Chinese military exports to other countries

Norinco VN1 8x8 amphibious armored Infantry Venezuelan Marina vehicle enters the water for wading and buoyancy tests in China, prior to its official release






I will now get back to bottling my Malbec

Civilian aircraft union on the way

(China Daily)New body will help manufacturers to enter the components sector Chinese aircraft parts manufacturers will set up a union soon to improve development of the civilian airliner industry, according to Zhang Hui, executive vice-president of AVIC International Holding Corp.

"We have decided to join hands with eligible private enterprises in the integration of domestic manufacturing capacity," Zhang said in an exclusive interview with China Daily.

This move will make it easier for them to enter the civilian aircraft components sector, he said.
"We will establish an aviation manufacturing industry union shortly and have signed strategic partnership memorandums with more than 20 companies," he added.

He said a convention for aircraft parts suppliers in China will be held in Beijing in mid-December.
Zhang's company is the export wing of the Aviation Industry Corp of China, the country's leading aircraft maker. It has been deeply involved with the subcontracting of civilian aircraft parts for international aerospace giants including Boeing Co and Airbus Group.

The latest move is also aimed at addressing some problems that have long hindered the sector's growth, Zhang said.
"Aircraft manufacturing is dominated by State-owned companies under AVIC, with each having the capability of producing all the components they need.

"As a result, a genuine industry chain has yet to be formed in the aviation sector," he said.
Zhang also said that most of China's aviation enterprises have long focused on military aircraft, which takes most government investment.

"This situation has resulted in the civilian aircraft sector being constrained by a lack of investment and the absence of overall planning," he said.

Zhang said the formation of a union is in response to calls from many private enterprises eager to have a share of the civilian aircraft sector.

He said his company is working with French firm Bureau Veritas, a leading agency in testing, inspection and certification, and plans to use this firm's expertise in supplier monitoring and certification to ensure product quality of the union members.

Some private enterprises in China have become suppliers to Commercial Aircraft Corp of China's C919 narrow-body airliner project, the country's latest attempt to break the Airbus and Boeing duopoly. The aircraft is set to compete with the Airbus A320, Boeing 737 and Irkut MS-21.

The private enterprises involved include Chengdu ALD Aviation Equipment Manufacturing Co and Jiangsu Tongming Group.
However, most domestic private companies that applied for a role in the C919 project were rejected because they lacked the required expertise and experience.

"A platform featuring swift exchange of information, unified quality standards and strong technological support can be a good solution for private enterprises to cope with their difficulties," Zhang said.
Wang Ya'nan, deputy editor-in-chief of Aerospace Knowledge magazine, said such a union is needed urgently for manufacturers of civilian aircraft parts.

"Most of them pick up small contracts that big State-owned companies are too busy to undertake. By following this path, they will never be able to obtain core technologies and key expertise" Wang said.
"Meanwhile, State-owned giants have allocated most of their capacity to the development and manufacturing of military aircraft, constraining growth of civilian airplanes."

The union will help to concentrate private businesses' resources and satisfy the huge demand for civilian aircraft parts, he added.

According to a report by the Aviation Industry Development Research Center of China, Chinese airlines will buy nearly 5,500 new planes from 2014 to 2033 to serve their rapidly expanding operations.





I will now get back to bottling my Malbec

An excerpt from an older article in the Glodalsecurity




"Saudi Arabia was reportedly considering purchasing the JF-17 Thunder fighter jet that was jointly produced by China and Pakistan. According to a January 2014 report in World Tribune, the Saudi Arabian Defence Ministry and Royal Saudi Air Force were reviewing the JF-17 program and considering becoming a partner in it. Pakistan had offered the JF-17 fighter to Saudi Arabia with technology transfer and co-production. The offer was apparently occurred when Saudi Arabian Deputy Defence Minister Prince Salman Bin Sultan visited Pakistan in January 2014, as he reportedly toured the JF-17 program while in the country."


I will now get back to bottling my Malbec

Broccoli said:

Official meeting where Chinese presented VN-1 wheeled and VN-16 tracked IFV's for Venezuela.
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Click to expand...

Does anyone know if the VN-1 and VN-16 have the same specs as their PLA service equivalents?

Much of China's military equipment is not that advanced relative to other exporters and their sales angle is often better prices and technology transfer. So my question is both in this specific case and in general does China export "monkey" versions of their hardware or do they sell the exact same equipment that they use?

I am leaning towards the exact same when the equipment is relatively basic such as armored vehicles but probably "monkey" versions when they are advanced such as SAMs. Thoughts?

Jeffrey Lewis talks about China-Saudi missile deals in a recent podcast.

Wow, that just shows how complex international arms trade can be. If you remember after Oliver North and Iran/Contra where the US was accused of selling weapons to both Iraq and Iran, as usual there were attempts to distract and to point the finger at China for selling to both sides. Now we know that the US played a role in getting Iraq Chinese weapons for then to accuse China of selling weapons to both sides. A role much more than what's accused of China.

Bangladeshi military testing their FM-90B SAM system (exported 2011).

Hi Miragedriver,
Looks like Argentina may finally get some new Naval Assets, Any thoughts.

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he Argentine Ministry of Defense selected the naval industry of China as its partner in building ocean patrol vessels program (OPV, its acronym in English) for the Flota de Mar - such as platinum Squad is called.
The agreement between the parties will be part of the comprehensive document on military cooperation in the industrial and scientific and technological fields that will be signed next week in Beijing, during the official visit of two days (3:04) that President Cristina Kirchner will make the China - retribution to the rapid passage of Chinese President Xi Jinping in Buenos Aires in July last year.

