the major seagoing warships that she had at her disposal at the time (which, honestly, isn't many at all) and group them to the west side of the SCS.

To put things into perspective, while facing against the US, for the China of July 2016:
1. Liaoning hasn't even reached fully-combat-capable status - Shandong has just started construction;
2. Semi-carriers (i.e. 075) haven't exist yet;
3. Only 9 AEGIS destroyers (6 052Cs and 3 052Ds) available - 055 large destroyers haven't exist yet;
4. Only 24 frigates that can be called "modern" (2 054 and 22 054A) available;
5. DF-21D AShBM has entered service not long ago, and there isn't a lot of them - DF-17 HGV and DF-26B haven't entered service;
6. Fighters equipped with AESA just started to proliferate across the PLAAF - The 4.5-gen J-10C was in serial production for barely one year, while the 4.5th-gen J-16 and the 5th-gen J-20 just started serial production;
7. Modern H-6Ks aren't even available in large numbers - H-6Js and H-6Ks haven't even enter production;
8. ABM system isn't as complete and comprehensive as it is today -
etc.

Perhaps the only card that could possibly help China's odds and deter the US from launching direct hostilities is the 094/A SSBNs that went for deterrence patrol in the Central Pacific, where their nuclear-tipped JL-2s can reach CONUS within 15 minutes.

Although the scenario for China isn't as bad as during the 1996 Taiwan Strait Crisis (yes, the one with tanks and SPAs brought onboard boats to "fight against imperialist aggression"), yet the odds against China in summer 2016 is nowhere as better as today either.

Yet, China persisted, and the US blinked first. Beijing firmly stood her ground in the SCS, thus forcing Washington DC and their lackeys in Manila to back down (for at least a couple years).

Thinking how the PLA has grew massively powerful since then, we should probably lament how things were even tougher and unscalable for our predecessors and ancestors back then.

(This close-call is also why I truly believe that the Philippines should be severely punished by China in case of any hot war in the IndoPac theater, considering that Manila is the kickstarter of the 2016 confrontation and also the most annoying troublemaker for China in the SCS.)
Fully concur
 

Arnies

Junior Member
Registered Member
The question one must ask himself is does the US even have any relations with Pakistan anymore and this is what the Pakistani gov't is told but with this kind of moves it proves that the US sees Pakistan just like IEA and Iran no difference and the relations have always been make and believe and the same with the Chinese who wanted to somehow descalate but it shows the US' clear aggressive intentions.

This sort of kills the relations Pakistan has with the US and the same goes to the relations China has with the US down the pipeline.

You have to ask yourself who does the US want to arm a fascist nation of the worst caliber against? giving weapons to India is worse then arming peak Hitler. This is scandalous. Besides this also shows to China that the US intentions are quite clear and aggressive in nature.

My another question is why is Pakistan not busy arming all the regional elements with lethal weapons because if the US is willing to give lethal weapons to India then Pakistan can do the same share some of it's weapons with everyone tit for tat and Pakistan will not be the loser of this kind of moves but the americans will. Pakistan's shouldn't sit and just watch the Americans arm India while not doing anything. We gotta hurt the Americans elsewhere arming KSA, IEA. Egypt, iran and multiple regional players with technology that can grant them veto rights this will change the focus to elsewhere.

Also China can do the same thing if the US do this they can arm other nations the US would find hurtful to be armed to that extend. China should provide lethal weapons to others including russia.

The Americans shouldn't be allowed to sat foot inside the cow belt by China and Pakistan this policy is mutual for both.
 
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ansy1968

Brigadier
Registered Member
India is being chosen as the next Ukraine and this is going under the radar somewhat..

The Americans have undoubtedly came out and said they wanna do defense technology transfer to India.

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This is imho an indirect war declaration against China, Pakistan and the regional allies
Bro for me, this interaction is a net positive for both Pakistan and China for a simple reason. India can't afford it both monetarily and technical. With full range of Russian weapon being used in the Indian military they need to spend a big percentage of their budget to replace them with expensive over hype US weapons.
 

