Chinese purchase of Su-35

Equation

Equation

Lieutenant General
ahadicow said:
That's welcoming news. I have not returned to China for nearly 5 years now, my impression might be outdated. The last time I went back(2008), China has no google, no wikipedia, no youtube, no facebook. If want to read to english publication, there are selected few in the basement of the largeset bookstore in the whole of China. I felt I went into an isolation chamber.

The fact is freedom of expression is still a major problem in China. How can a country hope to compete in intellectual arena if such mandane basics as Google and Wikipedia are forbidden. I won't consider live in China much less do any intellectual work there based on this factor alone. Like it or not, Google and Wikipedia represent what world thinks. how are you able to function as global citizen, much less a world class scientist, in such a brain-cutoff from the rest of the world?

Now, the Chinese method that everybody stay in a lab and talk among themsalves might have worked in technology and engneeiring. It has 0 chance to work in science.
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HUH...Chinese space scientists and aeronautical professionals sure didn't need Google or Wikipedia or "freedom of expression" to successfully innovate their own accomplishments do they? Like it or not China is doing fine without Google or Wikipedia. Who gets to say what is the final definition of a "global citizen" is..the west? Believe me China creates plenty of hard core scientists to serve themselves well into the next century.
 
L

latenlazy

Brigadier
Equation said:
HUH...Chinese space scientists and aeronautical professionals sure didn't need Google or Wikipedia or "freedom of expression" to successfully innovate their own accomplishments do they? Like it or not China is doing fine without Google or Wikipedia. Who gets to say what is the final definition of a "global citizen" is..the west? Believe me China creates plenty of hard core scientists to serve themselves well into the next century.
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On broad base ahadicow is actually right about the importance of academic freedom to foster innovation and creativity. It's a very important factor in what we call in sociology "liquid networks". What China has done is limit the scope of that academic freedom. They've tried to foster it in engineering and hard science fields while they've tried to limit it in the field of humanities and social sciences. No one's going to say that China can't innovate with its strong social controls, but I would expect that in the big picture that pace of innovation will both be slower and might require more investment, especially in more consumer rather than industrial sectors of the economy.
 
K

kroko

Senior Member
Deino said:
Sorry, ... so that deal fell thru and the Russian side argued the reason was due to a "full" production line (= order book) ???


Deino :confused::(
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Sukhoi has been building Su-35 for the russian air force since 2009. The russian air force will receive 48 planes from 2011 to 2015.

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However, IMO thats not a valid reason to cancel any deal. If the plane couldnt be delivered now, it would have been delivered latter.

AFAIK no one in the russian news media is talking about this issue. I wonder why. Have they forgotten about it?
 
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S

Speeder

Junior Member
delft said:
They also have the numbers of scientists and engineers for the military as well as the civilian projects. The US is greatly dependent on immigrant scientists and engineers, attracting them with some of the best universities in the world but they're also changing their attitude to keeping them in the US. With an economy slowly growing thanks to immense money creation by the Fed and expected ( by the OECD ! ) to be overtaken as the largest in the world by China in 2016, the US is likely to loose its preeminence in science and engineering to China too.
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If you're a foreigner (not nationalitywise, just none ethnic Dutch) but good , or even very good, in your field you probably will survive Dutch enviroment, as many are very liberal and as a people most Dutch are quite humble.

Yet, if you belong to absolute toppers, the best of the best in your field, I have no doubt whatsoever in my mind that the Dutch will take you out with the first opportunity they can find, dispite top notch liberal and tolerant enviroment Dutch society has at uppermiddle, middle or lower levels.

Racist? probably yes. But to be fair, it is so in almost any country.
 
A

A.Man

Major
ahadicow said:
That's welcoming news. I have not returned to China for nearly 5 years now, my impression might be outdated. The last time I went back(2008), China has no google, no wikipedia, no youtube, no facebook. If want to read to english publication, there are selected few in the basement of the largeset bookstore in the whole of China. I felt I went into an isolation chamber.

The fact is freedom of expression is still a major problem in China. How can a country hope to compete in intellectual arena if such mandane basics as Google and Wikipedia are forbidden. I won't consider live in China much less do any intellectual work there based on this factor alone. Like it or not, Google and Wikipedia represent what world thinks. how are you able to function as global citizen, much less a world class scientist, in such a brain-cutoff from the rest of the world?

Now, the Chinese method that everybody stay in a lab and talk among themsalves might have worked in technology and engneeiring. It has 0 chance to work in science.
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It is not true at all. I go to China 3 to 5 times a year. I have found, nothing is close to what you hove said.
 
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siegecrossbow

siegecrossbow

General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Hard core Su-35 fans on CJDBY still think that they will strike a deal tomorrow ;)... Let's keep our fingers crossed :p
 
A

A.Man

Major
I hope this is not real!

【中国已同俄罗斯签署采购24架苏-35战斗机合同】央视《今日关注》报道，中俄刚刚签署了采购24架苏-35战斗机和4艘拉达级潜艇的合同，这是十年来中国首次向俄采购重大军事装备。未来中俄还会达成如S-400防空导弹，117S大推力发动机，伊尔-476M加油机等合作合同。

Google Translation:

【China has signed with Russia to purchase 24 Su-35 fighter contract] CCTV "concern" reports, China and Russia have just signed a purchase contract of 24 Su-35 fighters and four Lada-class submarines, which is China's first in a decade times the procurement of major military equipment to Russia. The future of China and Russia also reached a cooperation contract such as the S-400 anti-aircraft missiles, 117S high-thrust engine, tanker Il-476M.
 
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