Low-cost, muti-role aircraft for small militaries

Re: New life to older aircraft

In the Eritrean–Ethiopian War, both relatively poor countries went directly for the best that they could afford/get, MiG-29 and Su-27 with East European merc pilots. The result? Eritrean Mig-29 swatted Ethiopian Mig-21 and Mig-23 planes out if the sky like flies, and Ethiopian Su-27's swatted Eritrean Mig-29's out of the sky like flies.

If the security situation was bad enough, I doubt even 3rd world countries would settle for 3rd rate combat aircraft. They are likely to try and get the best that they can because the newer and more powerful combat jets will likely swat the older ones out if the skies like flies.

If a 3rd world AF buy 3rd rate planes, it's probably because the security situation affords them to.

Re: New interceptors for the Argentine Air Force?

Denis_469 said:

It would be best solution for Argentinian Air Forces. Low cost modern planes. And you can buy modern AA missiles and anti-ship missiles and guided bombs for this planes. Modern missiles no one from west not sell to Argentina, so this missiles can use against UK. But if agree sell, so missiles may be not work. Argentinian navy see poor quality western torpedoes during war 1982 year. If Argentina wish receive quality missiles and other armaments, so need by this in Russia.
Also you need buy in Russia airplanes-tankers "Il-476" and EW planes on base "Su".

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poor qaulity torpedos? i think you will find that Argentina had top qaulity anti-ship misiles and fighter jets to go with them, in the form of the Exocet equipped Mirage F1s

not only that Argentina was very well equipped for the war and had all the chances to win, the reason they didnt was because of overall lack of strategic command and inferiror training, Argentina almost won that war

had Argentina done thier homework right down to the T, the result of the war would be different

Re: New interceptors for the Argentine Air Force?

asif iqbal said:

poor qaulity torpedos? i think you will find that Argentina had top qaulity anti-ship misiles and fighter jets to go with them, in the form of the Exocet equipped Mirage F1s

not only that Argentina was very well equipped for the war and had all the chances to win, the reason they didnt was because of overall lack of strategic command and inferiror training, Argentina almost won that war

had Argentina done thier homework right down to the T, the result of the war would be different

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I don't think so, the British had a SSN there, HMS Conqueror. It could have destroyed the whole Argentina' navy

Re: New interceptors for the Argentine Air Force?

asif iqbal said:

poor qaulity torpedos? i think you will find that Argentina had top qaulity anti-ship misiles and fighter jets to go with them, in the form of the Exocet equipped Mirage F1s

not only that Argentina was very well equipped for the war and had all the chances to win, the reason they didnt was because of overall lack of strategic command and inferiror training, Argentina almost won that war

had Argentina done thier homework right down to the T, the result of the war would be different

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Yes. I have data from Argentina about use torpedoes in 1982 war. See it is 1st may and see days later. All data from submarine logs UK and Argentina. See 1982 year in days.
About Exocet I can not place data in open site.
When you see chronik submarine attack you can see, that near all torpedoes use San Luis missed targets. 1 attack not clear now.

Re: New interceptors for the Argentine Air Force?

duplicated post

Re: New interceptors for the Argentine Air Force?

antiterror13 said:

I don't think so, the British had a SSN there, HMS Conqueror. It could have destroyed the whole Argentina' navy

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true, but had the Argentinians organised the invasions plans better the SSN did not have to be there in the first place

you might be facing a better equipped foe, but better overall stratedgy would have taken care of the SSN threat

infact so bad was the planning for the invasion Argentinains made fool of themselves when they brought forward the invasion date by 6 months when they thought HMS Conqueror was on its way to the Falklands back in March, when infact it was still in the mediterranean

in those 6 months Royal Navys deal for the sale of thier aircraft carrier would be completed to Austrialia and Argentinian air forces would have completed a air base on the Falklands, so they would not have to fly in from the mainland, which means more time over target, this situtaion alone changes the game altogether

Re: New interceptors for the Argentine Air Force?

asif iqbal said:

poor qaulity torpedos? i think you will find that Argentina had top qaulity anti-ship misiles and fighter jets to go with them, in the form of the Exocet equipped Mirage F1s

not only that Argentina was very well equipped for the war and had all the chances to win, the reason they didnt was because of overall lack of strategic command and inferiror training, Argentina almost won that war

had Argentina done thier homework right down to the T, the result of the war would be different

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Actually, Argentina was not well equipped for the all at all and have glaring deficiencies that cost them dearly.

