Coronavirus 2019-2020 thread (no unsubstantiated rumours!)

j17wang

Senior Member
Registered Member
So what exactly is the suggestion on improvement? Hire some ABCs and be more hip or something?

I strongly disagree that the US skill level is above that of the Chinese skill level. I think America's skill level in propaganda is basically a clown show at this point. The president goes on and says one thing, other officials and experts immediately shut him down. Politicians say things that contradict themselves on live air. Have you heard Pompeo's most recent interview? Someone should be fired for messing up that badly just once but it's actually typical of him! Officials like Giuliani and Conway are routinely the butt of jokes for their ignorance and stupidity. The majority of Americans not only distrust their government; they feel like it's a total joke and laughing stock. Chinese citizens, on the other hand, have much more confidence in their government. Many people may say that the media isn't telling the whole truth or distorts things (which is a normal and healthy level of skepticism seen in most countries), but almost everyone has the utmost confidence in the actual competence of the CCP to protect them and propel the nation forward to global power. Same with the trade war; half of Americans are saying how stupid their own administration is for starting this war and taxing Americans (with a tariff designed to fool stupid people into thinking that the taxes are on China) while in China, basically all Chinese are on board to stand by their government and fight. Everything equal, half the Chinese people should be calling for the CCP to compromise.

I feel that the greater influence of American media over the world over China's is an old tool that was built by the nation through the decades of being the world leader. I feel that tool is being worn down into scrap as America's word now induces more derisive laughter than approval worldwide and I think China's media influence, although still much smaller, is growing.

To summarize, I think Chinese propaganda is more effective in uniting Chinese citizens domestically than American propaganda is at uniting American citizens domestically and neither are effective at swaying each other's citizens. Globally, the US propaganda is more effective but waning quickly because it is using up the old reserves of its traditional leadership while Chinese propaganda is less effective but rising as countries begin to realize more and more how incredibly competent China is.

Hi Manqiangrexue, I took time to critically think about ways to improve Chinese-based competitive media, because you asked a good question. If you look at the lego video, it was incredibly "hip" and did an excellent job of playing the west at its own media game, which is why it went "viral". Whoever created it clearly was targeting a western audience and probably spent a good chunk of his/her life in the west to understand certain cultural nuances. Which gets to my point, if Chinese competitive media intends to put out english/foreign language materials to combat western mis-information, they better damn well hire the people that are familiar with communicating in facebook/twitter/instagram, which in many respect, do live in the west. We don't need the shit to be correct, "close enough is good enough" but lets get it viral and tugging on people's emotions. And this, I believe Xinhua is already doing with CGTN, they just need to accelerate this momentum.

To the second point, I don't believe the underlying "factuality" of data in China vs the US is as critical to winning the realm of global public opinion as how the message is delivered. If we think about the ways in which US misinformation has been "undermined" over the last week, I am sure China has published numerous articles about how this fact on COVID was wrong, this was a lie, here was an omission... and it mattered not one bit. All the academic effort and careful points and counter-points pales in comparison to how stupid the US looked once everything was distilled into this funny 2 minute video of a few cute legos. How do I know this? Three of my non-asian friends sent me via facebook messenger separate links to the youtube video over the last two days. Previously, I have never been sent any chinese-based articles or media by non-asian friends, not because they lacked sufficient facts or depth, but rather they turned off people by the inane headline and nobody bothered to read until the end.

Yes, you are absolutely correct "Chinese propaganda is more effective in uniting Chinese citizens domestically than American propaganda is at uniting American citizens domestically and neither are effective at swaying each other's citizens." But the realm of contest isn't each others home markets (which is unrealistic), but rather large majority of non-aligned (or to be non-aligned) countries such as the Italy's, Korea's... where China needs to adopt western methods to tell its stories.

I now use a personal analogy to hammer the point. Many of us know from personal career experiences that just because you have the "right skills" or "competence" does not allow you to climb up a north-american company ranks. You also need to be charismatic, and its not as important "what you say, but how you say it". In fact you could even be pointed out as being incredibly capable, and not be able to advance meaningfully to leadership. The best example of this dichotomy was expressed in a recent survey, where many citizens in the EU said they trusted Xi Jinping more than trusted Donald Trump "to personally do the right thing", but paradoxically almost everyone trusted the US more than China "to do the right thing".

And yes, you are correct "the greater influence of American media over the world over China's is an old tool that was built by the nation through the decades of being the world leader, and that US propaganda is waning as it uses up the old reserves of its leadership legacy." But until such time comes that the average European or Asian listens and believes what Beijing has to say over Washington, we need to continue playing the western media's game.

Let the americans figure out whether their "skills" are sufficient or if government is "competent/truthful" when they become the second most powerful country in the world.
 

Surpluswarrior

Junior Member
VIP Professional
From "The Taylor Report," broadcasting at 89.5 FM in Toronto:


Commentary: Canada is at a Fork-in-the-Road.
Continue on the path of solidarity, or follow America's road to division and destruction?

May 4th, 2020

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A team of novel coronavirus pneumonia experts from China and the World Health Organization visit a hospital in Wuhan, Central China's Hubei province, Feb 23, 2020. [Photo by Zhu Xingxin/chinadaily.com.cn]


On SoundCloud:

https://soundcloud.com/taylor-report%2Fcanada-is-at-a-fork-in-the-road

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Description (57 mins):

Phil discusses Trump's attempt to divide the world, pinning 'blame' for the Coronavirus on China and the WHO. Canada has followed suit, and is now dragging its own WHO doctor, Bruce Alyward, in front of a Parliamentary inquisition because he made favourable remarks about China's handling of the crisis.

