Chinese semiconductor industry

antiterror13 said:

but I think if the US tell Japan to stop cooperating with China ... Japan would obey to the US, sadly

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If they do not want to sell to China, then they should be prepared to lose the entire market.

Dare.

Double dare.

That's what CCP is saying.

The CCP is the most powerful entity and loudest voice here without a doubt, since this fight is happening inside China.

Appix said:

I have one answer: fuck Japan. We should not source critical and strategical material from a country that since 1894 has only brought one or the other way misery upon us. What Japan can realize with or without cooperation is not my concern. My concern lies wholly with China and the establishment of a domestic semiconductor supply chain. We should have learned our lessons the past generations when dealing with USSR, West-Europe, Japan and USA. I prefer realism and not doves who again want to lay critical levers in the hands of a stooge of the American Empire.

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Stop namecalling, or again this thread will be closed.

The news that Europe is going to start making their own processors to avoid being dependent on "other countries" is great news. See even with Biden in office everyone knows they can't risk another Trump being voted in the future. It's not everything goes to back the way it was before Trump. They don't tell you they also want to make money from China. Americans keep forgetting in the drunkenness of their power, they think China will collapse without them... again. No, not only will China make their own but others will too with one of purposes is to be able to sell to China if they want to keep that industry viable for the foreseeable future. And they will have to keep striving to make a better mousetrap which is the whole idea of competition that the US peddled to everyone to promote advancement. But of course, the US doesn't really want that except for themselves and not for everyone else to compete with the US. China doesn't have to worry because China is the market they want to sell to.

AssassinsMace said:

The news that Europe is going to start making their own processors to avoid being dependent on "other countries" is great news. See even with Biden in office everyone knows they can't risk another Trump being voted in the future. It's not everything goes to back the way it was before Trump. They don't tell you they also want to make money from China. Americans keep forgetting in the drunkenness of their power, they think China will collapse without them... again. No, not only will China make their own but others will too with one of purposes is to be able to sell to China if they want to keep that industry viable for the foreseeable future. And they will have to keep striving to make a better mousetrap which is the whole idea of competition that the US peddled to everyone to promote advancement. But of course, the US doesn't really want that except for themselves and not for everyone else to compete with the US. China doesn't have to worry because China is the market they want to sell to.

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Hi mace,

A good one, they wanted to consolidate their advantages NOW, before the Americans steal anymore of it's crown jewel. A likely target is ASML , Infineon and others. As you said they had seen their vulnerability not only with the US but also China. In the future China, the US and the EU will want to build their own independent IC, the only problem I can see is who will buy their product if 2 of it's major customer is self sufficient, the European and the US will loose out due to cost and most developing countries can't afford it. The likely winner is China as it has the market and scale to make it profitable. And as horse mentioned in his previous post, The CCP is the most powerful entity and loudest voice here without a doubt, since this fight is happening inside China.

AssassinsMace said:

The news that Europe is going to start making their own processors to avoid being dependent on "other countries" is great news. See even with Biden in office everyone knows they can't risk another Trump being voted in the future. It's not everything goes to back the way it was before Trump. They don't tell you they also want to make money from China.

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Good observation, never thought of that.

Usually I discount this coalition coming to face down China. They been saying that for 100 years at least.

Maybe a coalition of lip service, but no coalition for semiconductors embargo. Those tech embargoes don't really work.

ansy1968 said:

Hi mace,

A good one, they wanted to consolidate their advantages NOW, before the Americans steal anymore of it's crown jewel. A likely target is ASML , Infineon and others. As you said they had seen their vulnerability not only with the US but also China. In the future China, the US and the EU will want to build their own independent IC, the only problem I can see is who will buy their product if 2 of it's major customer is self sufficient, the European and the US will loose out due to cost and most developing countries can't afford it. The likely winner is China as it has the market and scale to make it profitable. And as horse mentioned in his previous post, The CCP is the most powerful entity and loudest voice here without a doubt, since this fight is happening inside China.

