Europe Refugee Crisis

plawolf

Lieutenant General
Actually I can see why it can get a little confusing to those who are not familiar with the UK and EU benefits system, which the article did not explain at all.

That article also should have also made it clear that Britain would need large, non-EU, non-refugee migrants to achieve its planned budget surplus.

Non-EU, non-refugee migrants are only allowed to come into the UK if they have a job, make a large enough investment in the UK, or are self funding for study etc. That is a big source of income for the government, and a big cash injection for the UK economy as a whole (which through the multiplier effect, generates even more economic activity, and produces even more taxes).

These migrants still have to pay most taxes (but can claim some back under some circumstances), just like everyone else. However, they get no social or medical benefits if they fall on hard times - the UK government will just show them the door to the nearest airport or port.

That is the UK getting a lot of tax payers (who are overwhelmingly wealthy and/or work in well paid jobs, which are usually taxed more and generally spend more than the national average) that they effectively don't have to spend any money on, since those people cannot claim any of the social or medical benefits which eat up the lion share of the UK government's budget.

They also cannot vote, and get little public sympathy from UK citizens, which is why the UK (and most other western) governments can get away with.
 
while Mrs. Merkel is waiting for the Nobel Peace Price
Asylum deportations set to double in 2015
Almost twice as many people have been deported from Germany in 2015 so far after having their asylum applications rejected compared with the previous year.

By the end of November, there had been 18,363 deportations of failed asylum seekers, Interior Ministry documents seen by DPA showed.

That was almost twice as many as 2014, when there were 10,884 deportations during the entire year.

And some states were far more active than others.

Bavaria deported more than three times as many people this year as last year, at 3,643 compared with 1,007 in 2014.

And Hesse was close to a factor of three as well, sending 2,306 people back to their countries of origin versus 829 last year.

The only state to see fewer deportations than last year was Thuringia, at 152 in 2015 compared with 234 in 2014.

Germany's federal states, which are responsible for processing asylum applications, drastically stepped up deportation efforts over the course of the year in a bid to show concerned voters they had flows of refugees into the country under control.

That's why in the first four months of the year there were only 4,508 deportations, with the figure ramping up drastically as time went on.

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, Chancellor Angela Merkel balanced a call for her party to back her refugee policy with a commitment to remove those denied asylum, saying that the country must prioritize those in greatest need.

There are now
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, a Bavarian official confirmed recently.
 

solarz

Brigadier
while Mrs. Merkel is waiting for the Nobel Peace Price
Asylum deportations set to double in 2015

As the saying goes, there are lies, damn lies, and statistics.

We've all read news that Germany is settling in a lot of refugees, and part of that process is to "crack down" on asylum applicants that are deemed to be illegitimate. Let's not kid ourselves, there are probably far more refugee scammers than real refugees. It's only a failure of bureaucacy that these people are allowed to tie up government resources.
 

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
As the saying goes, there are lies, damn lies, and statistics.

We've all read news that Germany is settling in a lot of refugees, and part of that process is to "crack down" on asylum applicants that are deemed to be illegitimate. Let's not kid ourselves, there are probably far more refugee scammers than real refugees. It's only a failure of bureaucacy that these people are allowed to tie up government resources.
Also, when two and three times as many people seek asylum/refugee status in a given year, you can bet that there will probably be 3x if not more application rejections.

It's simple math and the law of averages.
 
Also, when two and three times as many people seek asylum/refugee status in a given year, you can bet that there will probably be 3x if not more application rejections.

It's simple math and the law of averages.

yeah this is what politicians tried to make it look like, according to that article ("That's why in the first four months of the year there were only 4,508 deportations, with the figure ramping up drastically as time went on."):

2014 month-average 10884/12=907
first four months of 2015 month-average 4508/4=1127
January - November of 2015 month-average 18363/11=1669

BUT I had been waiting for the arrival of the train with my mother-in-law on board and decided to check the numbers to kill time, and oops, I realized many migrants stayed in Germany without making the claim! (of what I think is officially called
First time asylum applicant
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and to what pertain the figures above)
How many? I hope the Germans know! but it's more than one million according to the BBC
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plus there're "more than 315,000" of these First time asylum applicants (as this figure corresponds to the Eurostat data I was initially checking)

Question: How many out of that one million people have been extradited??
(you know me, my guess is: none! :)

Or has I misunderstood something? I admit I didn't read
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delft

Brigadier
yeah this is what politicians tried to make it look like, according to that article ("That's why in the first four months of the year there were only 4,508 deportations, with the figure ramping up drastically as time went on."):

2014 month-average 10884/12=907
first four months of 2015 month-average 4508/4=1127
January - November of 2015 month-average 18363/11=1669

BUT I had been waiting for the arrival of the train with my mother-in-law on board and decided to check the numbers to kill time, and oops, I realized many migrants stayed in Germany without making the claim! (of what I think is officially called
First time asylum applicant
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

and to what pertain the figures above)
How many? I hope the Germans know! but it's more than one million according to the BBC
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

plus there're "more than 315,000" of these First time asylum applicants (as this figure corresponds to the Eurostat data I was initially checking)

Question: How many out of that one million people have been extradited??
(you know me, my guess is: none! :)

Or has I misunderstood something? I admit I didn't read
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I didn't read it either. The English nor the German version appeared when I tried to download them. Are they too large?
 

delft

Brigadier
I didn't read it either. The English nor the German version appeared when I tried to download them. Are they too large?
Correction. Perhaps too many people tried to download from the Bundesamt, but I got it at a Saksen state site. It is a mere 27 pages.
 
... It is a mere 27 pages.
any comments, delft?

a moment ago I became aware of the article
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but I'm dependent on its Czech (or google) translation, so just the title
"Have only ten per cent of the refugees controlled"
and one sentence:
"According to estimates of GdP only around 25 to 30 percent of those entering from Austria individuals carry a passport or other proof of identity with them."

could it freaking true??
 

Scratch

Captain
a moment ago I became aware of the article
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but I'm dependent on its Czech (or google) translation, so just the title
"Have only ten per cent of the refugees controlled"
and one sentence:
"According to estimates of GdP only around 25 to 30 percent of those entering from Austria individuals carry a passport or other proof of identity with them."

could it freaking true??


Jura, the article is indeed quoting a leading member to the union of the police, stating (at the height of the influx in late summer / autumn I think) a mere 10% of people entering were properly registered, i.e. fingerprints taken and so on. (I think there were up to around 10.000 people a day)
Since November, the total number of immigrants has been decreasing rather sharply which should lessen the issue. However, since there were absolutely no resources available to track those unaccounted for, noone can really tell were a large amount of the people went. There are additional controlls in the refugee camps and regularly unregistered ones pop up.

I guess it's also rather common practice to have lost your passport, because you can not be sent back anywhere, and authorities are in a much more difficult position to proof your from a country were there's likely no proper reason to be a refugee.

Also I guess quiet a few are on the move with fake passports, i.e. stolen syrian blanks.

For 2016, the 16 german states calculate with a cost of €17Billion for provision of the refugees, based on 800.000 people. Although we know we're most likely well beyond one million.
 
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