Chinese Trainer Aircraft (JL-8, JL-9, JL-10 (L-15), etc.)

Re: JL-15 and other trainers

Troika said:

Like I said, I didn't comment on whether it fits modern PLAAF doctrine, but you can see where they are coming from.

Look at the Hongdu roster:

Q-5
CJ-5
CJ-6
K-8
L-15 supersonic trainer
Hongdu N-5 multi-use agriculture & forest aircraft
MD500 series heloes
Yun-5 (Y-5) light utility/transport biplane

Of these, the CJs and Q-5 are on their way out. L-15 is an uncertain prospect, though looking better. The MDs are in very low production. Only K-8 is selling well.

Given their lack of R&D prowess, it's entirely natural they want a light CAS successor to the Q-5, and tie its fortune to the LIFT they also hope to sell.

BTW, the Tu-22M shot down in the Five Day War, it was a MR forced to fly a recon mission for reasons I need not go into. If it was following proper doctrine it won't even have flown to within 100 km of Georgian air space...

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Hongdu certainly has trouble with independent development, many have criticized it for having to cooperate with the Russians to develop the Yak-152/L-7 turoprop basic trainer.

Selling the L-15 not only as a trainer, but also a light CAS aircraft will certainly make the L-15 a more attractive package to the PLAAF. By having both available, the overall costs for maintenance and parts are lowered if both are operated. Also this means that the L-15 itself does not necessarily have to be a highly advanced aircraft itself. The KAI T-50 has consistently lost international tenders because many countries consider it simply too expensive/advanced than necessary. This is something Hongdu should avoid.

The K-8 in my opinion is the ideal platform for a light CAS/COIN role. By strengthening the existing design and increasing its payload it would make a very useful light attack aircraft. The L-15 as an attack aircraft is a tad more risky at it's abilities will inevitably be compared to the JH-7A and Su-30MKK even eith the difference in weight class.

Re: JL-15 and other trainers



According to this author, the chief designer of JL-15 purportedy confirmed the existence of an ESA radar on the 06 prototype.

If this was true, the fate of an ESA radar on J-10B is sealed.

I know Challenge was warned for posting in this format, but I spilt whiskey on my laptop, and had to copy-and-paste individual letters. Sorry.

Re: JL-15 and other trainers

hbogyt said:

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According to this author, the chief designer of JL-15 purportedy confirmed the existence of an ESA radar on the 06 prototype.

If this was true, the fate of an ESA radar on J-10B is sealed.

I know Challenge was warned for posting in this format, but I spilt whiskey on my laptop, and had to copy-and-paste individual letters. Sorry.

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The question remains what sort of ESA radar it will be, if the L-15 does infact carry an ESA radar the LIFT variant of the L-15 is undoubtedly the most advanced fighter trainer in the entire world.

Both your keyboard and you delicious whiskey have my utmost condolences, personally I can't touch whiskey unless its mixed with something else in a a shotglass but my friend who swears by his whiskey and bourbon insists its an acquired taste

Re: JL-15 and other trainers

Semi-Lobster said:

The question remains what sort of ESA radar it will be, if the L-15 does infact carry an ESA radar the LIFT variant of the L-15 is undoubtedly the most advanced fighter trainer in the entire world.

Both your keyboard and you delicious whiskey have my utmost condolences, personally I can't touch whiskey unless its mixed with something else in a a shotglass but my friend who swears by his whiskey and bourbon insists its an acquired taste

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AAHH, YOU HAVE NO IDEA. I CAN ONLY tYPE USINg SHItF KEY, OR ELSE, tYPINg L WILL LOCK tHE COmPUtER, [SPACE] OPENS WINDOWS SIDEBAR, F OPENS gOOgLE DESKOP, Etc. EVEN WIH SHIFt, g t m ARE StILL NO-NO. tHOUgH A FEW LEttERS CAN BE tYPED WItHOUt SHItF. I'S LIKE tHE LAPtOP HAS QUANtUm tUNNELLED INtO ANOtHER REALm OF REALItY.

JIm BEAm's BOURBON ACtUALLY tAStES FRUItY.

Re: JL-15 and other trainers

hbogyt said:

AAHH, YOU HAVE NO IDEA. I CAN ONLY tYPE USINg SHItF KEY, OR ELSE, tYPINg L WILL LOCK tHE COmPUtER, [SPACE] OPENS WINDOWS SIDEBAR, F OPENS gOOgLE DESKOP, Etc. EVEN WIH SHIFt, g t m ARE StILL NO-NO. tHOUgH A FEW LEttERS CAN BE tYPED WItHOUt SHItF. I'S LIKE tHE LAPtOP HAS QUANtUm tUNNELLED INtO ANOtHER REALm OF REALItY.

JIm BEAm's BOURBON ACtUALLY tAStES FRUItY.

Click to expand...

Been a while since I had Jim Beam, maybe I should go pick some up today...

Anyway with this likely confirmation that the LIFT variant of the L-15 is caring an ESA radar, I think we can safely say that Hongdu would very much like to market the L-15 as not only a training system but also as fighter itself it seems. There isn't really a need at all for such an expensive piece of equipment to be in a lead-in fighter trainer, the British Hawk 128 for example has a radar emulation pod in the place of a real radar. While other trainers such as the KAI TA-50 and FMA IA 63 Pampa use a fairly robust combat radar, those aircraft also perform light attacking duties but an ESA radar IMO indicates something a tad more ambitious than just light attack

Re: JL-15 and other trainers

Troika said:

If you read the interview, Tphuang's translation was in error. What the article in fact said was that it has greater space so it could be fitted with a PESA. There's no mention of it actually being fitted with one.

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The way I read it, 以配装无源相控阵雷达, means that it has ALREADY been equipped with PESA radar, unless they missed the word 可 in front of the sentence.

Re: JL-15 and other trainers

dingyibvs said:

The way I read it, 以配装无源相控阵雷达, means that it has ALREADY been equipped with PESA radar, unless they missed the word 可 in front of the sentence.

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Sorry, I didn't see it was posted by Tphuang. He's too good.

Re: JL-15 and other trainers

L-15 ,serial no. 6 the same aircraft shown in airshow, it is simple ranging radar,during the airshow, CCTV-9 camera man actually video it,the radar as appear in the TV shown it was ranging radar, and the antenna is fix slotted array radar similiar to the Elbit EL/M-2001.

Re: JL-15 and other trainers

JL-9h for training pilots for the AC.

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Re: JL-15 and other trainers

Thank you, KYli, for this beautiful picture. I was wondering which trainer aircraft would appear sporting tail hook.