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Hi ansy1968,

Thanks for the plug. You said it best brother of how this game of market share could develop.

Trump put America in a very difficult competitive position in the coming years.

The world may decide that in those two industries, semiconductors and telecom, do not rely on the Americans, for your own good to protect yourself.

horse said:

Hi ansy1968,

Thanks for the plug. You said it best brother of how this game of market share could develop.

Trump put America in a very difficult competitive position in the coming years.

The world may decide that in those two industries, semiconductors and telecom, do not rely on the Americans, for your own good to protect yourself.

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If I want to design something technology product, I wouldn't want to have any American content at all. Trump overplayed the US competitive edge in technologies and now backfiring very badly, awaken the giant (China) and the rest of the world, including EU and Japan as it could happen to them as well

horse said:

Hi ansy1968,

Thanks for the plug. You said it best brother of how this game of market share could develop.

Trump put America in a very difficult competitive position in the coming years.

The world may decide that in those two industries, semiconductors and telecom, do not rely on the Americans, for your own good to protect yourself.

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Hi horse,

Your insight is as sharp as ever.

I'm waiting what outcome the European, SK, TW and Japan will do, there's relief that Trump is on his way out, but the damage has been done, China which account's for nearly 60% world consumption of semiconductor will never again want to experience such trauma as its pursue a self sufficiency program. If China succeed in its domestic replacement, where will they sell their product, Like you said bro the collective sanction won't work, it may be difficult for China but it had the tools. What politician had been advocating is economic suicide.

ansy1968 said:

Hi horse,

Your insight is as sharp as ever.

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Hi ansy1968,

You're too kind, what I am just saying, I feel is just normal considerations.

Sometimes we have to make a decision. Ironically, doing nothing, that itself is a decision at times.

What I still rant about, is Trump's decision to cut off Huawei. Then SMIC.

These are desperate acts. This is all or nothing.

But, that is not the unusual part. The unusual part is that this is it, the United States is leaving this game. That is absurd. They are no longer fighting basically. Goldman of Asiatimes was correct. After this card, there are no more cards left for the United States to play.

That is why I feel it is so weird. In this fight, at this stage of the fight, where one side has played all their cards, but the outcome of the fight is not determined yet. All that means is this fight will be determined by only one side, which is the Chinese side. This ain't rocket science, this is more like extreme strategic dumb-dumbness. But it also shows weakness, and lack of strategic clarity.

It shows weakness, because they cannot fight anymore, other than badger their allies, who sooner or later tunes out. And if it shows weakness, you chase because the enemy is on the run. This is just basic stuff anyone who glanced sun zi bing fa would know.

Also, these are important lessons from Clauswich and warfare. The longer the campaign or attack progress, the weaker it gets. That is just how it is. At this stage of the fight, there just does not appear to be anything else the USA can do against Huawei.

I feel that is kind of important. China still has not really launched a counter attack on the United States, in commercial field or whatnot. But the CCP decided to destroy the trading relationship with Australia. The United States is not going to save the Australian-Chinese trading relationship. That again reflects Chinese strength and American weakness. Australia stuck up for America, at least it tried. What did the Americans do for Australia when Chinese launch these trade attacks against their deputy. That is why Morrison is such a dummy. He was used and abused. LOL!

Just my feeling at this stage of the, the CCP can attack at will at anywhere they want. They will attack. We know they just will. The CCP is brutal, it really is. That is why it wins.

They deserve it, that is how I truly feel. Justice is justice.



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I read a few stories lately off and on, actually I did not read them closely, just glanced at them, about how China is destroying or cracking down on Mongolian culture, in Inner Mongolia.

Now that is like a real weird story.

Of course, it is probably related to Chang 'e 5 because that is where it is landing.

I think that is the connection. Why did these anti-China Mongolian stories come out of the blue? Served no purpose.

If that is the way it is going to be, the nonstop demonetization, then CCP should attack. But it is a long war, do not play all your cards like you only got 4 years in office.

Awesome @horse .... spot on