Civilian Aviation Technology

danielchin said:

I think you're correct about the engine factor, the chinese article also mentioned better aerodynamic design and the use of composite materials beside the engine which is said 12~15% saving than those of competitor's. And it said the operating costs of C-919 will be 10% lower than competitors.

Click to expand...

The problem is that today, aerodynamic improvement can only get you a very small increase in efficiency; Airbus tried to improve the aerodynamics of the A320 through a series of tests, which included new blended winglets on the design; it was found that any 'improvement' they did netted a very marginal increase in efficiency. That's why both Airbus and Boeing are waiting on new engines before even proceeding with a new design or a major product upgrade.

Chinese manufacturers have a major advantage over Airbus and Boeing in the domestic market: they can expect help from the central government in the form of subsidies as well as preferential treatment from Chinese airlines. Chinese manufacturers can also get away with such practices without fear of law suits and protest. Remember the volleys of lawsuits Boeing and Airbus launched at each other not so long ago?

FriedRiceNSpice said:

Chinese manufacturers have a major advantage over Airbus and Boeing in the domestic market: they can expect help from the central government in the form of subsidies as well as preferential treatment from Chinese airlines. Chinese manufacturers can also get away with such practices without fear of law suits and protest. Remember the volleys of lawsuits Boeing and Airbus launched at each other not so long ago?

Click to expand...

well, I think if COMAC eventually becomes successful with this project, they will get plenty of volleys of lawsuits from EU and US.

tphuang said:

well, I think if COMAC eventually becomes successful with this project, they will get plenty of volleys of lawsuits from EU and US.

Click to expand...

Still, it would be worth the effort of riding out any such storm to build a success civil aircraft manufacturing system.

50% of new gen. of passenger aircraft such as Boeing dreamliner and next gen. of airbus are make up of composite material.specially her main fuselage (the "tube"),this manufacturing technique are closely guard secret.
does this mean COMAC manage make to technological breakthrough ?

I think People in Sichuan will work much harder and have more success like the J-10. Unlike shenyang, which a lazy Bum.
------------------------------------------------------------------------

New engine facility for homemade jumbo jet in Sichuan

An advanced engine development facility will be built in Sichuan province as the nation moves closer to building its own jumbo jet.

The base in Mianyang will provide advanced testing facilities and simulate the height and speed of an aircraft at high altitude, said Guo Xin, head of the gas turbine institute of the China Aviation Industry Corporation (AVIC).

"The engine is the heart of an airplane. China needs a first-class experimental base for developing homemade aero-engines," he told China News Agency.

Piao Ying, an aero-engine expert with Tsinghua University, said engines must undergo strict ground testing, including high altitude simulation, before they are installed in an airplane.

The country's current altitude simulation testing facility - the largest in Asia - is located at the gas turbine institute in Jiangyou, Sichuan province.

But plans to build large aircraft have placed tough demands on the facility, and the existing infrastructure is not of a high enough standard, an industry insider told China Daily.

In addition, some testing implements were damaged in the 8.0-magnitude earthquake in Sichuan province last year, said Ji Qinghua, a publicity officer with the institute.

The institute and the testing facility will move from Jiangyou to Mianyang, which is removed from the fault line, he said.

The project now awaits approval from the central government, he added.

The 150-seat jumbo jet, coded C919, is expected to make its maiden flight in 2014 and be delivered to customers in 2016

The capacity of the large commercial aircraft accounts for between 70-80 percent of current world demand.

Jin Zhuanglong, president of the Commercial Aircraft Corporation of China, said China would purchase foreign engines and seek suppliers through global bidding.

But the government is also determined to create its own technology and a company was established in Shanghai in January to focus specifically on engine development for the homemade jumbo.

Piao Ying said engine development technology is extremely difficult and only exists in Britain, France, the United States and Russia.

