Israeli-Palestinian Conflict and other Related Conflicts in the Middle East (read the rules in the first post)

Michael90 said:

Seems you guys don't understand trumps closeness with Israel. You should have wished the Democrats won. Since they might have some reservations about Netanyahu on some issues, but Trump has zero reservations towards Israel and will back them 100% on every issue with full support. This will make things far more easier for Israel to carry out any of their actions in this conflict.

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Nobody knows what trump will do. He is appointing racist people who hate Iran, but he also has repeatedly stated that he wants to bring peace not war and his administration has already started direct talks with Iran through Elon musk and Iran's UN ambassador. Overall, it's a mixed picture but with clear evidence of a path to peace

His plan might be to attempt to stop Iranian oil sales, but then it's really up to China. If China obeys trump's orders, then Iran may capitulate and make an unfavorable deal or go nuclear. If China continues purchasing oil and supplying essential technology, Iran will resist and the current situation will continue as it is. Iran's exports to the west is already limited to supplying Persian restaurants, there's not much to lose.


Both netanyahu and Putin know that there's a risk that Trump might force them to end the conflicts. That's why they're becoming as aggressive as possible before the inauguration. We shall see who's right once Trump is actually in office. So far, Iran is going for negotiations with trump as they haven't retaliated against Israel and talked to musk

Maikeru said:

Trumpers' plan for "Maximum pressure" on Iran, including secondary sanctions on Chinese oil purchasers.

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This isn’t going to work. China isn’t going to give in to US demands. Trump does not negotiate like a rational actor. He is more akin to an unstable mafia boss demanding obedience. Plus the world today is totally different from the world of his first term. This “Peace Through Strength,” policy going to hit a brick wall real fast.

JJD1803 said:

This isn’t going to work. China isn’t going to give in to US demands. Trump does not negotiate like a rational actor. He is more akin to an unstable mafia boss demanding obedience. Plus the world today is totally different from the world of his first term. This “Peace Through Strength,” policy going to hit a brick wall real fast.

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The 3 pillar of BRICS, so in essence for them Iran is weakest link? maybe BUT do you think Russia and China will stand by and let it happen?

IRGC spokesman accidentally admits that Iran operates S-400 systems.

Minm said:

Nobody knows what trump will do.

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We don't? And the Elon-Iran interview is fake news. The Iranians denied it. I don't see why Iran would want to engage in diplomacy with a person that has no authority and no governmental position of any sort. Besides that, we are fully aware that Iran has tried to reach a diplomatic settlement with the US for decades to no avail. It was Trump himself that pulled out of the JCPOA, not Iran.

Minm said:

His plan might be to attempt to stop Iranian oil sales, but then it's really up to China. If China obeys trump's orders, then Iran may capitulate and make an unfavorable deal or go nuclear. If China continues purchasing oil and supplying essential technology, Iran will resist and the current situation will continue as it is. Iran's exports to the west is already limited to supplying Persian restaurants, there's not much to lose.

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How exactly does he plan on doing that? US forces have no access to the land corridors Iran uses to supply China with oil, and if the Iranians are using marine vessels to transport some of that oil to China, the PLAN could opt to escort said vessels, but if for some reason they chose not to do that, the two parties have many other options through land.

Minm said:

Both netanyahu and Putin know that there's a risk that Trump might force them to end the conflicts. That's why they're becoming as aggressive as possible before the inauguration. We shall see who's right once Trump is actually in office.

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The US doesn't make decisions for Putin. Russian weapons don't come from the US like they do Israel, and the US doesn't have the manufacturing capacity to up their game in Ukraine in order to push Russia to the negotiating table. We know full well Russia has the upper hand and we know that it is Russia that is forcing the US to the negotiating table, not the other way around. In the case of Israel, the US can only give more bombs to hit civilians, and that will not stop the missile barrages from being fired into the occupied territories. This can go on for years and years, and thanks to drones, it can be done with very little funding. Even one drone a day can create enough uncertainty to ruin the Cufi dream.

Minm said:

So far, Iran is going for negotiations with trump as they haven't retaliated against Israel and talked to musk

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They have retaliated and they are not negotiating with anyone. Last time I checked, all Iran's allies are firing missiles non-stop inside the occupied territories north to south.

iBBz said:

IRGC spokesman accidentally admits that Iran operates S-400 systems.

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We don't? And the Elon-Iran interview is fake news. The Iranians denied it. I don't see why Iran would want to engage in diplomacy with a person that has no authority and no governmental position of any sort. Besides that, we are fully aware that Iran has tried to reach a diplomatic settlement with the US for decades to no avail. It was Trump himself that pulled out of the JCPOA, not Iran.


