F-35 Joint Strike Fighter News, Videos and pics Thread

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

The ability to carry external load is very important for a strike fighter. Considering that one of the planes the F-35 was going to replace was the A-10 a heavy weapons load will come in handy once air dominance has been achieved.
And in conditions where air dominance or even superiority is challeneged, a flight of four attack aircraft with external loads, could be escorted by 2-4 aircraft loaded with A2A all in their internal bays to maximize their stealth and allow them to amply defend the ground pounders.
 

MiG-29

Banned Idiot
re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

The ability to carry external load is very important for a strike fighter. Considering that one of the planes the F-35 was going to replace was the A-10 a heavy weapons load will come in handy once air dominance has been achieved.
in the opinion of the designer of A-10, F-35 won`t be able to replace it

[video=youtube;UQB4W8C0rZI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQB4W8C0rZI[/video]

But i think as a fighter will be okay
 

IronsightSniper

Junior Member
re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

I'd disagree. The largest compromise the F-35 as a ground attack fighter has to make is that if you want more payload, you'd need to use external stores, which in turn "diminishes" it's stealth capabilities to say the least, and because I doubt the F-35 is built as tough as the A-10, survivability wise, the F-35 can't stack up to the A-10. But, being a multi-role (that's understating it) fighter, of course this is the part where I talk about compromises being made which you've probably heard about in every F-35 thread or report possible. But in any case, it'd do fine in ground attack, it wouldn't replace the A-10 in every criteria, but there's no doubt in my mind that it can do about as much things as the A-10 did.
 

Air Force Brat

Brigadier
Super Moderator
re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

I'd agree with the Headmaster, just as long as those 2-4 are Raptors. That in all honesty is how the team was supposed to play the game. The Raptor establishes the Air Superiority necessary for the F-35 to do its job, the F-35 will have a difficult time with some of its potential adversaries in the 4.5 gen which have a kinematic advantage over the Eagle, Falcon, and Hornet, and schools still out on the F-35 in the A2A role. The only true fifth gen ,supermaneuverability, supercruise, and stealth will likely remain the F-22, I'm quite certain that Jeff agrees the Raptor should be returned to production immediately, so that it could remain the ace up our sleeve, even if just in low rate production to keep the line open. The old saw was a bird in hand is better than two in the bush, has never been more apprapo.
 

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

I'd agree with the Headmaster, just as long as those 2-4 are Raptors. That in all honesty is how the team was supposed to play the game. The Raptor establishes the Air Superiority necessary for the F-35 to do its job, the F-35 will have a difficult time with some of its potential adversaries in the 4.5 gen which have a kinematic advantage over the Eagle, Falcon, and Hornet, and schools still out on the F-35 in the A2A role. The only true fifth gen ,supermaneuverability, supercruise, and stealth will likely remain the F-22, I'm quite certain that Jeff agrees the Raptor should be returned to production immediately, so that it could remain the ace up our sleeve, even if just in low rate production to keep the line open. The old saw was a bird in hand is better than two in the bush, has never been more apprapo.
I do agree.

We need a lot more Raptors than 187 or whatever the rediculous low number is. We need on the order of 400-500 at the least, IMHO. Sadly, we will definitely have to wait for a new adminisytration and congress for that to happen.

With that number there would be enough to go around for the F-22 to provide the air superiority and dominance they were meant to provide.

If we stay at this low level, then the F-35s are going to have to use their own in the A2A role, and all stealthed up with the missiles in their internal bays to provide the same.

The Raptors would be much more effective...but if they have to do it, the F-35s will work ..they will have to. I believe they are stealthy enough, have good enough manuervability, have excellent targeting, and with some AMRAAMs and AIM-9Xs will do the trick. The Air Force intends to use them in the A2A role, as does the Navy...but there is no question that the Raptor is better and coud and should provide that coverage in any Joint Operation.

I'd love to see a carrier version of the F-22 developed for the Navy's air superiority, fleet defense aircraft. An F-22 coupled with a new AIM-155A ALRAAM (Advanced Long Range Air to Air Missile) would regain what we lost (and more) when we retired the F-14 and the Phoenix. Lacking that, the NAvy could resurrect the loser in the ATF competition and use the YF-23 as the starting point. She was and is a very good aircraft as well, and I'd love to see her flying in numbers. but the F-22 would be the better logistical answer for the long run.
 

cn_habs

Junior Member
re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

I do agree.