Canada faces a choice between co-operation with the real international community, consisting of all the countries in the world, or falling down the hole of "Five Eyes" policy of creating political and economic havoc.
 

manqiangrexue

Brigadier
@0Fox0 @j17wang
These are good discussion points and I quite frankly think that the 3 of us could come together and run such an aggressive CCP mouthpiece it could make Trump/Pompeo fear their own televisions and require a medical team specializing in stroke to be present whenever they dared turn to our channel but that's not going to happen. A couple of points in return:

1. This is a different strategy that mirrors US philosophy rather than countering it. Right now, China mainly keeps a low profile in rhetoric but achieves big results. It hopes that Europe and other countries will see it as a non-aggressor that is simply too awesome to stop even with America attacking it in full panic mode. This image is meant to convey that China is not only strong enough to defeat attacks without attacking, but it is also more benevolent than the US. And this benevolence is convincing some European firms that China is not a threat to keep working with. China is so big, it rises above these small insults. Now your strategy is to bite back as hard as you can; it will be like 2 octopuses trying to strangle each other LOL. I don't know how this will work out, whether it will be successful or it will confuse the world into seeing basically just 2 superpowers on the same moral level fighting to the bitter end. If it is the latter, it is plausible that most countries' instincts are to revert to the old leader because there was stability under him.

2. Chinese media already has the hearts of Chinese people. Right now, the Chinese audience is balanced; they understand that America is a powerful rival with many strengths but we must come together to triumph over it. Americans, on the other hand, are blinded by hatred because of this aggressive style of media force-feeding that tells them that there is nothing good about China and it is evil to the bone. This has traditionally created one advantage for China, which is that while many Chinese understand the USA, very few Americans understand China. This means that while America is very likely to miscalculate and make mistakes when dealing with the Chinese, the opposite is far less likely to be true. Know your enemy and do not let your enemy know you; that is a Chinese advantage. If China adopts the fight-fire-with-fire tactic, it could make the Chinese also blindly hateful of the US and China could lose this advantage. Quite frankly, the US style of propaganda is messing their people up; they are looking ignorant and hateful to observers and the highly educated. It's not really something I want to see mirrored in China.

3. You can make your English media outlet as hip and awesome as it gets; many Chinese who grew up in the US could crush the role, but how do you get it to your target audience in different countries? Local people simply do not have the habit of seeking out news channels from different countries; even a neutral or mildly friendly country is unlikely to give up their own influence over their people to promote your channel in their media. Rather, your content, if it makes a rare exciting splash, will be presented to their people, filtered and interpreted by their local outlets. You are still, as you are now, at the mercy of local interpretation. And this is talking about friendly/neutral countries. If you are successful, hostile countries can simply ban your content like it doesn't exist. The Lego example was great but it was a surprise and a rare thing; it made it through because it was exciting and fresh enough to be reported in American media but if this happens again and again and the US assesses public damage coming from this, it will lock down on media reporting these things. Short cartoon clips cannot be the bread and butter of foreign media outreach for China.
 

plawolf

Lieutenant General

Pretty explosive claims, but hardly surprising.

Sadly I doubt this would lead anywhere except maybe a payout for the sacked official somewhere down the road for unfair dismissal or something similar.
 

supercat

Major





I keep saying, international Chinese media are not competent enough, we live in a propaganda war, the little Qatar with Al Jazeera managed to influence the whole world, Russia with RT managed to influence the whole world, RT is the most followed media channel on youtube, and its propaganda is effective

China ? totally incompetent media, how do you want to target a western audience with panda pictures and classical music? wake up ! we live in a propaganda war

And if I keep saying this, it is because I love China and I want it to adopt more effective propaganda, and if I take the example of Qatar or Russia, it's because it shows that countries even hated in the west can create effective propaganda in the west.

China has remained in Soviet style propaganda (like North Korea), that can't work in the West, the Russians have remarkably succeeded in adopting a very effective propaganda style, that is why all Western governments are afraid of RT

The problem is, your world view is strongly affected by the education and indoctrination you received. If you have been told that socialism/communism is bad since you were a little girl or boy, and all the way through high school, then you will hardly believe anything China says by the time you grow up. I guess that's why Russia had to wait for the end of communism to have a "competitive media" such as RT. While Western MSM just preach to the converted, China has to fight an uphill battle every step of the way as long as it is outside of the so called "neoliberal" world order.

Situation in the U.S. on 5/5:
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1588732640564.png

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Situation in China on 5/5, excluding HK, Macau, and TW (since the situation in China is quite stable now, this is the last time I will post graphs about China regularly):
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manqiangrexue

Brigadier
Being too good in propaganda isn't necessary a good thing. You could believe your own lies, You could drink back your own Kool Aid.
Exactly, and I don't even know if that counts as being good at propaganda or just having thicker skin to boldly repeat lies as truth again and again to your own people. The testament to this is that one of the reasons that America was so ill-prepared for COVID-19 is that they believed their own lies that everything China says is wrong and should be rejected so they subconsciously felt that COVID-19 is not going to be a big problem. That and the fact that they were distracted from their rational thinking by the high of an overwhelming dose of schadenfreude. Some people say that if the Wuhan outbreak had instead occurred in a European city, the US would have been on much higher alert.
 
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