Japanese GPS hulabaloo

I see hypocrisy!

We all know if it were the other way around and Chinese were caught doing this in Japan or the US, there would a big stink about it and even more paranoid claims.

AssassinsMace said:

I see hypocrisy!

We all know if it were the other way around and Chinese were caught doing this in Japan or the US, there would a big stink about it and even more paranoid claims.

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For one thing, I am sure that if this was a Chinese company that was caught short in another country people here would be claiming about racist persecution and the like, China-threat propaganda, etc why else would people be arrested for making a mistake, etc.

For another, China actually has an offensive capability so there might be some justifiable concern. On the other hand Japan doesn't have any offensive missiles, so such claims as were mentioned in the first post are obviously moronic.

FuManChu said:

For another, China actually has an offensive capability so there might be some justifiable concern. On the other hand Japan doesn't have any offensive missiles, so such claims as were mentioned in the first post are obviously moronic.

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Not so moronic -- Japan may be acting in behalf of US.

FuManChu said:

nemo, it is possible that someone might just want to get on with something themselves and believe they can handle it. Also you're assuming any local institution would be experienced/interested/co-operative, etc.

You're making assumptions at every turn and then using them to try to show some sort of ulterior motive. If that's not what you're doing, I'm not sure why you're making such a fuss (because the other explanation would be that an innocent mistake was made).

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Quidquid id est, timeo Danaos et dona ferentes.

And don't you agree there are so many abnormalities that this is a bit suspicious?

nemo said:

Not so moronic -- Japan may be acting in behalf of US.

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The papers said Japanese missile attack, not US missile attack. Also I'm not exactly sure what the point of bombing Xinjiang would be anyway. It's the farthest point away from the most likely conflict area(s) between China and the US/Japan.

Quidquid id est, timeo Danaos et dona ferentes.

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If that's how you actually feel in regards to the Japanese, maybe you should go see a psychiatrist or something......

And don't you agree there are so many abnormalities that this is a bit suspicious?

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Making a mistake about an unusual law that no one could possibly imagine existed is not something to be suspicious about. That is the only thing that has been proven - just about everything else you've mentioned is guesswork.

AssassinsMace said:

I see hypocrisy!

We all know if it were the other way around and Chinese were caught doing this in Japan or the US, there would a big stink about it and even more paranoid claims.

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I am pretty sure Chinese are doing that in US and Japan as well. Too bad if they don't have that law, then don't complain.

FuManChu said:

Making a mistake about an unusual law that no one could possibly imagine existed is not something to be suspicious about.

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I don’t think this law is unusual. Getting a badge at where you work, that is the common sense. Let’s suppose, one day a Chinese go to Bahamas and start measuring ocean temperature without permission, but get caught because AUTEC (The Atlantic Undersea Test and Evaluation Center) is nearby, would you think that is unreasonable too?

Who said that it was purely military?

A lot of things are happening in that region where politically and economically the Japanese would want to have turn in their favor.

Japan could be working for the US. Just like they said of that KAL flight that the Soviet Union shot down. Perfect excuse to use that "Japan doesn't have an offensive capability" card. But then we know they're making excuses to have one now. So why not prepare for that day?

Notice the anti-China faction is already crying that China has overblown this situation? Well so far the Japanese were only fined. I'm sure Amnesty International will call that a human rights violation. Is it as overblown as crying espionage when some Japanese sailors traded porn and Aegis secrets just because one of them had a Chinese girlfriend. Or how about pointing out that Rupert Murdoch has a Chinese wife as a reason to stop him from taking over the Wall Street Journal. Well he was doing business in China long before he met his present wife.

fishhead said:

I am pretty sure Chinese are doing that in US and Japan as well. Too bad if they don't have that law, then don't complain.

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We already know the US is gathering intelligence in China. I read once that the running joke is American spies try so much to look like tourists that they stand out.

Just curious...:rofl: japanese scientists are repeatedly caught redhanded without proper government approval conducting high precision surveying in very remote barren regions in western China (Xinjiang and also Gansu). Indeed the japanese government has obviously some strong motivation for conducting that kind of risky and provocative missions and probably this is related with China's strategic weapons partly based in this region.

Interestingly the reaction of the chinese media is quite animated this time (... well the mentioning of japanese ´fantasy missiles´is off the mark but we have to consider that stories about thousands of very real US missiles actually aimed at China are currently not ´encouraged´by CPC leaders busy to make their people believe how ´friendly´the relationship with the globes prime predator has been developing in recent years. Consequently a ´clever´journalist who wants to keep his job hits out at the ´dog´ (Japan) but his words are really aimed at his ´master´ (US); most chinese are very adept in reading between the lines and understand the real intention well... ) and probably the incident is widely seen more critical since the japanese were warned several times to change their behaviour.

(Some sort of mission scenario)

The japanese team could have deployed some sophisticated sensor gadgets monitoring seismic, climate and chemical data sending it cryptoprotected to a japanese satellite. These miniaturized and camouflaged (perhaps as a small rock) devices are very efficient and easy to deploy (just leave them behind after your ´visit behind the next bush´ ).

Eventually in the time of crisis they send real time data back to headquarters via satellite (a data base of previous monitorings will be enhanced by the most current data!) and Second Artillery's valuable mobile ICBM's are suddenly sitting ducks for a devastating surprise strike by ballistic or cruise missiles. Such a scenario would checkmate PLA's deterrent force instantly and consequently this has to be prevented by PLA under all circumstances.

P.S.: Of course this is only my immature speculation... but in addition with bad experience with japanese scientists in history (clandestine survey campaign 1915-30 in preparation of Japan's war of aggression 1937-45) this may explain why some feathers are ruffled in China.

FuManChu said:

The papers said Japanese missile attack, not US missile attack. Also I'm not exactly sure what the point of bombing Xinjiang would be anyway. It's the farthest point away from the most likely conflict area(s) between China and the US/Japan.

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This is gathering data for contingency -- just in case of war. I doubt the news report says Japan is going to attack China -- merely it may be use to attack China.

Just how unimportant it is? What if they are mapping the prepared launch site for mobile ICBM/IRBM. Is pulling China's nuclear teeth relevant?

BTW, Japan need only to activate defense treaty with US to use those US weapons that can attack Chinese interior: Let US do the attack -- the end result is the same.

FuManChu said:

If that's how you actually feel in regards to the Japanese, maybe you should go see a psychiatrist or something......

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My... you are starting to resort to ad hominem attacks.

It is normal reaction to be cautious, especially concerning the histories of the parties involved. There is a saying --
once bitten, trice shy. And trick me once, shame on you; trick me twice, shame on me.

Japan has a lot to do before China will lower its guard --
for one thing, Japan still try to weasel out on the responsibility for WW-2. Old history, I know, but why not acknowledge the guilt and get it over with? China has already given up reparation.

FuManChu said:

Making a mistake about an unusual law that no one could possibly imagine existed is not something to be suspicious about. That is the only thing that has been proven - just about everything else you've mentioned is guesswork.

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Yes, the stuff I mention are guess work, so is your presumption of innocent intent. I merely point out China has cause to be cautious, and Chinese law do apply on Chinese land.

You try to portray Chinese law as nonsense. I just need conjectures on what can happen to show this law is wise.
China is trying to prevent worse case damage without this law by making this law. Your best case scenario is useless to argue against the law -- it may help the persons who are arrested, but do nothing to invalidate *need* for this law.