ISIS/ISIL conflict in Syria/Iraq (No OpEd, No Politics)

janjak desalin

Junior Member
[...]
If the South Aleppo campaign has relocated hundreds of rebel fighters from other areas, inflicted heavy casualties on them and failed to maintain key rebel supply lines open, I think it will be deemed a success.

Thank you for your well-thought and well-expressed (as always) response.

I have been following the battle for Latakia, intently. Have you consulted any terrain maps of the current operational area ? It's quite challenging!

And, yes, the battles for the supply routes from the Turkish border, and the battle for Idlib (Province), will, in fact, be the true battle for the Syrian Republic.

New Syrian Flag Green Star Capital.jpg
 

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
I also have a heavy scepticism with regards to organisations like Amnesty and HRW. Both operate from plush suites in the Empire State Building and I did once take the time to read their financial reports and see who their large financial supporters were.

You need to be a true forensic accountant to be able to trace things all the way back, but I found monies coming in from trusts and foundations set up in the name of senior establishment figures.

Even the BBC admits that Iblid is held by a coalition of largely Islamist militant groups and this itself makes some of the definitions and discussions by the media interesting in the extreme.

A number that are in Iblid are already listed as terrorist in the resolution and as such are legitimate targets for Russian Airstrikes.

It also seems that we are getting a novel interpretation of the word civilian as well. It is also true that the BBC 4 Radio today programme, also reported in the first days of the Air Strikes that an Syrian Observatory Group (Syrian Observatory for Human Rights?) did maintain that most of the targets were military by nature. It has not repeated to my ears since that morning.
What the BBC reportage could not hide was that many of the targets were Civil Infrastructure rather than indiscriminate civilian and this is a huge difference being obscured in media coverage.
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Well said Sampan.

This type of reporting happens very often (and on both sides I might add in terms of their reporting...they will gladly make similar claims against US forces whenever it suits their fancy) whenever Amnesty International and other such organizations come to the battle space.

I have never liked the idea of embedding quasi-journalists with front line war fighters.

Invariably, you negatively impact the ability (and even desire in some cases) of those front line units to do what has to be done when fighting the enemy because they have civilian entities looking over their shoulders who they perceive (and all too often correctly) to be looking for any opportunity to not only question their actions, but to find a way to prosecute them. This is dangerous to any fighting unit.

I am sure there are some of them who are honest and not agenda driven...but sadly, theirown organizations generally are, and many f them as individuals certainly are.

It is the nature of the beast, particularly in the west. They are special interest groups, and sometimes news outlets acting as such, and their funding and ratings are driven by their ability to ideologically and politically feed those interests.

Sad...but all too true...and IMHO it has no place on or around the battlefield.

I have no doubt whatsoever that they will play those same cards against Russians or anyone else.

Now...there does need to be oversight and an ability to report on and address abuse or atrocities. Hopefully a good internal Inspector General type organization, with clear lines for reporting such incidents exists within these forces (whichever side), and in the west there is meant to be civilian political oversight to help make it happen.

Agenda driven special interest groups and reporting posing as journalists are not a way to make it happen.
 

delft

Brigadier
Well said Sampan.

This type of reporting happens very often (and on both sides I might add in terms of their reporting...they will gladly make similar claims against US forces whenever it suits their fancy) whenever Amnesty International and other such organizations come to the battle space.

I have never liked the idea of embedding quasi-journalists with front line war fighters.

Invariably, you negatively impact the ability (and even desire in some cases) of those front line units to do what has to be done when fighting the enemy because they have civilian entities looking over their shoulders who they perceive (and all too often correctly) to be looking for any opportunity to not only question their actions, but to find a way to prosecute them. This is dangerous to any fighting unit.

I am sure there are some of them who are honest and not agenda driven...but sadly, theirown organizations generally are, and many f them as individuals certainly are.

It is the nature of the beast, particularly in the west. They are special interest groups, and sometimes news outlets acting as such, and their funding and ratings are driven by their ability to ideologically and politically feed those interests.

Sad...but all too true...and IMHO it has no place on or around the battlefield.

I have no doubt whatsoever that they will play those same cards against Russians or anyone else.

Now...there does need to be oversight and an ability to report on and address abuse or atrocities. Hopefully a good internal Inspector General type organization, with clear lines for reporting such incidents exists within these forces (whichever side), and in the west there is meant to be civilian political oversight to help make it happen.

