How to cope with decreasing of export/demand for chinese goods.

antimatter said:

Also, let's face it, it's not just quality and excellence issue. Even if China can make equal in quality in products, they will never fully accepted in the western world. Why, too long history of China Bashing has created China as a PC incorrect term as producer of high valued items. For example, I just don't see CHina made cars as mainstream luxury cars in the future in the western world.

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Who told you this? Its more than possible to correct this image has it did with Japan---Japan bashing was from the '30s to the '90s and still has some today; with Korea, Hong Kong and Taiwan. Not too long ago, the Japanese was never considered how they would compete with the likes of Cadillac; back in the sixties and seventies, even BMW and Mercedes Benz wasn't even the brand names they were today.

There is a reason why china (as in porcelain) is called china when the Europeans imported quantities of it from the Qing Dynasty. And a reason why "Ming Dynasty" has become synonymous with the ultra expensive porcelain antiques the high and mighty would collect. And for a millennia and a half, the Chinese export product was high end, and concentrated on three things---porcelain, silk and tea---all the stuff the British would kill for.

Chinese government is clearly aiming for the higher value ladder, allowing toy factories to fail while assisting more higher tech efforts. And China is actually trying to make their own fab equipment now, but of course, they have to start with the bottom end.

China is quite capable of very high quality control. The problem is business principles. Too many companies are aiming for the short term, not looking to build long term relationships on trust, brand and image quality. The result of being greedy and looking too much for the short term is the phenomenon known as quality fade. Quality fade happened to the Detroit auto industry, and as a result, have never fully outlived the consequences of this.

Have you ever heard the saying "They don't build them like they used to anymore?"

It was a saying that started growing root in the late sixties, particularly in reference to American made cars.

Quality fade is as common as your next door restaurant. Lets say a new restaurant opens. To give a good impression at the start, the food is good, and quantities are generous. The restaurant gets to establish its name and image, and becomes successful.

However in the long run, either management gets greedy or operating costs gets too high, or both, and so the restaurant starts to trim things around the corners. Quality meat is replaced by less expensive meat. Cheaper cooks are hired. Serving quantities are reduced slightly around the edges. And so on and on. Gradually the restaurant loses its image and the customers decline.

Chinese companies as a whole need to resist the temptation for quality fade and need to view things in the long term. The successful companies like Haier and Lenovo are doing just that, improving every generation of product even as something as mundane as washing machines. But what about the rest of the economy?

As you can see, quality fade and control isn't something the government can regulate. The government can set standards but that is all. The rest has to go with the management of these companies. This is a question that can only be dealt in the heart and mind of the Chinese entrepreneur.

It's just my gut feeling. China believes certain values not shared by the mainstream western folks and its followers therefore, it will influence people's preference of choice. Unless chinese goods equal in quality but at half price. But that's asking too much.

Anyways, quality issue is secondary, the more important thing is restructure their current education system into more of R&D driven system, forming the academic-industry-military-government complex.

Government would foster the industry to provide low cost but yet high precision equipments, tools to enabling the academic system into R&D capable which in return would make industry and military more competitive.

Therefore bring its overall competitiveness into new level. Has something revulationary. The old style of school and education system in China needs to revolutionized. It ain't going to work anymore.

I agree with Tam here. The notion that the flow of foreign goods into China ought to be restricted is flat out ridiculous. Don't you understand that to successfully produce, market, and sell their products, foreign firms would have to establish manufacturing centers, local corporate offices and relationships with local distributors or establish their own distribution centers? All these things mean jobs, either service jobs or manufacturing jobs. So trying to conjure the image of foreign corporations as bloodsuckers fails.

The service industry jobs created by the introduction of these foreign firms is critical to transforming China from a manufacturing based economy that is sensitive to the global economic climate to one that is less exposed. Service sector jobs may also mean better allocation of wages, giving the Chinese consumer greater purchasing power. Consumerism is good and isolationism is bad.

antimatter said:

It's just my gut feeling. China believes certain values not shared by the mainstream western folks and its followers therefore, it will influence people's preference of choice. Unless chinese goods equal in quality but at half price. But that's asking too much.

Anyways, quality issue is secondary, the more important thing is restructure their current education system into more of R&D driven system, forming the academic-industry-military-government complex.

