Chinese semiconductor industry

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mossen

mossen

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Also worth noting that TSMC has a lot of problems with 3 nm. It is not clear if progress from 3nm downwards will be as rapid as it has been from e.g. 7nm to 3nm. If there will be more issues then obviously that will help China in so far as it is will gain more time to catch up to the frontier.
 
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measuredingabens

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BoraTas said:
IMO he is implying that China's lower electricity prices can offset for 2-3 nodes in disparity when it comes to HPC. I can't readily disagree with him. If differences between nodes are small more racks can be a viable solution.
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There's also the caveat that in current AI computing setups the majority of the power is consumed during data transfer, not the computing itself. That further dampens the advantage of smaller nodes.
 
sunnymaxi

sunnymaxi

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TK3600 said:
so revenue more or less the same, but profit is rising.
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Mate60 is not the primary driver of Huawei's revenue .. confirmed by spokesperson of Huawei

However, the Huawei spokesperson attributed the third-quarter revenue growth to increases in the digital power, cloud and auto parts businesses, while the Mate 60 series was released relatively late in the quarter.

so next year revenue likely to hit 100 Billion USD if everything goes well ... check out massages of tphuang in last page of this thread. very well explained.
 
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tonyget

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Phead128 said:
The "At what Cost?"-ing exercise works favorable in terms of energy costs.

Electricity cost per unit kWh (
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  • U.S.A: 12.5 cents per kilo-watt hour (kWh)
  • China: 4.3 cents per kilo-watt hour
That represents a 70% less electricity cost in China vs. US, due to abundance of cheap hydroelectricity power, and as low as 92% less if you go to Sichuan hydroelectric dams with 1 cent per kWh, which became haven for GPU Bitcoin mining farms.

An 5nm chip is 15% performance gain vs. 7nm chip at same power draw, or 30% reduced power consumption at the same performance. These are vastly outweigh by lower electricity cost in China compared with U.S. We are talking about a big gap even if you go 3nm chips.

Notwithstanding that at one point, US market electricity prices increased considerably due to Ukraine war sanctions...my electricity bill increased considerably.

Edit: clarified post
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H100 is 3 times more powerful than A100，Ascend 910's performance is similar to A100. H100 power consumption is 350w，Ascend 910 power consumption is also 350w.

So H100 is roughly 3 times more powerful than Ascend 910，while consume the same amount of power. Unless Chinese electricity cost is 3 times or more cheaper than the US，the US will always edge over China when it comes to AI cluster efficiency
 
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LazyYew

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tonyget said:
H100 is 3 times more powerful than A100，Ascend 910's performance is similar to A100. H100 power consumption is 350w，Ascend 910 power consumption is also 350w.

So H100 is roughly 3 times more powerful than Ascend 910，while consume the same amount of power. Unless Chinese electricity cost is 3 times or more cheaper than the US，the US will always edge over China when it comes to AI cluster efficiency
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That may be true now. But the present is not the end goal now is it? Huawei has managed to reach so far despite NVIDIA product being superior and available. However, with NVIDIA banned from selling to China, the Chinese companies will now be forced to make use of Huawei tools despite it being weaker now. With more customers than ever before and more people providing feedback, this will help push Huawei to grow even faster than before at the same time depriving NVIDIA of a huge income and feedback. The future growth seems to be working in Huawei favour even more.
 
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lube

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tonyget said:
H100 is 3 times more powerful than A100，Ascend 910's performance is similar to A100. H100 power consumption is 350w，Ascend 910 power consumption is also 350w.

So H100 is roughly 3 times more powerful than Ascend 910，while consume the same amount of power. Unless Chinese electricity cost is 3 times or more cheaper than the US，the US will always edge over China when it comes to AI cluster efficiency
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That would be surprising since the numbers shared earlier was that A100 was nearly 3 times cheaper than H100.
Purchase cost should be included I think in the calculations I think.

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Didida

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tonyget said:
H100 is 3 times more powerful than A100，Ascend 910's performance is similar to A100. H100 power consumption is 350w，Ascend 910 power consumption is also 350w.

So H100 is roughly 3 times more powerful than Ascend 910，while consume the same amount of power. Unless Chinese electricity cost is 3 times or more cheaper than the US，the US will always edge over China when it comes to AI cluster efficiency
Click to expand...
Ascend 910 was released in 2019. You can choose to believe Huawei/HiSilicon has been sleeping for the past 4 years.
 
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