Chinese semiconductor industry

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caudaceus

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So regarding western news and information on the Chinese semiconductor industry, why does it seem like the MMS, experts or even the top level politicians seem to have no idea what going on? There's probably dozens of articles a week, various experts giving interviews/podcasts/writing articles and so much focus on the semiconductor industry and they miss out on some very public information.

One example would be SMIC's 7nm process. SMIC themselves have said publicly that 7nm is achievable and in their roadmap said that they would make a 7nm chip in 2020/2021, all this public info since 2018. And it wasn't totally lost in western media, there was a bunch of Seeking Alpha articles about SMIC's N+2 years before 2022. And yet there was this big explosion of news once Techinsights actually confirmed that SMIC managed to fab a 7nm transistor. Western media was so shocked, dozens upon dozens of articles.

Even the experts didn't see it coming. Hell, even the highest level of government in Washington seemed to have been blindsighted, judging by some of their comments. Probably not a coincidence that weeks after the Techinsights article about SMIC's 7nm was out, America set out on sanctions on DUVi machines and more sanctions on high and medium end semiconductors.

2nd example would be EUV. If you search for China's progress on EUV, you will find many articles that just state how impossible it would be for China to develop their EUV machine, how complex ASML's EUV is, the tin droplets, mirrors/lenses that china can't make in a million years and maybe some minor progress updates like Huawei's recent EUV patents. There's a few articles that even state that SMEE will be the ones developing EUV, which is false. Not much more info after that.

And then there's SSMB EUV. There's zero. Literally zero(0), no news, or clickbait youtube videos on China's SSMB project. Not even a single Seeking Alpha article about it. It's not a big secret, Tsinghua university has a English page on their website will all the info that you need, they worked with western scientist on the concept before, this site can't seem to stop talking about it, there's chinese studies/papers on nature on SSMB EUV, there's news on weibo about it. Hell the thing already started construction and nobody in the West seems to know about it. At this rate, the thing will be built and pumping out chips for a year before anyone in the West finds out.

Really makes you wonder how much this "experts" know about the chinese semiconductor news, what kind of research they're doing. What are the Journalist doing? You would think that someone would love to break open the floodgates on this new potential national security threat, maybe make some big clickbait youtube video about it.

The real question is how much do American politicians and intelligence agencies really know about the cutting edge in the chinese semiconductor space? Surely they must have some idea, more than us, but again, their reaction to SMIC's N+2 seems like they got blindsighted and I really don't see people like DeSantis not writing some long tweet or blog about "China's race to EUV and why you should be super scared of it and why it will destroy America and freedom" if they knew anything about it.
I'm pretty sure the so called expert doesnt browse Chinese net i.e. Baidu/WeChat in mandarin instead of Google.
 

latenlazy

Brigadier
That can't be the only reason. Like I said, there have been way way more obscure or lesser known Chinese companies/startups, projects or news that have received more coverage than China's progress on EUV. There are western china watchers that literally look though thousands of satellite photos to catch interesting developments happening in China. Almost feels like there's some kind of unwritten rule in the news industry to supress any news on China's progress on EUV. But that won't stop most blatant clickbait youtubers.
You sound like a doubt troll in the late 2000s talking about the J-20.

We have lots of sources. Western observers just don’t know what to look for. Most of the guys making noise about China US tech competition have never touched a science class after high school. Most China watchers just regurgitate each other’s takes uncritically.
 

FairAndUnbiased

Brigadier
Registered Member
So regarding western news and information on the Chinese semiconductor industry, why does it seem like the MMS, experts or even the top level politicians seem to have no idea what going on? There's probably dozens of articles a week, various experts giving interviews/podcasts/writing articles and so much focus on the semiconductor industry and they miss out on some very public information.

One example would be SMIC's 7nm process. SMIC themselves have said publicly that 7nm is achievable and in their roadmap said that they would make a 7nm chip in 2020/2021, all this public info since 2018. And it wasn't totally lost in western media, there was a bunch of Seeking Alpha articles about SMIC's N+2 years before 2022. And yet there was this big explosion of news once Techinsights actually confirmed that SMIC managed to fab a 7nm transistor. Western media was so shocked, dozens upon dozens of articles.

Even the experts didn't see it coming. Hell, even the highest level of government in Washington seemed to have been blindsighted, judging by some of their comments. Probably not a coincidence that weeks after the Techinsights article about SMIC's 7nm was out, America set out on sanctions on DUVi machines and more sanctions on high and medium end semiconductors.

2nd example would be EUV. If you search for China's progress on EUV, you will find many articles that just state how impossible it would be for China to develop their EUV machine, how complex ASML's EUV is, the tin droplets, mirrors/lenses that china can't make in a million years and maybe some minor progress updates like Huawei's recent EUV patents. There's a few articles that even state that SMEE will be the ones developing EUV, which is false. Not much more info after that.

And then there's SSMB EUV. There's zero. Literally zero(0), no news, or clickbait youtube videos on China's SSMB project. Not even a single Seeking Alpha article about it. It's not a big secret, Tsinghua university has a English page on their website will all the info that you need, they worked with western scientist on the concept before, this site can't seem to stop talking about it, there's chinese studies/papers on nature on SSMB EUV, there's news on weibo about it. Hell the thing already started construction and nobody in the West seems to know about it. At this rate, the thing will be built and pumping out chips for a year before anyone in the West finds out.