The Argentines never expected the British to actually show up and fight, so when they did, they were badly caught out.

One does not start a war when one only has a handful of Exocets as Argentina did. Had they actually expected to fight a war with Britain, they could and would have ordered a few dozen or even hundreds of Exocets and made sure they were delivered before they invaded the Falklands. That simple act alone would have won them the war.

There were plenty of other assets they could, and should have gotten beforehand if they actually expected to fight, things like tankers for air refueling, parachute or retarded bombs, the latest AIM9L from America etc.

There were also plenty of things they could and would have done tactically had they expected a war, things like sending proper troops to the island instead of a bunch of conscripts, mining the approaches to the island or at least the harbor etc.

There were also many tactical blunders that the Argentines committed during the war, but it was largely their lack of proper preparation for fighting the war that ultimately doomed them to failure.

However, the training of the Argentine pilots was never an issue, the conscripts were poor, but the pilots were very well trained and did their job as well as could have been expected considering the circumstances and limitations they faced.

Re: New interceptors for the Argentine Air Force?

Argentina did start preparation for the war but did not finish the preparation because the the invasion was brought forward by 6 months by the military Junta

Had it been carried out in October 1982 as scheduled Argentina would have most likely have won the war

And the reason why conscripts were used was because the best Argentinian divisions were sent to the Chile border to stop any preemptive attack from Chile, irony also is that 6 months later they were at peace because Chile leadership changed, had the invasion happend in October the best Argentinian divisions would have been deployed to fight

And finally had the wind not died down when Argentinian aircraft carrier was about to launch its aircraft UK would have lost most of it's hand full of Harriers which would have finished off the air cover for Royal Navy, and in the South Atlantic at that time of year it's very rare for winds to die down

Re: New interceptors for the Argentine Air Force?

asif iqbal said:

Argentina did start preparation for the war but did not finish the preparation because the the invasion was brought forward by 6 months by the military Junta

Had it been carried out in October 1982 as scheduled Argentina would have most likely have won the war

And the reason why conscripts were used was because the best Argentinian divisions were sent to the Chile border to stop any preemptive attack from Chile, irony also is that 6 months later they were at peace because Chile leadership changed, had the invasion happend in October the best Argentinian divisions would have been deployed to fight

And finally had the wind not died down when Argentinian aircraft carrier was about to launch its aircraft UK would have lost most of it's hand full of Harriers which would have finished off the air cover for Royal Navy, and in the South Atlantic at that time of year it's very rare for winds to die down

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Not sure how a handful of A4Qs would have taken out 20 odd Sea Harriers unless they managed to sink both the RN carriers. Chances are if the Veinticinco de Mayo had stayed out much longer and not run for port when she did, the Sparten would have sunk her eventually.
Cheers

Re: New interceptors for the Argentine Air Force?

Pusser01 said:

Not sure how a handful of A4Qs would have taken out 20 odd Sea Harriers unless they managed to sink both the RN carriers. Chances are if the Veinticinco de Mayo had stayed out much longer and not run for port when she did, the Sparten would have sunk her eventually.
Cheers

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please read more about the conflict before making such posts, infact just look back in this thread the situtation in question was discussed

And Royal Navy did not have 20 odd sea harriers they had 42 aircraft in total, 28 sea harriers and 14 Harriers GR3, and not all were on aircraft carriers they were stored on container ships