J-20 5th Gen Fighter Thread V

[Air Force Brat]

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

J-20 in the rain.

Very Kool Siege, and gentlemen, as a teacher, English is my native and only tongue, the word:

Functional: to be capable of performing the task for which it is intended!

it either works or it doesn't "function"

So, a better way to describe the lenses being "present" is to simply state that they are present or have replaced the mock-up.

 

[AndrewS]

The F-35 programme was a dog's breakfast to put it mildly, with way too many complex requirements.

Whereas J-20 IOC is almost certainly going to stick to the core air-to-air combat mission, and then worry about other things in a later version. As a lone long-range interceptor/sniper, there's no point in ground to air capabilities or too much sensor fusion.

And we certainly have enough data points from other Chinese military programmes and in the civilian electronics/software world - to expect a very rapid development/debugging process.

 

[latenlazy]

The F-35 programme was a dog's breakfast to put it mildly, with way too many complex requirements.

Whereas J-20 IOC is almost certainly going to stick to the core air-to-air combat mission, and then worry about other things in a later version. As a lone long-range interceptor/sniper, there's no point in ground to air capabilities or too much sensor fusion.

And we certainly have enough data points from other Chinese military programmes and in the civilian electronics/software world - to expect a very rapid development/debugging process.

Sensor fusion isn't for A2G roles.

 

[Blitzo]

The F-35 programme was a dog's breakfast to put it mildly, with way too many complex requirements.

Whereas J-20 IOC is almost certainly going to stick to the core air-to-air combat mission, and then worry about other things in a later version. As a lone long-range interceptor/sniper, there's no point in ground to air capabilities or too much sensor fusion.

And we certainly have enough data points from other Chinese military programmes and in the civilian electronics/software world - to expect a very rapid development/debugging process.

As latenlazy said, sensor fusion is important for a variety of roles not only for A2G, in fact I'd argue it's as important for A2A as well at the least.

Also, while the civilian industry is an important and valuable tool to try and guesstimate where the military industry equivalent's capability may lie, the correlation also isn't direct. For instance, the US civilian industry in electronics and software is second to none, yet Lockheed and their subcontractors are still finding difficulties with the F-35's software.
Of course, that doesn't mean we should use foreign programmes like F-35 or F-22 as a direct proportional projection for the J-20 programme's potential length of development either, because they all have their own unique cluster of requirements and capabilities, are being under their own unique political circumstances (and unique demand/urgency), and developed with their own unique and slightly differing origins from tech demonstrator to prototype to LRIP to eventual full production.

So at this stage I think it's a bit early to reliably say how rapid J-20 may be able to achieve its equivalent of IOC... especially if we do not know how complex and capable its various sensor integration and software will be and how competently they will be able to solve any issue that may crop up in that regard.

 

[latenlazy]

Sensor fusion isn't for A2G roles.

Isn't just* for A2G.

 

[plawolf]

The F35's problems don't stem from sensor fusion or multirole, they stem from the B version, and the apparent over-engineering of the plane, especially its software, which again, I personally believe links back to the performance penalties imposed on the A and C models by the need to be largely compatable with the far more complex and risky B.

Being a multi-role striker, with all the added weight penalties that go with it, wouldn't have helped either.

With the core airframe so underwhelming in raw performance, LockMart has been trying to 'cheat' to bring the jet's performance up to spec by trying to get the FBW to help compensate by making very (overly in my view) precise and complicated control surface adjustments to eek out every last possible bit of extra nose pointing ability (the F35's straight line acceleration performance is quite good by all accounts thanks to its monstrously powerful engine and low-drag clean profile).

 

[SpicySichuan]

Without the Air Force serial number, how do we know if these planes are actually for delivery to the PLAAF?

 

[Blitzo]

Without the Air Force serial number, how do we know if these planes are actually for delivery to the PLAAF?

Of course we don't, but based on past experience of past aircraft programmes, as well as using the visual evidence of the aircraft changes (including paint scheme and roundels), and from credible rumours of the aircraft's stage of development, the current expectation is that these first few LRIP birds will be handed over to the air force... and it's a pretty reasonable one, I think.

But who knows, they might actually be delivered to martians or something.

 

[Deino]

Come on ... don't be so shy !

 

[Air Force Brat]

The F35's problems don't stem from sensor fusion or multirole, they stem from the B version, and the apparent over-engineering of the plane, especially its software, which again, I personally believe links back to the performance penalties imposed on the A and C models by the need to be largely compatable with the far more complex and risky B.

Being a multi-role striker, with all the added weight penalties that go with it, wouldn't have helped either.

With the core airframe so underwhelming in raw performance, LockMart has been trying to 'cheat' to bring the jet's performance up to spec by trying to get the FBW to help compensate by making very (overly in my view) precise and complicated control surface adjustments to eek out every last possible bit of extra nose pointing ability (the F35's straight line acceleration performance is quite good by all accounts thanks to its monstrously powerful engine and low-drag clean profile).

U sir have "miss-underestimated" the F-35 on all counts, most particularly the airframe, which makes lots of lift, and provides very outstanding aerodynamic performance. Those FCS "tweaks" have this thing practically flying itself aboard the carrier, leaving the pilot to concentrate on positioning the aircraft to come aboard and catch the wire.

LockMart seems to have finally integrated development, flight test, and production of this aircraft through each version rather seamlessly!

NOW back on topic, the latest J-20 LRIP bird seems to have flown? is it 2102?? or ??? who knows??? These aircraft will be delivered to the Air Force for their own flight test program, as well as other testing that the military usually performs. The truth is that it will be some time before this program reaches similar milestones to the F-35, with its deployment to the Marines first of that troublesome B model, funny how it has leapt ahead of the others??