Chinese semiconductor industry

“The long and short of it is, demand is up about 50%. And there’s no asset-intensive industry like ours that has 50% capacity lying around,” said Mike Hogan, senior vice president at chip manufacturer GlobalFoundries and head of its automotive unit.

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“It’s four-dimensional chess all day long,” said one auto official, who asked not to be identified.

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I think there will be enough push back from industry to make Biden reverse a lot of the sanctions

TSMC simply doesn't have the capacity. And Intel is now an indian infested failing company.

localizer said:

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I think there will be enough push back from industry to make Biden reverse a lot of the sanctions

TSMC simply doesn't have the capacity. And Intel is now an indian infested failing company.

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I don't think so.... semiconductor is THE weakest link of China right now and for the foreseeable short to medium term future... China can do without jet engines but cannot do without chips and the ability to import or fab chips, since the import route is getting blocked, being able to fab them domesitically is the only other option.

America will leverage and capitalize this weakness for all its worth and like Cotton said will "give no quarter"...
Bannon said it was ten times more important to kill Huawei than to sign any trade deal...
And China spends more in IC chips than oil, literally chips are the new oil in the 21st century
In a AGI/UBI society its all on AI... but AI is predicated upon the lower physical stacks... and it all boils down to the fabrication of state of art 5nm or below chips and the ENTIRE supply chain surrounding all of it... everything else China wants to accomplish hedges on the core ability to make or gain access to these chips...

make no mistake, this will be the Chinese version of landing on the moon or manhattan project etc etc... the most critical, urgent, and important undertaking China has ever had to face in recent years... I think China will prevail, Gadgettool doesn't think so, but one point we all agree is how important this is to China.

There is no way America would back down from this.... if China cannot surpass this hurdle then American knows China will never complete its ideal of tech ascension and thus will eventually economically lag behind and will fall back and not be a contender to American supremacy anymore...

Short of a hot war, this is America's best bet to erase and contain/destroy China...

Yall recall Polesi was in drunken state of stupor and ranting on about how Huawei was a danger to American security and if EU allies jumped on the Huawei bandwagon it would be the end of the West?

Well she got her info from CIA. Pelosi don't know how to turn on a computer...

quantumlight said:

I don't think so.... semiconductor is THE weakest link of China right now and for the foreseeable short to medium term future...
America will leverage and capitalize this weakness for all its worth and like Cotton said will "give no quarter"...
Bannon said it was ten times more important to kill Huawei than to sign any trade deal...
And China spends more in IC chips than oil, literally chips are the new oil in the 21st century
In a AGI/UBI society its all on AI... but AI is predicated upon the lower physical stacks... and it all boils down to the fabrication of state of art 5nm or below chips and the ENTIRE supply chain surrounding all of it...

make no mistake, this will be the Chinese version of landing on the moon or manhattan project etc etc... the most critical, urgent, and important undertaking China has ever had to face in recent years...

There is no way America would back down from this.... if China cannot surpass this hurdle then American knows China will never complete its ideal of tech ascension and thus will eventually economically lag behind and will fall back and not be a contender to American supremacy anymore...

Short of a hot war, this is America's best bet to erase and contain/destroy China...

Yall recall Polesi was in drunken state of stupor and ranting on about how Huawei was a danger to American security and if EU allies jumped on the Huawei bandwagon it would be the end of the West?

Well she got her info from CIA. Pelosi don't know how to turn on a computer...

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We'll see, China will be sending envoys soon to negotiate. Time is on China's side no matter what due to COVID and recent unrest. If US wants to recover, they will need China.

Else they'll only be left with printing money. Looking at the recent rise in bond yields, I think China can crash the US market in a flash.

localizer said:

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I think there will be enough push back from industry to make Biden reverse a lot of the sanctions

TSMC simply doesn't have the capacity. And Intel is now an indian infested failing company.

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@localizer,

A wafer shortage? it's a good thing that China recently had a major breakthrough in 12 inch wafer equipment and its raw material crystalline silicon wafer. With auto chips it doesn't need a lower node, a 28nm or a 22nm is largely in used.

ansy1968 said:

@localizer,

A wafer shortage? it's a good thing that China recently had a major breakthrough in 12 inch wafer equipment and its raw material crystalline silicon wafer. With auto chips it doesn't need a lower node, a 28nm or a 22nm is largely in used.

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We'll let those Chinese companies figure it out.

Whole world is relying on TSMC right now. If US tries further to deny China tech we might as well just finish the Taiwan thing and get it over with.

According to an article I found in a chinese forum it looks like Fujian Jinhua has managed to start producing DRAM. If you remember Jinhua was the first Chinese semiconductor company to be put on the US entity list barring it from buying any US technologies. If this is true it would be a fantastic piece of news as it would demontrate that the US entity list is useless and Chinese semi equipment vendors can substitute US companies. Bear in mind that DRAM is considered to be difficult to produce.

