Chinese MALE, HALE (and rotary, small, suicide) UAV/UCAV thread

[valysre]

I'm surprised how quiet drones are. Out in the battlefield there's no lights. Are you going to turn on a flash light to see to expose yourself? Like I said before if you watch video of homemade suicide drones at work and the enemy doesn't notice them until it's too late and it's out in the daylight. Again Hezbollah flew drones over Israeli strategic areas without being discovered until is was posted on the internet. Don't you think the Israelis would have the technology to detect them? It just shows you how there's a lot assumptions about warfare that are not true. Who would've thought an M1 Abrams can be destroyed by essentially is a toy drone. Drones have completely change the battlefield and how people see it. One would think drones can easily be countered but apparently they're not. Nearly all anti-drone tech requires something to be aimed at the drone to make it work. At night you don't know where it is.

Out in the battlefield that you suggest using the drone in, it will be very quiet. No lights, no vehicles moving around, just soldiers on watch for the night, listening for those pesky drones that everyone seems so fond of using.
The noise of drones that can carry and aim a rifle will be much louder than the noise of a drone that carries a kilogram of explosive. Rifle is heavier, larger, and more cumbersome than a little chunk of C4.
I guarantee that you try and stealthily fly a drone carrying a rifle within 20 meters of an alert sentry, they will hear the approach.

 

[AssassinsMace]

It's the opposite of irrelevant, because forcing them to hide is literally the whole point of suppressive fire in the first place.

It is irrelevant when you're dead.

 

[AssassinsMace]

Out in the battlefield that you suggest using the drone in, it will be very quiet. No lights, no vehicles moving around, just soldiers on watch for the night, listening for those pesky drones that everyone seems so fond of using.
The noise of drones that can carry and aim a rifle will be much louder than the noise of a drone that carries a kilogram of explosive. Rifle is heavier, larger, and more cumbersome than a little chunk of C4.
I guarantee that you try and stealthily fly a drone carrying a rifle within 20 meters of an alert sentry, they will hear the approach.

This is where your own logic of centimeters and degrees works against you. And you think you can find a drone at night and accurately by sound alone hit it to take it down...?

 

[Wrought]

It is irrelevant when you're dead.

No, it's still perfectly relevant. Because one death does not stop an enemy squad or platoon or company or any other formation, because armies do not fight alone. That's kinda the whole point of having an army in the first place.

Reality is not a videogame. Do you understand why armies are not purely composed of snipers?

 

[valysre]

This is where your own logic of centimeters and degrees works against you. And you think you can find a drone at night and accurately by sound alone hit it to take it down...?

I don't think it's necessary to shoot down the drone, just know where it is and move to cover. After all, you're trying to kill the soldiers, and they just hear you coming and run.

I think a far more effective tactic for night-time drone usage is to use the drone to sporadically fire towards where the enemy bivouacs. This will either keep them awake all night, or train them to ignore night-time gunfire, allowing actual attacks.

 

[AssassinsMace]

No, it's still perfectly relevant. Because one death does not stop an enemy squad or platoon or company or any other formation, because armies do not fight alone. That's kinda the whole point of having an army in the first place.

Reality is not a videogame. Do you understand why armies are not purely composed of snipers?

And you the think people being sniped at will just put up their shields to protect themselves...? The drone will just move to another position to get a better shot.

 

[Wrought]

And you the think people being sniped at will just put up their shields to protect themselves...? The drone will just move to another position to get a better shot.

Are human snipers somehow incapable of moving to another position to get a better shot?

Again, do you understand why armies are not purely composed of snipers? It's not because humans can't fly; we've had the technology to make humans fly for a long time now.

 

[AssassinsMace]

I don't think it's necessary to shoot down the drone, just know where it is and move to cover. After all, you're trying to kill the soldiers, and they just hear you coming and run.

I think a far more effective tactic for night-time drone usage is to use the drone to sporadically fire towards where the enemy bivouacs. This will either keep them awake all night, or train them to ignore night-time gunfire, allowing actual attacks.

Then what's the point where you say sound will help them know where it's at? Maybe you're forgetting how this is about night operations where FLIR might be used. In Ukraine they're hiding in trenches where from another angle they will be seen. Finding other cover really doesn't help unless you're in a bomb shelter. How many of them are going to be out there on a battlefield?

 

[AssassinsMace]

Are human snipers somehow incapable of moving to another position to get a better shot?

Again, do you understand why armies are not purely composed of snipers? It's not because humans can't fly; we've had the technology to make humans fly for a long time now.

Where did I say they're incapable? You're the one so gung ho over suppression fire. That usually means the side that suppression fire is aimed at stays in place hiding because like you say, they don't want to be hit. When they move around, they're exposing themselves.

 

[valysre]

Then what's the point where you say sound will help them know where it's at?

If in response to the hiding from drones, the soldiers can hear the direction of the drone, they will put something between them and the drone. Thus, sound will help them.
If in response to the wakey-wakey shots, the soldiers can hear the direction of the drone, they will still wake up because of gunfire, thus preventing them from getting sleep and conducting excellent psychological attrition.

Maybe you're forgetting how this is about night operations where FLIR might be used.

Not sure how this is relevant to what I've said. Doesn't matter if you can see targets if there's a tree between you and the target. By the way, has it occurred to you that drones show up pretty bright on FLIR too? Electric motors are pretty hot.

In Ukraine they're hiding in trenches where from another angle they will be seen. Finding other cover really doesn't help unless you're in a bomb shelter. How many of them are going to be out there on a battlefield?

The soldier hears the drone slowly moving (because it's not going to move fast with a 5kg gun strapped to it), and then repositions to have cover between him and the drone.
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I think that you have become infatuated with this hi-tech sci-fi concept of autonomous killer drones operating in situations that humans are less suited for, without considering that all the examples that you cite of autonomous killer drones are much simpler (flying grenade simple) than your idea.