The Argentine admirals set in five the number of deep-sea patrol your fleet needs, but the contract to be signed initially provides only three units. Trading around these ships going on for over a year, and intensified after the Buenos Aires government set aside the German option, which involved the construction in their country, four OPV-80 Fassmer units, already adopted by the Armed Chile and Colombia.

The hiring of German class was so sure that to date, the site of Fassmer GmbH & Co. KG (

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) includes the Argentine Navy as ship user, next to the Marine Chile and Colombia ...

On 7 January last, in the article "Argentine Armada try, for the 3rd time, get your ocean patrol vessels," the Naval Power said the Internet that the alternative represented by patrol ship type P-18N Chinese, 1,700 tons, won "strength in recent months," between Buenos Aires authorities.

Last Friday (23:01), a meeting of the Minister of Argentine defense, Agustín Rossi, with the head of the Department of Commerce Military Chinese government, Zhang Chunli, held in Buenos Aires province capital, sacramented partnerships to be enshrined in this new stage of Sino-Argentine bilateral relations.

Confusion - The official statement on the meeting, issued by the Argentine Ministry of Defense, created confusion by listing on the agenda of the meeting, the "modernization of OPV." As the Argentine Navy never got to have a POS, it was impossible to imagine the reform something that did not exist ...

The explanation only came this week when Defense officials Binder explained that they had tried to interest the Chinese in OPV-80 design modification, whose technical detailing the Argentine government acquired the Chilean shipyard Asmar, in 2012, for $ 3 million. Asians, however, rejected the idea, considering the manufacturing plans of the German model incompatible with their production methodology.

The Argentines themselves to be seduced by the idea of getting the patrol P-18N, after representatives of Wuchan yard, the Chinese city of Wuhan, presented two relevant arguments in favor of their boats, recently provided the Navy Nigeria.

The first of these claims was about an offer built-in financing conditions in the current overview of trade between Beijing and Buenos Aires, where the debts assumed by the Argentines will be partly settled through commodity supplies.

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Stealth - The second trump card played by the Asians to the negotiating table was strategic military character: the chance of the Argentine Navy get your first ship combat stealth - that is, with effective features of stealth - and thus climb a technological step.

According to the explanations of builders and Chinese military, thanks to construction techniques and material used in the manufacture of the ship, the radar signature of a P-18N will appear on the screens of any enemy as a vessel of 500 tons, and not a ship of 1,700 tons. The actual dimensions of the vessel can only be detected when the vessel is within walking distance.

Another decisive factor in the choice made by the Argentine was of course the price.

Although this item is not yet closed - depending on the equipment to the board Argentine vessels - the Chinese wave with a unit price for their patrol far below the $ 70 million each OPV-80 would cost.

Last year they delivered two P-18N Nigerians - accompanied by a Z-9 helicopter (Chinese copy of Dauphin navalisado) and spare - for $ 48.5 million each. And the government of Lagos still pay most of the order value with oil.

Flexibility - The P-18N model is a variant of the corvette fast door-missile type 056 Chinese, a very light ship (1,300 tons) whose speed (kept secret) can be estimated at around 30 knots.

The P-18N to be supplied to the Argentine is possibly different from the Nigerian Navy ship delivered in the same way that the Nigerian boat was different from the model P-18N only 1,450 tons in 2005, was the Pattani class, Navy Thailand.

For Argentines, the unfavorable side of these negotiations is that the Chinese resist enable Tandanor shipyard to build the P-18N model. For now, it is certain that at least the first two ships of that class will be built in Wuhan.

The Naval Power, the representative of a European shipbuilding industry estimated that the Chinese tend to build very large military ships and requiring numerous crews, which possibly reflects its low automation and wide availability of staff. He noted, for example, that China's Coast Guard has just incorporated a 10,000 tons area control ship ...

The P-18N measuring 95.5 m long, 80.6 m from the German OPV-80. The Chinese model requires 70 crew, while the OPV-80 can be operated with up to 30 officers and enlisted.

Other relevant data in the acquisition of the Chinese boat with regard to the flexibility of the manufacturer in the rigging. In Chinese Navy P-18N is equipped with a HPJ26 cannon, 76mm, and two modern HPJ14, 30mm, controlled by electro-optical sensor. But this can be changed.

The "Pattani" Thai was endowed with Western weapons: Oto Melara cannon 76/62 Super Rapid, two 20mm cannon of the South African Denel and two heavy machine guns US Ordnance M2HB .50 caliber.

I was looking into various air forces around the world and came to the conclusion that China has actually quite a large market for its combat planes. Here's a list of countries that either already use chinese fighters or currently use old mig21, mirage or f5ii that warrant replacement in the next 5-10 years:

Thailand
Myanmar
Sri Lanka
Pakistan
Yemen
Mali
Nigeria
Sudan
Eritrea
Ethiopia
Congo
Kenya
Tanzania
Zambia
Mozambique
Zimbabwe
Namibia
Botswana
Cuba
Ecuador
Colombia
Argentina

Of course not all are politically viable, but actually most do already have some chinese aircraft. With ever increasing quality/cost ratio that new airfract may bring - i do dare to say more than half of those countries on the list seem likely to buy next gen of chinese planes, even if that means simple FTC2000 or similar.

In addition to that there's always possiblity of new buyers that may've not operated fighters up until now or have had their air force reconstituted recently. Mongolia, Tajikistan, Kyrgistan, Somalia.

Then there's always possiblity of Iran, as international sanctions may or may not last for decades more.