How exactly does he plan on doing that? US forces have no access to the land corridors Iran uses to supply China with oil, and if the Iranians are using marine vessels to transport some of that oil to China, the PLAN could opt to escort said vessels, but if for some reason they chose not to do that, the two parties have many other options through land.


The US doesn't make decisions for Putin. Russian weapons don't come from the US like they do Israel, and the US doesn't have the manufacturing capacity to up their game in Ukraine in order to push Russia to the negotiating table. We know full well Russia has the upper hand and we know that it is Russia that is forcing the US to the negotiating table, not the other way around. In the case of Israel, the US can only give more bombs to hit civilians, and that will not stop the missile barrages from being fired into the occupied territories. This can go on for years and years, and thanks to drones, it can be done with very little funding. Even one drone a day can create enough uncertainty to ruin the Cufi dream.


They have retaliated and they are not negotiating with anyone. Last time I checked, all Iran's allies are firing missiles non-stop inside the occupied territories north to south.

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Oh, they definitely want to negotiate, if Trump has anything reasonable to offer. But it will probably fail because Americans are culturally unable to make compromises in which both sides win.



As you say, if Trump tells China to stop buying Iranian oil, then it's really up to China what happens with Iran. With Chinese support they can resist, if China sacrifices Iran to get concessions from the US, as China has done before, then Iran will have to choose between enduring another economic depression, capitulation or going nuclear

RottenPanzer said:

Tbh and somewhat unrelated here.
I felt like Trump's plan in stopping the war in Ukraine is quite genuine and since there are some circles within America's right (probably even within Trump's administration) who saw a feasibility of Russo-American alliance in anticipation against China.

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i dont think russia is foolish enough to trust the west again...
usa is trying hard to drive a wedge between russia & china.

Index said:

Nope lol

And at the same time more difficult for US to carry out any actions in the main conflict.

Trump is the best choice for China, being able to tie and destroy even more US materiel in the middle east is the most positive outcome.

Israel is only worth so much as US pretends it's worth. When you have as you describe a compromised US politician that has huge closeness with Israel, that means US just delivers it's own balls into a vice which it's enemies can press at any time. They create an easily exploitable weakness that wouldn't be there if US just maintained it's distance.

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US doesnt decide Israel's worth to US, Israel does.

ansy1968 said:

The 3 pillar of BRICS, so in essence for them Iran is weakest link? maybe BUT do you think Russia and China will stand by and let it happen?

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That is the thinking many right wing and even some left wing Neo cons. They can’t do nothing to North Korea as they have nukes. Russia and China are too powerful and have nukes. So they deluded themselves that war with Iran is “easier.” I doubt China would give in because they just brought Iran to BRICS. Giving in to US pressure would not look good in front of other potential BRICs members. Xi’s recent warnings to Biden and incoming Trump administration states the Chinese position. His message was blunt. Abandon containment fantasies and accept Beijing as an equal partner. And that China’s economic progress is non negotiable. Applying secondary sanction on Chinese companies buying Iranian oil is a direct threat to Chinese economic progress. If there is direct war against Iran, China and Russia will back Iran. Likely supplying Iran and their allies to not only bleed the Suada. But kick them out the region.

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Minm said:

Oh, they definitely want to negotiate, if Trump has anything reasonable to offer. But it will probably fail because Americans are culturally unable to make compromises in which both sides win.


As you say, if Trump tells China to stop buying Iranian oil, then it's really up to China what happens with Iran. With Chinese support they can resist, if China sacrifices Iran to get concessions from the US, as China has done before, then Iran will have to choose between enduring another economic depression, capitulation or going nuclear

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Look at the things you are saying. Trump "tells" China. Trump "forces" Putin. Trump is sincere about negotiations but Americans are incapable of making fair deals. Trump this. Elon that. Your arguments are just not serious, illogical, and self defeating.

Michael90 said:

I'm not talking about China's here. We are in a Israel/palestine thread so the discussion is about these two . So I am talking about what would have been abit better for Palestinians in this US election candidates between the Democrats and republicans.

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You have to be ridiculously gullible (which we know you are) to believe any opposing US government will benefit Palestine in any way. Both sides are fully anti-Palestine and pro-Israel. Their foreign policy on middleast is dictated by Israel, not by Americans. The only difference between them is how to achieve the same end goal: annihilation of Palestine. Some prefer quick and open genocide, while others prefer slow and clandestine genocide.

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IDF sniper Sgt. Maj. Idan Kenan liquidated by ... an al-Qassam sniper (on video; not posting due to forum rules; available on Twitter)


Another hand-planted bomb in the sweet spot of Merkava 4 - right under the turret

Al-Shifa Hospital, before & after