EU Navy Combined Fleet: Views & News

TerraN_EmpirE said:

then they made the call of trading New Amsterdam (New York) for Suriname, It all went downhill from there.

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What a connection! At first I thought you were kidding but checked on the history of Surinam and you probably referred to quote,
During the negotiations, the English commissioners (Denzil Holles and Henry Coventry) offered to return New Netherland in exchange for their sugar factories on the coast of Surinam[citation needed], that had been taken by Abraham Crijnssen earlier in 1667.
end of quote

off-topic (I can't resist, shows how the world is changing completely comes from the same wikipedia article): "In the East Indies, the Dutch secured a worldwide monopoly on nutmeg by forcing England to give up their claim on Run, the most remote of the Banda Islands."

TerraN_EmpirE said:

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As it stands today EU nato could be viewed as having the second largest Navy in the World.
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When do you think China will take over, 15 years from now maybe??

That Jara depends on how many they build vs how long the Europeans retain there total carrier force for. The first European carrier to hit retirement is likely the Italian carrier Garibaldi, she was commissioned in 1981. If the Italian navy builds a replacement, then I figure a tie. As I don't see the PLA needing more them 5 carriers max. however the Italians or another European navy Like the French Navy commissioning a second carrier or maybe the Germans opening a carrier program have to replace Garibaldi with a new carrier If they dont then China might take the two spot, but again there is a If. That if is if they invest in five carriers. The question for the PRC is one of time. The PRC is in a race against time. Most projections of the population show China on a downward spiral of population in the next thirty years. With somewhere around fourty years from now the population of the PRC being roughly equivalent to the current American population. That's a major shift and historically its almost impossible to maintain the same level of economic growth and development with a major population decline. This would effect the entire political and military standing of China, and causes any predictions about a future Chinese dominant geopolitical shift to be questioned. So the If's. If China can keep her standing, If Europe can keep her carriers.
personally I think they will end up with a tie. With Russia eventually taking number three on carriers.

TerraN_EmpirE said:

... As I don't see the PLA needing more them 5 carriers max. however the Italians or another European navy Like the French Navy commissioning a second carrier or maybe the Germans opening a carrier program have to replace Garibaldi with a new carrier ...

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I didn't dare to put Germany on my list! (post #6 here) TerraN_Empire, in Central Europe, the issue of the German military (and its previous achievements) is still VERY sensitive ... but technically it'd be possible, I guess, and they could easily afford one or two, wait, what about the names ... Graf Zeppelin, of course, and ... Tirpitz maybe LOL

Its a wildcard I'll grant you. But that's the critical factor I see for Europe on that. They have to maintain or expand the numbers of carriers if they wish to maintain readiness. The only way to do that is to replace the carriers that are beyond there service life. As it stands though England seems satisfied to add two QE2's the next two likely to have the money are France or Germany. Italy is a fairly poor state. Its a miracle they can operate one carrier. Keeping two is defined as Devine intervention in my book.

TerraN_EmpirE said:

Its a wildcard I'll grant you. But that's the critical factor I see for Europe on that. They have to maintain or expand the numbers of carriers if they wish to maintain readiness. The only way to do that is to replace the carriers that are beyond there service life. As it stands though England seems satisfied to add two QE2's the next two likely to have the money are France or Germany. Italy is a fairly poor state. Its a miracle they can operate one carrier. Keeping two is defined as Devine intervention in my book.

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A thought occurred to me: to establish "the EU High Seas Fleet" (three carriers, three amphibs, and adequate escorts), which would NOT be under German command, but half of it paid from German pockets, and cruising World's Oceans ... I mean this would be a brand-new force, nothing (directly) taken away from the navies of the respective EU countries ... very politically correct names like: Eurozone, European Council, or, let me think, Continent

TerraN_EmpirE said:

They have to maintain or expand the numbers of carriers if they wish to maintain readiness.

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Readiness for what?

TerraN_EmpirE said:

As it stands though England seems satisfied to add two QE2's the next two likely to have the money are France or Germany.

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Germany won't build an aircraft carrier because... they don't need it! That's why they're so wealthy

TerraN_EmpirE said:

Italy is a fairly poor state.

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Speaking about a country that's living standards and national wealth is surely in the world's top 10...

France just scrapped the 2nd carrier and 4th Mistral Class in the last years white paper

Europe will not be adding any more carriers after PoW (Prince of Wales) is launched

The garibaldi is 32 years old she would not need replacement for at least another twenty years guys. That's plenty of time for things to change on the ground.

Jura said:

must have been cool, I guess you were a young boy at that time



once upon a time, the Dutch empire stretched from New York through Cape Town to Jakarta LOL

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The Spice Islands or Maluku islands are to the East of Jakarta. The Dutch were very proud of what they achieved there. See this example: . This was not part of the school history lessons but Jan Pieterszn Coen was.

It took the Dutch some four centuries before they began to acknowledge the crimes they did commit in their colonies. If the Japanese start to do so around 2100 they will be twice as fast as the Dutch.

Rutim said:

Readiness for what?Germany won't build an aircraft carrier because... they don't need it! That's why they're so wealthy Speaking about a country that's living standards and national wealth is surely in the world's top 10...

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What if Greece decided not to repay the loans they got from Germany and leave the EU monetary system completely? If that happens I think Germany would wish they had one.