We need a lot more Raptors than 187 or whatever the rediculous low number is. We need on the order of 400-500 at the least, IMHO. Sadly, we will definitely have to wait for a new adminisytration and congress for that to happen.

With that number there would be enough to go around for the F-22 to provide the air superiority and dominance they were meant to provide.

If we stay at this low level, then the F-35s are going to have to use their own in the A2A role, and all stealthed up with the missiles in their internal bays to provide the same.

The Raptors would be much more effective...but if they have to do it, the F-35s will work ..they will have to. I believe they are stealthy enough, have good enough manuervability, have excellent targeting, and with some AMRAAMs and AIM-9Xs will do the trick. The Air Force intends to use them in the A2A role, as does the Navy...but there is no question that the Raptor is better and coud and should provide that coverage in any Joint Operation.

I'd love to see a carrier version of the F-22 developed for the Navy's air superiority, fleet defense aircraft. An F-22 coupled with a new AIM-155A ALRAAM (Advanced Long Range Air to Air Missile) would regain what we lost (and more) when we retired the F-14 and the Phoenix. Lacking that, the NAvy could resurrect the loser in the ATF competition and use the YF-23 as the starting point. She was and is a very good aircraft as well, and I'd love to see her flying in numbers. but the F-22 would be the better logistical answer for the long run.

How are you gonna achieve it without borrowing from others?

How about getting socialites like Romney to pay a little bit more than 15% of income tax? How about banning those 20 000 lobbyists from buying politicians for the sake of 1%? For instance, the contract that the Canadian government signed with LM is a freaking joke to begin with yet the Conservatives want to keep up their promise to further increase national debt to purchase a single-engined fighter with limited internal payload to patrol the wild Canadian Arctic.

There's no such thing as spending responsibly to ease the tax burden on the middle class which most of us belong. I can't believe I'll be pulling 60 hours/week so some Canadian and American politicians can work hard for the military-industrial complex.
 
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Air Force Brat

Brigadier
Super Moderator
re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

Well said master Jeff, A+, I think most folks flying off the b....I mean Ship, ahem..cough, would much prefer twin engines and a little more top end with supercruise. The real beauty of the raptor is the ability to ingress and egress the ops area with a real world supercruise and outstanding stealth. The other advantage is the A2A once you have launched your weapons and made your presence known. I'm sure a lot of naval aviators miss the Turkey, as it also had a lot of real world speed, albeit took lots of fuel, it does appear that J-20 and T-50 will have a decisive advantage on top end and possible supercruise and the T-50 will have that Sukhoi magic agility, not so sure about the J-20 in that regard, the F-35 might still be in the game. So while we are playing "aircraft designer, how about the A, with the Cs larger wing and control surfaces, although the A has supposedly been to 9.9 gs positive, it may be more manueverable than I had assumed? In conclusion the AFmagazine has noted the F-35 carrying external ordinance, the pic shows the fix for the horizontal stabs, and is available as a screensaver, on the daily report today!
 

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

How are you gonna achieve it without borrowing from others?

How about getting socialites like Romney to pay a little bit more than 15% of income tax? How about banning those 20 000 lobbyists from buying politicians for the sake of 1%?
I indicated it would take a change in admin and congress. And it will.

People like Romney are not the problem. He paid his legal amount on his capital gains which he made with money that had already been taxed at the highest income rate...ie. double taxation.

If the US opens up its vast oil fields, if it makes the environment for business more attractve by lowering coprporate rates, if it removes a lot of the burdensome regulation, then the prosperity will sky rocket and we will afford to do what we have to do...in fact we could move a long way in that direction by simply not throwing some many billions down rat holes like studies of the mating habits of certain species of worms and so many other federal grant, entitlement, and waste programs that politicians ear mark for their own political purposes.

But now we're getting political and it would be best not to go there in any case because that is not what this forum is about. You can rant about that on a political forum. This is a defense forum, particularly sino defense, but with areas for the rest of world too, like this thread.