Agenda driven special interest groups and reporting posing as journalists are not a way to make it happen.
Unfortunately such things happened, to a limited extend, in the war against Vietnam, and it didn't happen in the Dutch war against Indonesia as is now getting clear even to the Dutch government, but Western armies are now well able to defend themselves against such supervision by outside or inside organizations as shown in the recent wars in the Middle East. I do not know that it is any better in any other armed forces.

OT
In the Dutch war against Indonesia ( 1946-49 ) the truth was known to people in the Netherlands from letters by soldiers and from returning soldiers, and one newspaper wrote about it, but it was totally ignored by all authorities and all other media.
 

janjak desalin

Junior Member
Syrian Army Advances North towards Aleppo City while Hezbollah Pushes South to The Idlib Governorate
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on December 24, 2015
The Syrian Arab Army’s 4th Mechanized Division has recently shifted their attention to the provincial capital of the Aleppo Governorate after spending the last two months fighting alongside Hezbollah and Harakat Al-Nujaba (Iraqi paramilitary) to cutoff the imperative Islamist rebel supply route from the Idlib Governorate.

Following the capture of Khan Touman, Hezbollah and the Syrian Armed Forces split apart, with the former advancing south of the strategic Aleppo-Damascus Highway (M-5 Highway) while the latter pushed north towards the large towns of Al-Rashideen and Khan Al-‘Assal that border the southern sector of the provincial capital.

With Hezbollah and Harakat Al-Nujaba pressuring the Islamist rebels of Harakat Ahrar Al-Sham, Harakat Nouriddeen Al-Zinki, and Jabhat Al-Nusra (Syrian Al-Qaeda group) along the Aleppo-Damascus Highway, the Syrian Arab Army’s 43rd and 154th Brigades of the 4th Mechanized Division diverted their attention Al-Rashiddeen, where they successfully cutoff all supply routes to the town on Wednesday.

Khan Al-‘Assal and Al-Rashiddeen are situated just north of the recently captured town of Khan Touman and just south of the Al-‘Amariyah District of the provincial capital.

Two years ago, the Islamist rebels from the Free Syrian Army (FSA) executed several Syrian Arab Army soldiers inside of Khan Al-‘Assal, marking one of the largest mass executions of the war.
 
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bajingan

Senior Member
According to Wall street journal, the US pursued secret contact with assad regime for years
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The Obama administration pursued secret communications with elements of Syria’s regime over several years in a failed attempt to limit violence and get President Bashar al-Assad to relinquish power, according to U.S. and Arab officials.

Early on, the U.S. looked for cracks in the regime it could exploit to encourage a military coup, but found few.

The efforts reflect how President
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’s administration has grappled to understand and interact with an opaque Middle East dictatorship run for 45 years by the Assad family.

Unlike the secret White House back channel to Iran, however, the Syria effort never gained momentum and communication was limited. This account is based on interviews with more than two dozen people, including current and former U.S. officials, Arab officials and diplomats. Most of these contacts haven’t been previously reported.

U.S. officials said communications with the regime came in fits and starts and were focused on specific issues. At times, senior officials spoke directly to each other and at others, they sent messages through intermediaries such as
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.

Mr. Assad tried at different times to reach out to the administration to say the U.S. should unite with him to fight terrorism.


in 2011, as the
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and soldiers began to peel away from the army, U.S. intelligence officials identified officers from Mr. Assad’s minority Alawite sect who potentially could lead a regime change, according to former U.S. officials and current European officials.

“The White House’s policy in 2011 was to get to the point of a transition in Syria by finding cracks in the regime and offering incentives for people to abandon Assad,” a former senior administration official said.

But regime cohesiveness held, and the crackdown continued.

In August 2011, Mr. Obama publicly called for Mr. Assad to step down.

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The administration’s
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from the U.S. line that Mr. Assad ultimately has to step down. But instead of persuading Mr. Assad to exit, the covert communications may have fed his sense of legitimacy and impunity.

That helped fuel the current
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in any settlement. It also hampered the effort to consolidate the international fight against Islamic State.

“We have had times where we’ve said: ‘You could create a better environment for cease-fires if you stop dropping barrel bombs,’ ” a senior U.S. official said. “There’s communicating on specific issues,” the official added. “It’s not like Cuba or Iran, where we thought that we would essentially, in a secret bilateral negotiation, resolve the issue.”

Questions sent to the office of Assad adviser Bouthaina Shaaban about communication with the Obama administration were unanswered.

