J-10 Thread IV

[optionsss]

Well the J-10C's engine does take up quite a lot of space compared to the Rafale, so I would not be surprise if the Rafale carries more fuel. In fact, it is widely believed that the Rafale has a combat radius of 1700+km, which is greater than those of the Su-27 and nearly matches those of the F-15. However, the single engine on the J-10C is more powerful, and the bigger radome allows for a bigger AESA. The best comparison to the J-10C is the F-16 Viper, but as mentioned earlier, the Viper (also a single powerful turbofan engine like the J-10 as opposed to Rafale's two medium-sized turbofan engines) somehow has a super short combat radius of 550-600 km without conformal fuel tanks.

I would argue that in the case of Pakistan, while India's Rafales surely have longer strike ranges, J-10C's bigger AESA radar gives it an edge in BVR combat.

I am surprised a single WS-10 would take more room than 2 Snecma M88.

 

[ougoah]

One ws10 doesn't occupy more volume than two m88 by significant enough margin to show up as significant fuel capacity increase.

The logic from CHP is so wrong. No basis in reality otherwise all single engine fighters have to have a significant degradation in range because... Single engine.

The single engine in j10 is more powerful? Wtf? Yes compared to ONE m88.

 

[ougoah]

Well the J-10C's engine does take up quite a lot of space compared to the Rafale, so I would not be surprise if the Rafale carries more fuel. In fact, it is widely believed that the Rafale has a combat radius of 1700+km, which is greater than those of the Su-27 and nearly matches those of the F-15. However, the single engine on the J-10C is more powerful, and the bigger radome allows for a bigger AESA. The best comparison to the J-10C is the F-16 Viper, but as mentioned earlier, the Viper (also a single powerful turbofan engine like the J-10 as opposed to Rafale's two medium-sized turbofan engines) somehow has a super short combat radius of 550-600 km without conformal fuel tanks.

I would argue that in the case of Pakistan, while India's Rafales surely have longer strike ranges, J-10C's bigger AESA radar gives it an edge in BVR combat.

Mate... Please stop with this.

 

[lcloo]

Well the J-10C's engine does take up quite a lot of space compared to the Rafale, so I would not be surprise if the Rafale carries more fuel. In fact, it is widely believed that the Rafale has a combat radius of 1700+km, which is greater than those of the Su-27 and nearly matches those of the F-15. However, the single engine on the J-10C is more powerful, and the bigger radome allows for a bigger AESA. The best comparison to the J-10C is the F-16 Viper, but as mentioned earlier, the Viper (also a single powerful turbofan engine like the J-10 as opposed to Rafale's two medium-sized turbofan engines) somehow has a super short combat radius of 550-600 km without conformal fuel tanks.

I would argue that in the case of Pakistan, while India's Rafales surely have longer strike ranges, J-10C's bigger AESA radar gives it an edge in BVR combat.

Please double check your info on Rafale's range with and with-out 3 fuel tanks, do the same for J10C's range.

 

[Strangelove]

More CP...

 

[SteelBird]

It was speculated that J10C has around 3T internal fuel, while Rafale is advertised to carry 4.7T. J10 looks bigger than rafale too.

That's what I am searching for because I always see J-10 fly with two external fuel tanks.

To be longer need not to have more internal volume. One thing you need to remember is that J-10 has a slim body while the Rafale has a wider body that should contribute to more internal volume. Rafale also have larger wing area compared to J-10.

 

[Blitzo]

That's what I am searching for because I always see J-10 fly with two external fuel tanks.

To be longer need not to have more internal volume. One thing you need to remember is that J-10 has a slim body while the Rafale has a wider body that should contribute to more internal volume. Rafale also have larger wing area compared to J-10.

I don't think we know how much internal fuel J-10 has.


Furthermore, take a moment and consider it -- even if we speculate that J-10 has less internal fuel than Rafale, why would that mean the Pakistanis would feel compelled or necessary to fly them with two external fuel tanks?
In the case of this parade for Pakistan, they are flying with two external fuel tanks, hardly a strenuous flight requiring the excess fuel from EFTs.


Additionally, we have seen J-10s flying without external fuel tanks for exercises and parades in China, or sometimes with one fuel tank, or with three fuel tanks.


So to put it another way -- no, we do not "always see J-10 fly with two external fuel tanks" to begin with.

 

[gelgoog]

The Rafale has crap range without external fuel tanks. Which is why you seldom see it without them.
I do not know why you think it has good range. Least of all that it has more range than the Su-27.
It is also pointless to talk about it in this section.

 

[Gloire_bb]

Well the J-10C's engine does take up quite a lot of space compared to the Rafale, so I would not be surprise if the Rafale carries more fuel. In fact, it is widely believed that the Rafale has a combat radius of 1700+km, which is greater than those of the Su-27 and nearly matches those of the F-15. However, the single engine on the J-10C is more powerful, and the bigger radome allows for a bigger AESA. The best comparison to the J-10C is the F-16 Viper, but as mentioned earlier, the Viper (also a single powerful turbofan engine like the J-10 as opposed to Rafale's two medium-sized turbofan engines) somehow has a super short combat radius of 550-600 km without conformal fuel tanks.

I would argue that in the case of Pakistan, while India's Rafales surely have longer strike ranges, J-10C's bigger AESA radar gives it an edge in BVR combat.

Erm. 4.7t fuel is anything but a lot for a 25t-class twin-engine fighter - in fact, it's perfectly feasible to carry as much in a competitive single-engined medium aircraft. I.e. its range on internal fuel is ... well, not exactly pathetic, but unimpressive(~mig-29smt/upg level).

The only way Rafale gets its huge range numbers is with its huge drop tanks, which the French Air Force carries almost routinely (with a corresponding effect on flight performance, of course).

p.s. also, combat radius of Su-27/j-11 is almost twice that of F-15, and both numbers are weeeell below those you've assumed. If you're comparing numbers - please bother to find the same numbers, and not just find highest ones from Wikipedia. It will also help you with F-16, which, sure, isn't impressive - but definitely not 'super short'.

 

[ansy1968]

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@Strangelove bro what make up did the PAF use, they're prettier when apply than PLAAF...lol