However it ends up being paid for, and clearly it would have to be paid for before it could happen, the US could and should buy more F-22s. The things cost so much a piece because the government ended up changing the terms under which the aircraft was developed and purchased. A lot of expensive high technology had to be developed and under the original contract and ROI all of that would have been paid back over 1000 aircraft...when you only build 187 the cost per plane goes way up to achieve the return on investment and it is not the fault of the manufacturer.

Anyhow, I stand by it. The F-22 is the premier air superiority fighter and to maintain that over any hostile battlefield it would be good to have more of them so the F-35B can do the job it was designed for principally, that is supporting Marines on the ground

Well said master Jeff, A+, I think most folks flying off the b....I mean Ship, ahem..cough, would much prefer twin engines and a little more top end with supercruise. The real beauty of the raptor is the ability to ingress and egress the ops area with a real world supercruise and outstanding stealth. The other advantage is the A2A once you have launched your weapons and made your presence known. I'm sure a lot of naval aviators miss the Turkey, as it also had a lot of real world speed, albeit took lots of fuel, it does appear that J-20 and T-50 will have a decisive advantage on top end and possible supercruise and the T-50 will have that Sukhoi magic agility, not so sure about the J-20 in that regard, the F-35 might still be in the game. So while we are playing "aircraft designer, how about the A, with the Cs larger wing and control surfaces, although the A has supposedly been to 9.9 gs positive, it may be more manueverable than I had assumed? In conclusion the AFmagazine has noted the F-35 carrying external ordinance, the pic shows the fix for the horizontal stabs, and is available as a screensaver, on the daily report today!
A navalized F-22 with a new 150 nm ALRAAM, able to carry six of them in the main bay and (ultimately) four AIM-9x in the two side bays (2 per pay with the newer AIM-9x IR missiles) for a total of ten missiles.

Stealth is maintained and with a data link back to the new Super Hawkeyes whose radar return could guide the missiles, what a lethal combo that becomes with the F-22 able to potentially launch those fire and forget long range missiles without every going active.

With the legs the F-22 has and that load out, the Navy's fleet defense role would be reinstituted in spades and once again realize the policy and capability of downing incoming AsuM carriers (attack aircraft) before they get in range to launch.
 
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Air Force Brat

Brigadier
Super Moderator
re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

Yes, its quite amazing that Mr. Bush had a veep and two sec defs who didn't seem to think airsuperiority was critical, we really can't blame Mr Gates on BHO, and it was Mr. Gates who killed the F-22, in order to protect the F-35. Seems he thought the F-35 was good enough, how interesting that the PLAAF flew the J-20 for the first time during his visit.LOL I believe, someone correct me if I'm wrong, that no US forces have come under air assault since 1953. That only happens when you maintain air superiority, seems that we keep having to learn those lessons. IMHO the minimum number of Raptors for an optimum team would be 500, since it seems that the F-35 will be very close in price to the Raptor, and its behind in any respect, reopening and maintaining the Raptor line should be a no brainer. There were a suprising number of people, who were surprised with Pak-Fa and Jxx.
 

IronsightSniper

Junior Member
re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

How are you gonna achieve it without borrowing from others?

How about getting socialites like Romney to pay a little bit more than 15% of income tax? How about banning those 20 000 lobbyists from buying politicians for the sake of 1%? For instance, the contract that the Canadian government signed with LM is a freaking joke to begin with yet the Conservatives want to keep up their promise to further increase national debt to purchase a single-engined fighter with limited internal payload to patrol the wild Canadian Arctic.

There's no such thing as spending responsibly to ease the tax burden on the middle class which most of us belong. I can't believe I'll be pulling 60 hours/week so some Canadian and American politicians can work hard for the military-industrial complex.

Is there some myth out there that the U.S. can't generate our own capital :eek:

@Jeff, I'd hate to disagree, but I think the question is do we really want to get in another damned arms race? I don't mind funding research and development projects for the heck of it, but do we really need to procure everything new? Just because China has some new missile that might threaten U.S. dominance in the Pacific does that mean we should hold everything and find a way to counter that? Because China's gonna eventually overtake us in economic power, there's no doubt about that, and once you have enough money, as the old slogan goes, what can't you do? Well, unless one can't overtake the U.S. military in global dominance is one of the things that you can't do, there's no reason to say that China wouldn't eventually overtake us there too. So, before I sound too much like a defeatist, why even compete? Why not just save our money and do some RnD so that we can get decades ahead of everyone else?
 
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