Throughout the conflict, two core elements of the administration’s Syria strategy—political and military pressure on the Assad regime—often hit a wall, forcing repeated shifts in tactics.

“This is a regime that is very supple politically. They’re very smart,” said Robert Ford, former U.S. ambassador to Damascus. “They’re always testing for weaknesses and pushing the envelope.”

By the summer of 2012, the White House strategy of orchestrating regime change had failed. The U.S. moved to support the rebels, but the effort ramped up too slowly.

“Russia doubled down and Iran doubled down, and it didn’t really have an effect,” a former administration official said.

In the summer of 2012, the administration sent warnings, through Russian and Iranian officials, to Mr. Assad not to use chemical weapons on a large scale, U.S. officials have said.

U.S. officials also talked to Syrian counterparts directly. Deputy Secretary of State William Burns, who retired last year, made two phone calls to Syrian foreign minister Walid al-Moallem to relay the warnings, U.S. officials said.

Fearing Mr. Assad would still escalate, Mr. Obama drew a public red line on chemical weapons in August 2012. Despite the warnings, sarin attacks in August 2013 killed an estimated 1,400 people. And while Mr. Obama threatened military action in response, he instead cut a deal with the regime to
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.

For the next two years, Washington shifted its messaging to Damascus to focus on containing the conflict.

There was another reason to keep communication lines open: Five American citizens remain missing or in detention in Syria. Assistant Secretary of State Anne Patterson has talked with Syrian deputy foreign minister Faisal Mekdad at least twice about their fate.

The Obama administration later shifted gears back to diplomacy to get the Syrian government to the negotiating table.

At the center of that effort was a businessman and confidante of Mr. Assad, Khaled Ahmad, who has served as the Syrian leader’s main interlocutor in recent years with Western officials, including U.S. diplomats. Mr. Ahmad didn’t respond to questions sent by The Wall Street Journal.

“Assad was looking for ways to talk to the White House,” said Joshua Landis, a Syria expert and professor at the University of Oklahoma. Mr. Ahmad, a businessman from Homs province, was his point man.

In late 2013, the former ambassador to Damascus Mr. Ford—then a special administration envoy on Syria—met Mr. Ahmad in Geneva ahead of planned peace talks there. Mr. Ford told Mr. Ahmad the U.S. was still seeking a political transition away from Mr. Assad’s rule.

Mr. Ahmad countered that the U.S. and the West should help the Syrian government fight terrorism.

The rise of Islamic State in 2013 caught the U.S. administration off guard. Mr. Assad found in it a better opening to position himself as a partner in a fight against terror consuming the region, and rippling to the West.

By 2014, when the
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against the militants from Iraq to Syria, State Department officials were making phone calls to their counterparts at the Syrian foreign ministry to make sure Damascus steered clear of U.S. jets in Syrian skies, U.S. officials and others familiar the communications said.

Today, when Washington wants to notify Damascus where it is deploying U.S.-trained Syrian fighters to battle Islamic State so the fighters aren’t mistaken for rebels, Samantha Power, the U.S. envoy to the U.N., dispatches a deputy to talk to the Syrian envoy, Bashar Jaafari, these people said.

The White House says the notifications are not collaboration with the regime. But Mr. Assad has used them to his advantage.

“The regime was re-legitimized,” said Ibrahim Hamidi, a Syrian journalist who until 2013 ran the Damascus bureau for Al Hayat, a major pan-Arab newspaper. “Any communication with the U.S.—even the perception of it—gives them the upper hand.”

This spring, a former senior White House official, Steve Simon, met Mr. Assad in Damascus in a visit initiated and arranged by Mr. Ahmad.

Mr. Simon, who left the White House in 2014, had met Mr. Ahmad at least twice before the Damascus trip, which he portrayed to former colleagues and others as an individual initiative, not made on behalf of the government, according to several people familiar with the meetings.

Mr. Simon portrayed the trip to his former colleagues and others as an individual initiative, made in no formal administration capacity, in response to an invitation by Damascus, those familiar with the meetings said.

He notified former colleagues at the White House and State Department officials of his plans to meet the Syrian leader, these people said. He met former colleagues from the National Security Council, including senior director Robert Malley, before and after his meeting with Mr. Assad.

Mr. Simon outlined steps the regime could immediately take to generate goodwill with the international community: stop dropping barrel bombs; do more to fight Islamic State rather than antigovernment rebels; and cooperate with a United Nations-led effort for local cease-fires.