Biscuits

Major
Registered Member
The question one must ask himself is does the US even have any relations with Pakistan anymore and this is what the Pakistani gov't is told but with this kind of moves it proves that the US sees Pakistan just like IEA and Iran no difference and the relations have always been make and believe and the same with the Chinese who wanted to somehow descalate but it shows the US' clear aggressive intentions.

This sort of kills the relations Pakistan has with the US and the same goes to the relations China has with the US down the pipeline.

You have to ask yourself who does the US want to arm a fascist nation of the worst caliber against? giving weapons to India is worse then arming peak Hitler. This is scandalous. Besides this also shows to China that the US intentions are quite clear and aggressive in nature.

My another question is why is Pakistan not busy arming all the regional elements with lethal weapons because if the US is willing to give lethal weapons to India then Pakistan can do the same share some of it's weapons with everyone tit for tat and Pakistan will not be the loser of this kind of moves but the americans will. Pakistan's shouldn't sit and just watch the Americans arm India while not doing anything. We gotta hurt the Americans elsewhere arming KSA, IEA. Egypt, iran and multiple regional players with technology that can grant them veto rights this will change the focus to elsewhere.

Also China can do the same thing if the US do this they can arm other nations the US would find hurtful to be armed to that extend. China should provide lethal weapons to others including russia.

The Americans shouldn't be allowed to sat foot inside the cow belt by China and Pakistan this policy is mutual for both.
I would caution against equating India with Hitler. The Indian army might look large, but it is extremely doubtful that they can actually overrun any countries, especially not Pakistan as it is backed by China and has a fairly well trained military.

China has been slowly pushing US out of the middle east, both using weapons but mainly through appeal to international law and values. Whoever controls the middle east (and to a lesser extent, Africa) will essentially be the dominant superpower. So these are the areas where China needs to be very aggressive.

The subcontinent is hard for China to deal with (besides Pakistan and Bangladesh), because of India's fascist political system. So it's better to let them starve and stagnate in isolation and see what happens later, rather than trying to rock the boat too much.
 

Arnies

Junior Member
Registered Member
I would caution against equating India with Hitler. The Indian army might look large, but it is extremely doubtful that they can actually overrun any countries, especially not Pakistan as it is backed by China and has a fairly well trained military.

China has been slowly pushing US out of the middle east, both using weapons but mainly through appeal to international law and values. Whoever controls the middle east (and to a lesser extent, Africa) will essentially be the dominant superpower. So these are the areas where China needs to be very aggressive.

The subcontinent is hard for China to deal with (besides Pakistan and Bangladesh), because of India's fascist political system. So it's better to let them starve and stagnate in isolation and see what happens later, rather than trying to rock the boat too much.

The countering move is to first arm everyone regionally creating multiple North Korea's everywhere this will diminish the US presence further the down the pipe and they lose any relevance.. One must not escape with arming one against the other without consequences for themselves elsewhere.. I know India is terrible militarily but we can't allow the US to sat foot in there besides.

Them arming India is a betrayal to both countries and good will relations we aren't arming Mexico against them.. This shouldn't go unpunished by creating multiple North Korea across the Middle east would be the right punch in the gut.

One shouldn't let these kind of things fly. Look the kind of alarm and screaming they made when China and Solomon Islands wanted to do military cooperation and have bases there.

This is super annoying and blatant they want to encroach on others constantly and lesson has to be thought to them here that they aren't the only ones who has lethal weapons here. They will never do this kind of stupid shxt again
 
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Fedupwithlies

Junior Member
Registered Member
The countering move is to first arm everyone regionally creating multiple North Korea's everywhere this will diminish the US presence further the down the pipe and they lose any relevance.. One must not escape with arming one against the other without consequences for themselves elsewhere.. I know India is terrible militarily but we can't allow the US to sat foot in there besides.

Them arming India is a betrayal to both countries and good will relations we aren't arming Mexico against them.. This shouldn't go unpunished by creating multiple North Korea across the Middle east would be the right punch in the gut.

One shouldn't let these kind of things fly. Look the kind of alarm and screaming they made when China and Solomon Islands wanted to do military cooperation and have bases there.

This is super annoying and blatant they want to encroach on others constantly and lesson has to be thought to them here that they aren't the only ones who has lethal weapons here. They will never do this kind of stupid shxt again
I wonder what Russia thinks of this.
 
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