"Taking the new generation of information technology as an example, our province continues to promote the "Enhanced Core and Strong Screen" project-Xiamen Lianxin Fujian's first fully automated 12-inch wafer production line continues to expand production capacity; Quanzhou Jinhua successfully developed 25nm memory with independent intellectual property rights Chips are in small batch trial production"

Alb said:

According to an article I found in a chinese forum it looks like Fujian Jinhua has managed to start producing DRAM. If you remember Jinhua was the first Chinese semiconductor company to be put on the US entity list barring it from buying any US technologies. If this is true it would be a fantastic piece of news as it would demontrate that the US entity list is useless and Chinese semi equipment vendors can substitute US companies. Bear in mind that DRAM is considered to be difficult to produce.

"Taking the new generation of information technology as an example, our province continues to promote the "Enhanced Core and Strong Screen" project-Xiamen Lianxin Fujian's first fully automated 12-inch wafer production line continues to expand production capacity; Quanzhou Jinhua successfully developed 25nm memory with independent intellectual property rights Chips are in small batch trial production"

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@Alb ,

which is more complicated to produce DRAM or NAND? YMTC is producing DRAM, CXMT is NAND or DRAM?

ansy1968 said:

@Alb ,

which is more complicated to produce DRAM or NAND? YMTC is producing DRAM, CXMT is NAND or DRAM?

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I am not an expert but from what I read DRAM is more difficult to produce than NAND. YMTC is doing NAND CXMT is doing DRAM.

Alb said:

I am not an expert but from what I read DRAM is more difficult to produce than NAND. YMTC is doing NAND CXMT is doing DRAM.

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@Alb ,

Thanks bro, appreciated.

manqiangrexue said:

@WTAN claims to be an insider who has connections in the Chinese lithography and semiconductor industry because he work(ed)/(s) in that field. Obviously, there is the possibility that he's just not, but similar to Chinese military-watching, if you wanna be ahead of the curve, you will need to find sources like big shrimp who can divulge things long before they are published. He makes me cautiously optimistic, no more than that.

If they were all published, we could find it ourselves and he wouldn't be an insider.

The rumors don't have a materialization date that is due yet so it would be funny if they had already materialized. They would be published and no longer rumors.

That's getting a little ahead of ourselves. The tech war just started and China basically just made it to a middle income country from a dirt poor country at the turn of the millennium. Growing into a high income country isn't a short-term goal. The short-term goal is to use China's collective power to conquer tech, building the foundation to become a high income country.

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Thanks for the explanation Manqiangrexue.

I understand that everyone wants evidence about new developments in the form of Newspaper articles from China sources and even Japanese, Taiwanese and even from the CIA controlled New York Times. I dont blame them.

The information i provided about CETCs 45nm Lithograph is so recent that i doubt many journalists in China even know about it. Most articles about CETC are written when their Semiconductor machinery has already been delivered to the customer.

I managed to get hold of this report below:

January 06, 2021 at 12:28. On January 5, the groundbreaking ceremony of the China Electronics Technology (Beijing) integrated circuit core equipment autonomous and industrialization construction project (Phase I) was held in Beijing, China Electronics Technology Deputy General Manager Yang Jun, Deputy Director of the Management Committee of Beijing Economic and Technological Development Zone and member of the Working Committee Chen Xiaonan attended the ceremony.

This is another landmark project for the independent and controllable development of the core equipment of integrated circuits in China Electronics Technology's system. It is important for solving the problems of broken and short chains in the national integrated circuit industry and building an equipment system that supports the independent and controllable development of integrated circuits in my country. Significance.

This project is the assembly of lithography machines, with an annual output of 20 lithography machines. The specific product plan is shown in the table below. (Note that this is not a lithography machine from Shangwei, but a lithography machine assembled by CEC. CEC has the maintenance and assembly capabilities of lithography machines.)
Serial number Product name Product specification unit Annual output
1 Lithography machine 0.35μm 12
2 0.13μm lithography machine 6
3 Lithography machine 65nm units 2
4 Total units 20
Expected date of commissioning: 2021.12 The

project is located in the X45F2 plot of the Beijing Economic and Technological Development Zone and will be constructed in two phases. This project is the

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This report is about the commencement of construction of CETCs Lithograph factory.
It mentions production of 2 Units of 65nm Lithographs by the end of 2021.
Now, CETC labels its DUVL as having 65nm Resolution.
(Unlike SMEE which uses for eg 28nm node or 65nm node)
This means CETCs DUVL is called a 45nm node DUVL or in other words is able to produce a 45nm Chip with a single exposure. CETC prefers to specify their DUVL as having 65nm resolution similar to ASML, Nikon etc.

Hope you are all convinced now.