hongkongpride
New Member
Goldenpanda, I'm afraid you misunderstand my point.
I'm talking from a purely military point of view here.
It's generally an accepted fact that the ROC's German trained divisions were far superior than the rest of the warlord forces that made up the ROC army. In Manchuria, most of the ROC soldiers were conscripts that had no experience in counter guerilla warfare. You misintepreted my quote-in every army there are elite units and not-so elite units. Deng Xiaopeng's force that captured Chengdu was a sorry lot-very different from Lin Biao's battle hardened veterans who had fought both the KMT and the Japanese in Manchuria and Henan.
However, it is an insult to the brave Chinese soldiers who fought against the Japanese in World War II to say that they "melted away" when facing the Japanese. The 88th Division was the main German trained division facing the Japanese at the Battle of Shanghai in 1937 (for quick reference)
-while taking heavy losses, they proved to the world that China was ready to stand up and resist the Japanese and were also responsible for the heroic stand at the Sihang Warehouse on the banks of the Suzhou River. In short, the German trained divisions of the KMT bore most of the heavy fighting while the Communists were busy hiding from the 14th Imperial Japanese Army sweeping down from Manchuria to Shanghai. In the end, the 88th and 99th Divisions were almost destroyed defending Chinese soil from the aggressor while the Communists built up their arms stockpiles in anticipation for the coming civil war. In 1939, Germany allied with Japan, bringing an end to German training of Chinese divisions.
While it is true that while ROC troops in Manchuria were well supplied but could not fight effectively, it was only because they could not take the Communist guerilla warfare and broke-also because most of them were former men of warlord Chang Tso-Lin who had no real loyalty to the ROC.
The 76th, 88th and 101st Divisions were ordered to Taiwan to guard the gold reserves and treasures of China from the Communists -who would have certainly destroyed them in the Cultural Revolution if it was not for the efforts of these men. As an interesting fact, the following year at the Battle of Kuningtou (1949) the 76th Division wiped out almost the entire amphibious PLA assault on Quemoy island and taking the rest prisoner, proving that regular ROC troops were not as easily defeated as the 'warlord' ROC troops were by the PLA.
I'm talking from a purely military point of view here.
It's generally an accepted fact that the ROC's German trained divisions were far superior than the rest of the warlord forces that made up the ROC army. In Manchuria, most of the ROC soldiers were conscripts that had no experience in counter guerilla warfare. You misintepreted my quote-in every army there are elite units and not-so elite units. Deng Xiaopeng's force that captured Chengdu was a sorry lot-very different from Lin Biao's battle hardened veterans who had fought both the KMT and the Japanese in Manchuria and Henan.
However, it is an insult to the brave Chinese soldiers who fought against the Japanese in World War II to say that they "melted away" when facing the Japanese. The 88th Division was the main German trained division facing the Japanese at the Battle of Shanghai in 1937 (for quick reference)
-while taking heavy losses, they proved to the world that China was ready to stand up and resist the Japanese and were also responsible for the heroic stand at the Sihang Warehouse on the banks of the Suzhou River. In short, the German trained divisions of the KMT bore most of the heavy fighting while the Communists were busy hiding from the 14th Imperial Japanese Army sweeping down from Manchuria to Shanghai. In the end, the 88th and 99th Divisions were almost destroyed defending Chinese soil from the aggressor while the Communists built up their arms stockpiles in anticipation for the coming civil war. In 1939, Germany allied with Japan, bringing an end to German training of Chinese divisions.
While it is true that while ROC troops in Manchuria were well supplied but could not fight effectively, it was only because they could not take the Communist guerilla warfare and broke-also because most of them were former men of warlord Chang Tso-Lin who had no real loyalty to the ROC.
The 76th, 88th and 101st Divisions were ordered to Taiwan to guard the gold reserves and treasures of China from the Communists -who would have certainly destroyed them in the Cultural Revolution if it was not for the efforts of these men. As an interesting fact, the following year at the Battle of Kuningtou (1949) the 76th Division wiped out almost the entire amphibious PLA assault on Quemoy island and taking the rest prisoner, proving that regular ROC troops were not as easily defeated as the 'warlord' ROC troops were by the PLA.
