Chinese semiconductor industry

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escobar

Brigadier
China hasn't even pulled any of its levers yet...
DCEP to displace the dollar
Rare earth ban
Press a button and send a missile to strike TSMC and you can kiss the world's advance semiconductor industry goodbye for the next decade
Actually, complete and total decoupling with US, and see who has more endurance... American's will be on the streets within weeks and there will be civil war before end of the month, the preexisting racial faultlines in this nation will become as fatal as if that supervolcano exploded

You wanna talk hyperinflation that is how you get hyperinflation then the dollar becomes worthless and well... once it loses its reserve currency status it ain't never getting it back
DCEP to displace the dollar? People should stop saying this nonsense
 

Oldschool

Junior Member
Registered Member
EUV is 1000x more important than jet engines... China needs chips for its AI, and if it can solve AGI and dominate AI then it can use AI to solve all other problems including fusion and jet design etc


Doesn't matter, Taiwan is China's to take... Yanks can go back home where they belong

AI is not needed for basic survival.
EUV It will take times. Probably long time. If you got DUV you can survive .


Work with tools you have now. Military tools is at disposal.
 

visitor123

New Member
Registered Member
EUV is 1000x more important than jet engines...
lol. I don't know if you are aware of this but Taiwan who supposedly has the monopoly on "the important technology on Earth" has a GDP 1/2 of Spain and lower per capita. And Spain exports mostly pork.

You think the J-20 is running Intel chips or that they used chips made by TSMC? lulz
 

ansy1968

Brigadier
Registered Member
The semiconductor chip market is at least 5x bigger in China than America.

Look at this old chart please.

The tail wags the dog in America. The tail does not wag the dog in China.

:)

daxue-consulting_Chinas-semiconductor-market_semiconductor-market-share-global.jpg


:oops:

(next, for the next step in the way it works, is where will the talent and money flow to ... the market 1/5th the size or the market 5x times bigger, someone is fighting losing battle here)

:p
@horse Amen to that bro, and here is an another chart to back that up.

from CnTechPost

China's Q1 IC imports up 11.2% year-on-year to $40 billion​

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April 13, 2021
China's first-quarter
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rose 11.2% year-on-year to RMB 262.5 billion ($40.1 billion), according to data released by China's General Administration of Customs on April 13.
China imported 155.27 billion units of integrated circuits in the first quarter, an increase of 33.6%. IC exports in the first quarter amounted to RMB 72.68 billion, an increase of 2.4%.
The total value of China's trade imports and exports in the first quarter was RMB 8.47 trillion, up 29.2% year-on-year, with a trade surplus of RMB 759.3 billion, an expansion of 690.6%.
Among them, the total value of exports was RMB 4.61 trillion, up 38.7%; the total value of imports was RMB 3.86 trillion, up 19.3%.
China exported RMB 2.78 trillion of electromechanical products in the first quarter, accounting for 60.3% of the total export value, up 1.7 percentage points year-on-year.

Among them, exports of automatic data processing equipment, mobile phones, and automobiles increased by 54.5%, 38.5%, and 98.9% respectively.
China's combined import and export to the remaining 14 RCEP member countries in the first quarter was RMB 2.67 trillion, up 22.9% year-on-year, accounting for 31.5% of China's total foreign trade import and export value.
Among them, exports amounted to RMB 1.25 trillion, up 27.5%; imports amounted to RMB 1.42 trillion, up 19%.
Among them, exports of mechanical and electrical products amounted to RMB 659.85 billion, an increase of 28.7%, accounting for 53% of the total export value to RCEP member countries.

China's Q1 IC imports up 11.2% year-on-year to $40 billion-CnTechPost
 

ansy1968

Brigadier
Registered Member
Small countries are different.

Those 900 well paying jobs at Huawei are important. That is is the extent of Canadian leadership in 5G!

No one is going to do what Huawei is doing for Canada. That is kind of end of story. Unless Canada does not want these high tech research jobs.

That is why the white Canadian is so butt hurt over this. They want the 900 high tech jobs, but rather prefer it not being that Huawei is the provider of those jobs.

That is a small country. The strong do what they can. The weak suffer what they must. And that is the butt hurt.

:p
@horse And bro I like China and Huawei in particular strategy, harnessing and owning the IP from your adversary....LOL , joking aside they may do it domestically having a large number of engineers , It just a marketing tool for HW to show the west that they do research and not a stealer of IP and I think most of those employed were Chinese national or Chinese Canadian.
 

Oldschool

Junior Member
Registered Member
China semiconductor market big is good news to US. US wants to sell to weaklings like Lenovo, Xiaomi, Oppo.

It just ban and kill someone like Huawei or others that design its own chips or can be military supplier

It's all about selective killing.

I don't believe complete tech decoupling is US strategy.
 

ansy1968

Brigadier
Registered Member
The gap between SMIC and TSMC may widen, as TSMC has a large lead. But then the gap will very likely shrink, and then SMIC could start leading.

The plain fact is that TSMC doesn't have much more technological room: Moore's Law is dying if not already dead. They can go to 3 nm and maybe even 2 nm, and then they'll be stuck. SMIC will have plenty of time to catch up.

Perhaps something new will keep the chip technology growing exponentially, such as graphene, nanotubes, or photonics. But in that case, mainland China has as at least as good a chance as Taiwan to win.
@Nutrient bro very good observation, the reason they become a willing participant.
 

ansy1968

Brigadier
Registered Member
Regarding to Huawei it will have to transform itself.


SMIC not manufacturing for Huawei. Even SMIC has 7nm it won't matter.

Kirin , baloong, taishan server ,ascend AI chips all have to say good bye. Or sell its IPs go other players.

Domestic equipments and materials will not come up in times to serve them...

China military doing pretty well with less advanced WS10A/B which is equivalent to DUV 28nm ArF immersion. Even WS10 took a long long time to be perfected. I expect same with DUV 28nm, it won't be smooth.
@Oldschool but HW is designing a 3nm chips shows the need to prepare for the future, you're right at least that part of the equation is ready while waiting for the rest to catch up. Hisilicon had become a world class competitor to Qualcomm now SMEE need to up its game to at least threaten ASML just a little bit...hehehe.
 
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