EU Navy Combined Fleet: Views & News

I went through the numbers quickly to keep this relevant. Mostly using wiki, which I think is pretty accurate since every (de)commisioning is quickly updated by someone.

For active / in service numbers I get 188 right now, including light frigates and corvettes, but excluding FACs.
There's more Horizons & FREMMs coming online right now, as are Type214s, on the other hand there's several older light frigates/corvettes leaving active duty.

Scratch said:

I went through the numbers quickly to keep this relevant. Mostly using wiki, which I think is pretty accurate since every (de)commisioning is quickly updated by someone.

For active / in service numbers I get 188 right now, including light frigates and corvettes, but excluding FACs.
There's more Horizons & FREMMs coming online right now, as are Type214s, on the other hand there's several older light frigates/corvettes leaving active duty.

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Add Portugal, Norway, and Sweden in there. They all have some significant naval combatants that should be a part of the list.

Look back to my initial post on this thread...if you take out the decommissioned vessels from that list, add the newly commissioned since it was posted, and add in those other nations, you will come out to a number very close to what was there at the time.

If you can...add those. If not, I will update my data base upon which that initial post was made, and then put out another one including those three nations next week.

Scratch just quick look for submarines only UK and France numbers are

UK
7 x SSN ( 6 as of now 2 x Astute and 4 x Trafalgar Class)
And 4 x SSBN ( 4 x Vanguard Class)

France
6 x SSN
and 4 x SSBN

For subs, I deliberately left out SSBNs, as they wouldn't serve a dedicated role in any conventional conflict. I also count ships currently active, which is why I have 6 for the UK.

Quickly adding in the navies as Jeff suggested indeed raises the number to 217 for now, that's quiet a good number, although it includes several older light frigates & corvettes that only carry medium sized guns and perhaps some minor missiles. Still, really not too bad.

Scratch said:

For subs, I deliberately left out SSBNs, as they wouldn't serve a dedicated role in any conventional conflict. I also count ships currently active, which is why I have 6 for the UK.

Quickly adding in the navies as Jeff suggested indeed raises the number to 217 for now, that's quiet a good number, although it includes several older light frigates & corvettes that only carry medium sized guns and perhaps some minor missiles. Still, really not too bad.

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Jawohl!

The combined Eurpean Navy, if ever driven to fully unite, would be a significant force to reckon with.

Many DDGs, SSNs and SSks that are very modern and powerful.

And once the two UK CVs are added to the French CVN and the Italian CVLs, they could end up with five decent Carrier Strike Groups too.

Scratch said:

For subs, I deliberately left out SSBNs, as they wouldn't serve a dedicated role in any conventional conflict. I also count ships currently active, which is why I have 6 for the UK.

Quickly adding in the navies as Jeff suggested indeed raises the number to 217 for now, that's quiet a good number, although it includes several older light frigates & corvettes that only carry medium sized guns and perhaps some minor missiles. Still, really not too bad.

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sigh. Royal navy without carriers and is not the best in Europe anymore it seems.

KingLouis said:

sigh. Royal navy without carriers and is not the best in Europe anymore it seems.

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Someone needs to update that chart, the Royal Navy is getting TWO Elizabeth Class carriers in the near future.

KingLouis said:

sigh. Royal navy without carriers and is not the best in Europe anymore it seems.

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Yes, but they arguably have the best Euopean DDGs and the most of them, and they have the best SSNs and the most of them too. Their 13 FFGs are also very, very good, particularly in ASW, and they are also the most numerous (tied with Greece).

I would say that the RN is right near the best, possibly only France, being stronger overall.

But, when the RN adds the two QE Carriers they will be right back on top.

KingLouis said:

sigh. Royal navy without carriers and is not the best in Europe anymore it seems.

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RN has been in a slow but steady decline but one thing you must remember is the strength of RN lies in its experience and knowledge it has accumulated over the many many decades of operations and when it comes to submarine operations can stand toe to toe against any navy of the world it was UK that had the job to blockade any Soviet breakout into the deep Atlantic and they had every Soviet ship tagged trust me

If RN had a free hand during Falklands War they would have probably have sunk every major Argentinian naval vessel using its nuclear submarines, HMS Conquerer was just one engagement that was authorised from London the sub surface fleet did not engage in unrestricted warfare

RN sails supreme in sub surface warfare and the surface units are also now catching up with Harpoon integrated on the Type 45 DDG is very welcome but yes I do agree the absent of carriers in the last 3 decades has left a really big hole in the carrier capabilitys

Well, Equation, the QE is exspected to achieve IOC in 2020 and the PoW thereafter, that's over 5 years from now until the first carrier. I don't realy consider that near future.

While some british aviators fly aboard US navy LHDs / LHAs I think, those 7 or so years without a carrier unfortunately still provide ample time for the skills to atrophy.

So I think in the early 2020s, when there was some time of operational training with the new carriers, and also coinciding with the arrival of the new Type26s, then the RN will be able to reclaim her status as a supreme international force. I mean not that their really second tier right now, but without any ship born fixed wing aviation, they simply do lack the tools to put their skills to work.

On a side note, something we haven't really talked about so far, I hope until then the RN also has figured out their MPA issue.