Really makes you wonder how much this "experts" know about the chinese semiconductor news, what kind of research they're doing. What are the Journalist doing? You would think that someone would love to break open the floodgates on this new potential national security threat, maybe make some big clickbait youtube video about it.

The real question is how much do American politicians and intelligence agencies really know about the cutting edge in the chinese semiconductor space? Surely they must have some idea, more than us, but again, their reaction to SMIC's N+2 seems like they got blindsighted and I really don't see people like DeSantis not writing some long tweet or blog about "China's race to EUV and why you should be super scared of it and why it will destroy America and freedom" if they knew anything about it.
They have no idea what they're doing. None of them are SMEs in semiconductor, they just parrot each other. when you have 1 parrot, it sounds smart and makes people interested, but when you have 50 parrots, they just shit everywhere.
 

HighGround

Senior Member
Registered Member
Our best asset and defense the Chinese language, for the Collective West politicians and intelligences agency learning the language is beneath them the reason they want instant gratification and they want a easy way out so they visited SDF for info. ;)

This is why the CIA subcontracted me to lurk these forums 24/7.

You sound like a doubt troll in the late 2000s talking about the J-20.

We have lots of sources. Western observers just don’t know what to look for. Most of the guys making noise about China US tech competition have never touched a science class after high school. Most China watchers just regurgitate each other’s takes uncritically.

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Just listen to how out of touch these people are. They also never talk about specifics, just very broad, general soundbites. These are some of the intellectual leaders of U.S. It's just sad.
 

Overbom

Brigadier
Registered Member
So regarding western news and information on the Chinese semiconductor industry, why does it seem like the MMS, experts or even the top level politicians seem to have no idea what going on? There's probably dozens of articles a week, various experts giving interviews/podcasts/writing articles and so much focus on the semiconductor industry and they miss out on some very public information.

One example would be SMIC's 7nm process. SMIC themselves have said publicly that 7nm is achievable and in their roadmap said that they would make a 7nm chip in 2020/2021, all this public info since 2018. And it wasn't totally lost in western media, there was a bunch of Seeking Alpha articles about SMIC's N+2 years before 2022. And yet there was this big explosion of news once Techinsights actually confirmed that SMIC managed to fab a 7nm transistor. Western media was so shocked, dozens upon dozens of articles.

Even the experts didn't see it coming. Hell, even the highest level of government in Washington seemed to have been blindsighted, judging by some of their comments. Probably not a coincidence that weeks after the Techinsights article about SMIC's 7nm was out, America set out on sanctions on DUVi machines and more sanctions on high and medium end semiconductors.

2nd example would be EUV. If you search for China's progress on EUV, you will find many articles that just state how impossible it would be for China to develop their EUV machine, how complex ASML's EUV is, the tin droplets, mirrors/lenses that china can't make in a million years and maybe some minor progress updates like Huawei's recent EUV patents. There's a few articles that even state that SMEE will be the ones developing EUV, which is false. Not much more info after that.

And then there's SSMB EUV. There's zero. Literally zero(0), no news, or clickbait youtube videos on China's SSMB project. Not even a single Seeking Alpha article about it. It's not a big secret, Tsinghua university has a English page on their website will all the info that you need, they worked with western scientist on the concept before, this site can't seem to stop talking about it, there's chinese studies/papers on nature on SSMB EUV, there's news on weibo about it. Hell the thing already started construction and nobody in the West seems to know about it. At this rate, the thing will be built and pumping out chips for a year before anyone in the West finds out.

Really makes you wonder how much this "experts" know about the chinese semiconductor news, what kind of research they're doing. What are the Journalist doing? You would think that someone would love to break open the floodgates on this new potential national security threat, maybe make some big clickbait youtube video about it.

The real question is how much do American politicians and intelligence agencies really know about the cutting edge in the chinese semiconductor space? Surely they must have some idea, more than us, but again, their reaction to SMIC's N+2 seems like they got blindsighted and I really don't see people like DeSantis not writing some long tweet or blog about "China's race to EUV and why you should be super scared of it and why it will destroy America and freedom" if they knew anything about it.
The think tankers, researchers producing these reports on China's Industry are running the biggest con I have seen in more than a decade.

The US government would be much better served if it just fired all these guys and just browsed this thread here in SDF which is also free btw

Declining Empire and all that
 

tphuang

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ZTE is launching a new 5G cloud laptop
This got me interested because it says that it uses a quad core domestic cpu at 2.0 GHz. From what i can see, only Zhaoxin fits that description. Now, we know it's not a particularly performant CPU, but this is also not the first laptop to use KX6000G

From
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looks like there is a 15W CPU version that clocks at 2.0GHz, which would be better suited for something like laptop, since you want to lower power consumption (IIRC, latest snapdragon for smartphones is like twice that power consumption, so this is not bad)
 

tphuang

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3C5000 has recently been incorporated by Beijing's XC data in it's all in one general purpose storage machine

Combines 3C5000 server CPU with XinStor platform software and Loongson's security functions. 3C5000 operates at 2.2GHz with power consumption of 150W and peak performance of 560GLops (I think 4 3D5000 was said to have > 4TFLOPS in computation
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). so not bad

XinOS is developed on top op of LoongsonOS.

anyways, good to see further adaptation of Loongson CPUs
 
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