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emblem21

Major
Registered Member
Be careful you don't end up on some watchlist. 5 eyes is watching. I know its rich coming from me but, just remember who we're up against.
I am not planning anything or trying that sort of thing, I am merely bearing witness to what is going to happen in the future, nothing more. I am disgusted with what is happening in Australia but I already know that there is nothing much I can do about that. But I can say that Australia’s stance in angering China and Russia at the same time will have terrifying consequences that can lead to such an event to happen in the future and thus I pray that no violence will happen but really, australia does need to be humbled and I believe that this will eventually happen soon, but let’s wait and see
 

emblem21

Major
Registered Member
They desperately need Colin Powell to sell their deceit.
The only problem not only does it only work once, but many nation have wised up to it now. More importantly, the USA has been weakened somewhat while Russia and China has strength a bit so trying to wage a guilt free war not isn’t going to be anywhere near easy while it is going to be much much harder to ensure that a significant number of US soldiers are not going to die this time around.
 

LesAdieux

Junior Member
That’s because America has a unwritten policy that says “ if you fuck with us” we are never going to forgive you.
Afghanistan is going to starve, and prob never receive international aid from the West. Cuba has been sanctioned forever ever since the failed Bay of Pigs mess.

really? the Vietcong fucked yanks pretty hard, and the yanks with still swelling ass start to court their fuckers.
 

Phead128

Captain
Staff member
Moderator - World Affairs
What does this even mean? In a practical sense, what would this entail?
Similar to the US-UK relationship given the economic/power disparity between the two.
I'll ask again, what does this recognition entail? Do you expect Moscow to regularly sing paeans to how big and strong China is and how lucky it is to be its "little brother"? China isn't some insecure narcissist whose fragile ego requires constant affirmation.
Similar to the US-UK relationship given the economic/power disparity between the two.

If Russia and China were to develop into a long-term, stable, and fundamentally strong relationship or even a formal treaty alliance, the vast gulf of economic and military disparity between the two powers must be reconciled. Ostensibly, the relationship aspires to be "Co-equal" in nature, but what if China says: "No 5th gen fighter exports to any SCS dispute claimants as SCS is a 'core interest' of China". How would Russia react to that? Would it feel dictated to by China? Managing China's 'core interests' vs. Russia's export interests is key to a fruitful and sustainable long-term relationship without triggering any inferiority complex or feeling dictated to, and is one of the lessons for avoiding the Sino-Soviet Split.

The only part of modern international relations you seem to get is the useless formalism.
The agreement at breakup of Soviet Union in 1989 to recognize the independence of Ukraine and other former Soviet states is not "useless formalism", rather a legally-binding treaty to recognize a sovereignty of a nation-state.

I agree 100% that "useless formalism" is very much alive (e.g. "Taipei" vs. "Taiwan" representative office in Lithuania) but that isn't an argument against Ukrainian's sovereignty, that's an argument of "defacto vs. dejure" Taiwanese independence. Disregarding "useless formalism", I agree that Taiwan is "Defacto" independent, but that doesn't render Ukraine's "Dejure" independence ineffective.
Who cares who recognized whom?
Two parts:
  • China cares, see China vs. Lithuanian sanctions over "Taipei" vs "Taiwan" representative office. China gets triggered over the tiny name change, so yea, it's important.
  • Ukraine's independence and sovereignty was recognized in a legally-binding treaty in 1989. Ukraine is "Dejure" independent, in contrast to "Defacto" independent Taiwan.
Does the fact that Taiwan doesn't have a seat in the UN bring the PRC any closer to governing it? No. The only thing that will do that is China shifting the balance of power sufficiently in its favour.
There is zero similarities between Taiwan and Ukraine. Taiwan is a "Defacto" independent party in an Unresolved Civil War, whereas Ukraine is a "Dejure" independent nation in an Post-Colonial Dissolution. Mongolia is a better comparator since Mongolia is an ex-colony of China, China recognized "Dejure" independence of Mongolia, and Mongolia as a smaller should respect larger power's national security. Taiwan comparison is too extreme.

As a practical matter, Russia is much closer to ruling Ukraine than China is to ruling Taiwan, despite their respective statuses at the UN.
I'm talking about the legally-binding treaty at breakup of Soviet Union that recognized Ukraine's sovereignty and independence, signed by Russia itself. Their respective statues at UN doesn't matter, it's the bilateral agreement between Russia-Ukraine at the breakup of Soviet Union that matters, not UN. You are missing the point...

If nation-states can rip up international legally-binding agreements because of vague geography, loose historical connections, and ethnic/racial kinship, then what is stopping China from reclaiming Mongolia?
I'm not interested in labelling and moralizing, that's an American thing. The only thing that interests me when evaluating any candidate action China might take is the expected benefits and expected costs of said action, nothing more
Fair enough.
It sure acts like it. Maybe the problem is that they haven't read their rejection letter from the UN closely enough.
There is a big difference between Taiwan's "Defacto" independence and Ukraine's "Dejure" independence by legally-binding treaty. Taiwan's status is "useless formalism", but Ukraine's status is not "useless formalism", because if you can rip-up treaties, then there is no point to diplomacy, and it defaults to "Might makes Right".
Frankly, you need to develop a much healthier respect for the threat and use of force.
You don't see the irony on how your arguments can also justify Mongolian irredentism on Inner Mongolia, Chinese irredentism on Outer Mongolia, Korean irredentism on Gando/Manchuria, or literally any other imperialistic act? No nation-state is entitled to a specific area of land based on geography or ethnic/racial ties because that is a slippery slope for any power to annex any territory they deem in their "sphere of influence" because they are "entitled" to it.

Also, don't you think it's a tiny bit counterproductive and might actually force Ukraine to seek closer ties with West if Russia keeps on using a big stick to intimidate and annex it's territory? This strategy doesn't seem very reliable in the long-term. It is effective in short-term to deter NATO membership, but I am sure Ukraine will be more motivated to be with West/EU, rather than Russia.
 
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