J-20 5th Generation Fighter VII

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tamsen_ikard

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Is there a version of PL-15 in development for J-20 to be able to carry more in its weapons bay? Current 4 missile capacity seems awfully low compared F-22 which can carry 6 amraams.
 

ougoah

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Is there a version of PL-15 in development for J-20 to be able to carry more in its weapons bay? Current 4 missile capacity seems awfully low compared F-22 which can carry 6 amraams.

There's been hints that a PL-12 and/or PL-15 based MRAAM is bring developed where six can be fitted within the J-20's main bays. How they achieve this is unclear but obvious. Some combination of folded fins, slimmed down diameter and possibly length if they want to arrange them like the F-22 does but with folded fins I don't see how that would be necessary. The bays may even be deep enough to offset them slightly so the cross sectional centroids are closer to each other, thereby further addressing the width limitations.
 

tamsen_ikard

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There's been hints that a PL-12 and/or PL-15 based MRAAM is bring developed where six can be fitted within the J-20's main bays. How they achieve this is unclear but obvious. Some combination of folded fins, slimmed down diameter and possibly length if they want to arrange them like the F-22 does but with folded fins I don't see how that would be necessary. The bays may even be deep enough to offset them slightly so the cross sectional centroids are closer to each other, thereby further addressing the width limitations.


How about A/G missiles for SEAD and anti-ship missions? Is that in development? J-20 stealth features would make it very suitable for SEAD, deep strike and anti-ship roles.
 

crash8pilot

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How about A/G missiles for SEAD and anti-ship missions? Is that in development? J-20 stealth features would make it very suitable for SEAD, deep strike and anti-ship roles.
The J-16D is an EW aircraft, I'd suspect the SEAD mission will be reserved for it after the J-20 secures air domination... Much like what the Growler does for the USN and Block 50 Vipers does for the USAF.
 

ougoah

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How about A/G missiles for SEAD and anti-ship missions? Is that in development? J-20 stealth features would make it very suitable for SEAD, deep strike and anti-ship roles.

Who knows. China's super tight lipped about details. Being able to know such things are in service is something to celebrate. I think SEAD roles are not really for China's posture or the types of battles and wars it may potentially get involved in. Let's take some purely speculative hypothetical wars. I could only think against Taiwan SEAD may be indeed necessary but all Taiwanese air defences are within easy reach of most artillery and missiles but let's say some units are hidden and not revealed or destroyed by initial strikes. Then it would require some dedicated SEAD and J-20 may be a suitable platform being stealthy and all. Honestly for something like India, the war would be very different to the usual sort of NATO small scale war fighting which often involve distance attacks and surgically removing air defences.

SEAD is just not an area PLA has focused on which is understandable considering the posture is against the USN and carriers. So PLA needs modern navy, modern airforce, area and access denial. I think Chinese SEAD is really just non-stealth fighters or strikers shooting YJ-91 or other YJ series suitable for this sort of air to ground.

Anti-ship role just isn't for J-20. Can't fit current weapons and shouldn't be spending money to develop weapons that fit just so J-20 can have a go and contribute to the saturating anti-ship arsenal. J-20 much better used against adversary air to clear the way and make anti-shipping easier or possible.
 

Blitzo

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How about A/G missiles for SEAD and anti-ship missions? Is that in development? J-20 stealth features would make it very suitable for SEAD, deep strike and anti-ship roles.

From a couple years ago now, but there is an anti-radiation missile derived from PL-15 in development for J-20, and also a powered standoff range cruise missile with anti surface roles in the works.
The original rumour stated J-20 is intended to be able to carry four of each max in its main weapons bay.

I can't find the original post, but it was in one of the J-20 threads. I think it may have been pb who wrote it.
 

Blitzo

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Who knows. China's super tight lipped about details. Being able to know such things are in service is something to celebrate. I think SEAD roles are not really for China's posture or the types of battles and wars it may potentially get involved in. Let's take some purely speculative hypothetical wars. I could only think against Taiwan SEAD may be indeed necessary but all Taiwanese air defences are within easy reach of most artillery and missiles but let's say some units are hidden and not revealed or destroyed by initial strikes. Then it would require some dedicated SEAD and J-20 may be a suitable platform being stealthy and all. Honestly for something like India, the war would be very different to the usual sort of NATO small scale war fighting which often involve distance attacks and surgically removing air defences.

SEAD is just not an area PLA has focused on which is understandable considering the posture is against the USN and carriers. So PLA needs modern navy, modern airforce, area and access denial. I think Chinese SEAD is really just non-stealth fighters or strikers shooting YJ-91 or other YJ series suitable for this sort of air to ground.

Anti-ship role just isn't for J-20. Can't fit current weapons and shouldn't be spending money to develop weapons that fit just so J-20 can have a go and contribute to the saturating anti-ship arsenal. J-20 much better used against adversary air to clear the way and make anti-shipping easier or possible.

J-20 is primarily an air to air platform, but there is no reason it cannot conduct strike missions and also SEAD.

Considering the number of J-20s that the PLA is likely to procure into the future and the capability offered by its stealth, range, and sensors, it makes sense to develop anti surface and anti radiation weapons to enable it to be a more multirole aircraft.

Obviously J-20 will not be a dedicated strike aircraft or dedicated SEAD/DEAD aircraft, but even as is, the aircraft would be quite formidable in both roles just by virtue of its capabilities by being a 5th gen fighter. It makes no sense not to develop weapons for the aircraft in those roles
 

silentlurker

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If anything, I think the cost of UCAVs are going to drop signidicantly AND their autonomous capabilities are going to get way better with advances in algorithms and cheaper datalink electronics.

That's why I'm happy to use the current Valkyrie specifications as a benchmark.

Think about how expensive the first telecoms/computers/jet engines were, and the rapid improvements in cost and capability.
This seems like an incorrect comparison to me: UCAVs are a practical application of many already existing technologies. You can't expect growth like that of completely new fields.
 

AndrewS

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This seems like an incorrect comparison to me: UCAVs are a practical application of many already existing technologies. You can't expect growth like that of completely new fields.

Autonomous UCAVs that can decide to shoot by themselves?
And also work with other UCAVs in a distributed swarm?
And incorporate all the data in the battle network to decide what to do?

That is revolutionary, and is most definitely not existing technology.
 
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