Mr. Assad responded with familiar talking points, focusing on his fight against terrorism. He showed some openness to local cease-fires on the government’s terms, two people familiar with the meeting said.

In the months that followed, a debate within the White House emerged on whether to redouble U.S.
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at the expense of the mission to go after the regime

Personally I wouldn't be surprised that after the end of Obama administration more "revelations" will surface, some of them might be explosive.
 
Call me cynic, but I somehow doubt gathering dead civilian bodies and planting them near the aftermath of air strikes, or even photographing and filming the aftermath of ISIS bombing and blaming it on the 'evil commie Red Russians' is beyond the likes of ISIS.

With the way most rebels are just firing heavy rockets in the general direction of the enemy, I would be amazed if they managed better accuracy than the Russian Air Force, even with free fall bombs.

Basically I see the 'activists' at best blaming everything that falls out of the sky as Russian air strikes, and at worst that many of these activities being active ISIS or sundry rebel members, who are deliberately faking or outright mounting false flag attacks to blame on the Russians in the hopes that it will create enough western pressure to make the Russia air strikes stop.

I think you would've been cynic if you had written the above text without actually opening the AI report
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By the way it also contains the part of the Russians allegedly using cluster munitions, and this part was also officially denied:
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"Russian Air Force does not use cluster bombs." ТАСС quoting the major-general from
https://www.sinodefenceforum.com/is...no-oped-no-policis.t6913/page-303#post-380618
EDIT
now I noticed the RT announcement
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of no cluster bombs in the Latakia Air Base

I think the Russian campaign will now be watched even more than before
(not by me though: no Internet until December 27 noon, due to the Christmas celebration/trip, not because I chickened :) am saying this for a hypothetical case you quoted me)
 
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janjak desalin

Junior Member
Breaking: Syrian Army Storms The Strategic Village Of Al-Sirmaniyah in Idlib
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on December 24, 2015
Moments ago in the Idlib Governorate’s western countryside, the Syrian Arab Army’s 45th Regiment of the 1st Armored Division – in coordination with the National Defense Forces (NDF) of Joureen and the Syrian Social Nationalist Party (SSNP) – launched a powerful assault on the strategic village of Al-Sirmaniyah after partially encircling it these past few weeks.

According to several field reports from the Al-Ghaab Plains, the Syrian Armed Forces are attacking Al-Sirmaniyah from the western flank while the Russian MI-24 Hind Helicopter Gunship bombards the Islamist rebels of Jaysh Al-Fateh (Army of Conquest) inside of this large village in western Idlib.
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janjak desalin

Junior Member
Islamist Rebels Fall Apart in Rural Damascus as The Syrian Army Enters Al-Nishabiyah And Captures The Signal Base
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on December 24, 2015

The last 10 days have not been kind to the Islamist rebels of Jaysh Al-islam (Army of Islam) inside the East Ghouta region of rural Damascus as they have conceded one of the most imperative sites in this area (Marj Al-Sultan Military Airport) to the Syrian Armed Forces after a series of violent firefights this past month.

Things did not appear to get any better for the Islamist rebels on Wednesday; in fact, the situation became even worse after the Syrian Arab Army’s 102nd Brigade and the 416 Regiment of the Republican Guard seized several small farms that were situated to the west of the Marj Al-Sultan Military Airport in the East Ghouta.

Following the capture of the western and northern farms around Marj Al-Sultan Military Airport, the Syrian Arab Army’s Republican Guard forces entered the small village of Al-Nishabiyah in the East Ghouta, killing a confirmed 27 enemy combatants from Jaysh Al-Islam and Jabhat Al-Nusra in the process.

As a result of their advance to Al-Nishabiyah, the Syrian Armed Forces have now reached the central part of the East Ghouta, marking the first time in over three years that the latter has seen these poultry farms.

Earlier this morning, the Syrian Arab Army’s 102nd Brigade of the Republican Guard announced that they captured the Signal Base near the village of Al-Nishabiyah after a violent battle with Jabhat Al-Nusra.

In addition to reaching the central part of the East Ghouta, the Syrian Armed Forces have successfully advanced north towards the strategic city of Harasta, where they are currently engaged in a fierce battle with Jaysh Al-Islam for control of the Industrial District.
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janjak desalin

Junior Member
For all that might not have seen this, it is an example of the ways in which religious rituals, performances to which humans have historically been drawn and influenced by, are used to legitimate campaigns committed to all that is unholy. In all of its mesmerizing, poetic, serenity, it is intended to inspire and justify all manner of inhumanities.

 
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