Even countries with the ability to manufacture aircraft may not be able to master the technologies of aero-engines, she said.

challenge said:

50% of new gen. of passenger aircraft such as Boeing dreamliner and next gen. of airbus are make up of composite material.specially her main fuselage (the "tube"),this manufacturing technique are closely guard secret.
does this mean COMAC manage make to technological breakthrough ?

Click to expand...

Unless COMAC has developed a whole new set of physics the C-919, I doubt it. The rules of aerodynamics have indicated that with the current airplane design, we've reached the limit as to what we can do compared to the payload we want to carry. That's why everyone is focusing on engine technology.

danielchin said:

I'm not an expert either, but my understanding is that even an existing commercial jet can switch to other engine option upon customer's request as long as it fits in the design.
Of course I could be wrong.

Click to expand...

Yip. I think it must be a concious part of the desigeners, right from the start. I think i have seen RR. and GE on 747's

I also heard that the air traffic/corridor is controlled by the military, so in the case of flight delays , it is more than shambolic.Rumor has it in these times when one is buying a airticket, one does not go on price, but finding out which plane is high on the departure list when it comes to clearing a backlog. But seriously if thats the case, and if civilian traffic gonna grow like heck, they would have to have a better system in place, wouldnt they?

China's XAC becomes majority owner of Austrian aviation supplier FACC AG
By Associated Press

7:49 AM CDT, October 3, 2009

VIENNA (AP) — China's Xi'an Aircraft Industry (Group) Company Ltd. has become the majority owner of Austrian aviation supplier FACC AG, the Austrian company said Saturday.

In a statement on its Web site, FACC said stockholders of the two companies signed an acquisition agreement that, once completed, will give XAC 91.25 percent of FACC shares. No price was disclosed.

The transaction, which still needs regulatory approval, is expected to be concluded by the end of the fourth quarter.

"XAC and FACC complement each other very well," FACC CEO Walter Stephan said in the statement, adding in comments carried by the Austria Press Agency that XAC had guaranteed it would maintain the company's Austrian locations and work force. Its name will also remain unchanged.

FACC AG, headquartered in the Austrian town of Ried, specializes in the development, design and production of components and systems for civil aircraft, including complete cabins. Its customers include Airbus, Boeing and Bombardier Aerospace.

_____

On the Net:

FACC AG:







Copyright 2009 Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed.


China’s aviation giant buys Austrian plane parts maker FACC
Posted on 06 October 2009 by adminShareThis
October.06, 2009 - October 3, the stockholders of Austria’s leading aviation supplier FACC AG (”FACC”) and Xi’an Aircraft Industry (Group) Company Ltd. (”XAC”) have signed an agreement relating to the acquisition of the majority of shares in FACC by XAC. Upon completion of the acquisition, 91.25% of the shares of FACC AG will be held by XAC, 5% will remain in possession of the Austrian holding company ACC Kooperationen und Beteiligungen GmbH and 3.75% will be retained by Stephan Ges.m.b.H. The transaction which is subject to customary regulatory approvals is expected to be finalized by the end of the fourth quarter of 2009. After the completion of the acquisition, a share capital increase will be carried out, raising shareholders’ equity from the current 40 million Euros up to no less than 80 million Euros. This primary equity capital raising will assure the planned business development of FACC.


FACC will bring its advanced composite aerostructure manufacture ability to XAC

FACC is a leading company specializing in the development, design and manufacture of composite components and systems for civil aircraft. We offer a wide range of products, from aircraft fairings to fuselages and wings, engine and engine nacelle components and complete aircraft cabins. The two divisions Structures and Interiors occupy top positions in their respective markets.

In 2008, The Chinese aircraft manufacturer COMAC/ AVIC Commercial Aircraft Co., Ltd. awards FACC the “Silver Medal Supplier Award” for the development and manufacture of the ARJ21 passenger cabin.

XAC is the main contractor of famous JH-7/JH-7A two-seater, twin-engine fighter-bomber in service with the People’s Liberation Army Naval Air Force (PLANAF), and the People’s Liberation Army Air Force (PLAAF).