Miscellaneous News

victoon

Junior Member
Registered Member
I once posted here about a surreal experience during a bioethics workshop where I was the only non-white participant and all my Trump-bashing colleagues thought it was self-evident that if technology was to become available, all people of color would want to gene edit their children to be white.

I'm now seeing the same kind of logic being echoed here. Kindly remember China is not the only country with national pride. History matters. Culture matters. Identity matters.
not a full counter argument. But Puerto Rico and Guam are not countries and Native American nations in the US remain part of the US.

but you are right that independent countries tend to want to remain independent. Often it has much to do with the ruling elite having a good life despite a poor country.
 

Phead128

Captain
Staff member
Moderator - World Affairs
Does it? I can't think up examples, I'm afraid. All I see is Russia belatedly responding to being encircled and hounded after it tried every conceivable way to integrate with the West.
Fair enough. I agree Russia is responding from a weaker position and China should support a weaker imperialist (Russia) against a stronger imperialist power (e.g. US/NATO). This is the correct geostrategic policy, we agree on this point.
For instance, I - with my eyes wide open - support what Russia's doing now on moral grounds.
If you have basic moral principles, you would call out imperialism, whether it is Russian or American, regardless of if whether they are you 'best friend' or not. Principles are not conditional on who is doing the annexation.
I oppose the West's encroachment
To be real, both US and Russia are "defending core interests" by using offensive imperialism. It's a matter of semantics, perspective, and word choices.

Your interpretation of West's encroachment can easily be argued as 'pre-emptive self-defense security enlargement' arrangement by others.
My interpretation of Crimean annexation can easily be argued as 'pre-emptive self-defense maneuvers' by others.

When you remove all the layers of bullshit propaganda by both sides, it's both sides using offensive imperialism "defensively."
into Slavic territories (as I oppose its encroachment into any people's territories)
Unfortunately, "Slavic territories" makes it sound like Russia is somehow 'entitled' to this area based on vague ethnic/racial kinship. Are individual Slavic ethnicities incapable of critical thinking for deciding their own fate? This dehumanizes individual Slavic ethnic groups into mere subservience, and infantalizes them as if they are incapable of governing without a master overlord (Russia). This is quite dehumanizing and infantilizing.
and support Russia's efforts to repel this encroachment.
I support Russia's effort to repel NATO expansionism too. "The enemy of your enemy is your friend".
That concords very well with my basic moral principles.
It concords with your geostrategic preferences on countering the US, but as far as basic moral principles, I'm not fully convinced.
If you like slapping the "imperialist" label on things, perhaps you might find some examples of Chinese imperialism - or is China exempt from your moralizing?
Well yea, if you stretch back 2000 years, you can find some examples of Chinese imperialism, but we are talking about 2014 Crimean annexation, just 8 years ago, a fairly modern recent event in an era where annexation and imperialism is frown down upon.
Why do you have this urge to "subordinate" Russia?
Just like your urge to subordinate all "Slavic" territories into Russian overlordship.

Using your logic, Russia is somehow 'entitled' to Slavic overlordship because it's the most powerful among all the Slavic states. Now apply your logic to the power dynamic between Russia and China. By 2050, China will be the most richest and powerful nation on earth with overwhelming economic and military power compared to US, much less Russia. Do you think Russia, a former Superpower and independent Great Power, would tolerate to be junior subordinate status to China like in an US-UK relationship?

@ZeEa5KPul I have a question to you: Do you think China should enter into a formal military treaty alliance with Russia, or does the current unlimited friendship+++ suffice? I personally do not support a formal military treaty alliance with Russia which will drag China into Middle East/Eastern Europe quagmires/crap and potentially nuclear WW3. (i.e., don't put all eggs into one basket.)
 
Last edited:

ZeEa5KPul

Colonel
Registered Member
Do you think Russia, a former Superpower and independent Great Power, would tolerate to be junior subordinate status to China like in an US-UK relationship?
I don't think it should have to. I don't see why the US model is the only one China, whether today or tomorrow, can or should pattern its international relations after. China can be the most powerful entity on Earth and still not go around subordinating foreign nations - in fact, that's how it was for a long time before the West industrialized.

This instinct to subordinate and impose its worldview on foreign cultures is the secular, modern expression of the West's driving historical impulse: Christianity. "Democracy" is just the new Jesus and all must believe. China - very fortunately - is not blighted with this cultural baggage, so subordinating others like this is just not in its national character.
Are individual Slavic ethnicities incapable of critical thinking for deciding their own fate?
I believe that many, if not most, Ukrainians feel an overpowering emotional urge to escape Russia's influence. That proves to be that they aren't thinking critically because the first thing they would see if they looked at a map is that there's no escaping Russia's influence in the patch of geography they occupy. They nurse delusional hopes that the West - which fundamentally holds them in contempt - is going to protect them and bleed for them, and that Russia's weakness post-USSR is a permanent state of affairs.

This wishful thinking is going to bring catastrophe down on them; so no, I don't think Ukrainians (the Slavic ethnicity in question) are capable of critical thinking at the present historical juncture.
Do you think China should enter into a formal military treaty alliance with Russia, or does the current unlimited friendship+++ suffice?
The present position and momentum of China-Russia relations is just fine.
 

sinophilia

Junior Member
Registered Member
I once posted here about a surreal experience during a bioethics workshop where I was the only non-white participant and all my Trump-bashing colleagues thought it was self-evident that if technology was to become available, all people of color would want to gene edit their children to be white.

I'm now seeing the same kind of logic being echoed here. Kindly remember China is not the only country with national pride. History matters. Culture matters. Identity matters.

Ok fine China should just annex them instead. Does that make you feel better.
 

gelgoog

Lieutenant General
Registered Member
Our difference is that I see a "divorce" as the breakup of Soviet Union, and Russia recognized Crimea being part of Ukraine at the breakup of Soviet Union in 1989.

??? I don't understand this. What 'promise'? What 'bargain'? When Soviet Union collapsed, Russia recognized Ukraine's sovereignty as an independent nation. There is no conditions on Crimea upon independence as far as I am aware?

None of this matters. Russia was never going to surrender their Black Sea fleet base and let it become a NATO base. Not when then NATO could easily blockade the Sea of Azov and the Black Sea area in general then and basically blockade Russia's only warm water port. Back then all the bulk food imports which Russia needed went through this port. They could essentially starve Russia out if they wanted. It was a serious attack on Russia's fundamental interests and the survival of the state. Russia responded as any state would.

If Ukraine had a policy of neutrality none of this would have happened. The US precipitated this situation by making the coup in the first place.
 

PhSt

Junior Member
Registered Member
I do not blindly support a friend just because it's a friend, that is America's hypocritical specialty.

You are aware that America is working hard to find ways to create a rift between Chinese and Russian relations, and what would be a better way to instigate conflict between the two countries other than hyping up historical border issues that have ALREADY been settled by both countries. Your constant anti Russian rhetoric makes you a useful tool for the West. Haven't you realized? Unless inflaming tensions between China and Russia is your intention all along.

Fair enough on resolution of border dispute. If Russia can tolerate junior subordinate status in the Sino-Russo relationship, I can see the relationship evolving into a full mature formal treaty alliance, like US-UK relationship.

You simply can't hide your erroneous contempt for Russia, China's most important ally at a time when the West is in full offensive to suppress and destroy China. You sound like you'd rather see China surrender to the West than to be allied with Russia.

How any idiot can write this and be taken seriously, I don't know.

So someone who has a point of view that's different than yours is an Idiot. lol. Russia has every right to reclaim its lost territories just like how China has the right to reclaim its rightful territories like Zangnan
 
Top