Government would foster the industry to provide low cost but yet high precision equipments, tools to enabling the academic system into R&D capable which in return would make industry and military more competitive.

Therefore bring its overall competitiveness into new level. Has something revulationary. The old style of school and education system in China needs to revolutionized. It ain't going to work anymore.

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A consumer's choice will have less and less to do with culture, because foreign competition are responding very fast to local tastes and needs, which are pretty universal to start with, like cars, computers and such. China's biggest problem while trying to sell some complexed products oversees is establish a reputation for quality and conforming to local regulatory environments. Steps are made in that direction as Chinese brands like Lenove establish themselves and creates information spillover that will have a positive impact on the overall image of Chinese goods.

Many here have already agreed the western arms embargo has done wonder for the chinese domestic developement. Had the embargo not there, china would buy all kinds of foreign arms, and would be too lazy to develope their own. They have never achieve the kind of self reliance as we witnessed today.

Therefore same for consumer hardwares. Need to promote local and domestic built ones.

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I have mentioned many many times already don't invest in those lame oversea financial institutions. They have no value at all.

Instead China should invest in its academic-industry-military complex.
of course, buy its own locally made hardwares.

antimatter said:

Many here have already agreed the western arms embargo has done wonder for the chinese domestic developement. Had the embargo not there, china would buy all kinds of foreign arms, and would be too lazy to develope their own. They have never achieve the kind of self reliance as we witnessed today.

Therefore same for consumer hardwares. Need to promote local and domestic built ones.

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Failed again. China not only bought foreign arms, they bought them in massive quantity from Russia. But that's a total non sequitor because you are talking about cutting edge technological projects with high fixed costs that often have to be financed by governments. Consumer goods do not need government subsidies to research and develop. And foreign ventures not only add competition to the domestic market, but also bring in the latest technologies and management know-hows. The kind of isolationism that you are proposing not only get rid of all that, but would inevitably end all Chinese exports to foreign countries, thus having a devastating impact on the economy, and cut China off from global financing, without which Chinese firms could hardly have the ability to expand their operations, expand their markets, or improve their processes. So yeah, fail.

FugitiveVisions said:

Failed again. China not only bought foreign arms, they bought them in massive quantity from Russia. But that's a total non sequitor because you are talking about cutting edge technological projects with high fixed costs that often have to be financed by governments. Consumer goods do not need government subsidies to research and develop. And foreign ventures not only add competition to the domestic market, but also bring in the latest technologies and management know-hows. The kind of isolationism that you are proposing not only get rid of all that, but would inevitably end all Chinese exports to foreign countries, thus having a devastating impact on the economy, and cut China off from global financing, without which Chinese firms could hardly have the ability to expand their operations, expand their markets, or improve their processes. So yeah, fail.

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Let's face it, China bought a few SU-27 and Kilos so they can reverse engineer. as evidented by the J-11B and Yuan. As of 2008, China doesn't want to buy anymore from Russia.

Likewise in consumer goods, just buy a few for reverse engineering.
And incorporate into its indegenous design.

Some would say it won't provide IP proection and discourage innovation. Of course. The research under its academic-industry-military complex would have its own patents and protect by its governemnt.

China should buy stuffs that enhance its R&D capability. ANything else is more or less unimportant and live without.

So, it's constantly keep updating itself in terms R&D capbility. I don't consider that as isolation.

antimatter said:

Let's face it, China bought a few SU-27 and Kilos so they can reverse engineer. as evidented by the J-11B and Yuan. As of 2008, China doesn't want to buy anymore from Russia.

Likewise in consumer goods, just buy a few for reverse engineering.
And incorporate into its indegenous design.

Some would say it won't provide IP proection and discourage innovation. Of course. The research under its academic-industry-military complex would have its own patents and protect by its governemnt.

China should buy stuffs that enhance its R&D capability. ANything else is more or less unimportant and live without.

So, it's constantly keep updating itself in terms R&D capbility. I don't consider that as isolation.

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I find it funny that you are using conjunctions like so, as if your postings present a logical flow. It does not.

Your notion that China needs to buy consumer goods first in order to reverse engineer them is :roll:. Are you telling me the Chinese can't produce toothbrushes without having to first buy them from Colgate? :roll:

Oh, and let's not forget about letting the 'academic-industry-military' complex control everything. Sure, nothing wrong with that at all....