Chinese Economics Thread

[vesicles]

global warming could be caused by just natural change in temperature or human factors.

Yep. People say that the climate on earth fluctuates greatly. The past ten thousand years of mild weather is actually very unusual, which has allowed creatures like human to thrive. No one knows whether global warming we are seeing is simply our mother earth getting back to her old self, or man-made. It's possible we are heading to the next ice age, which is the normal and natural pattern for earth climate changes.

I think the term "global warming" is misleading although the initial stage is warming of the planet. The end would be global chaos: extremely hot south (hurricanes and typhoons) and extremely cold north (snow storms and blizzards all year long and becomes uninhabittable), which is bad news for most people since most of the people live in the northern hemesphere.

 

[bladerunner]

Unless Im mistaken, the planet has warmed up over the last few decades, now whether the phonomena has quickened due to man's activities is open to debate. I think one of the points the scientists are making is that the cycle is occuring at ever closer intervals, suggesting human activity could be a cause.

If some of the suggestions that the 3 Gorges dam has been a screw up with some unforseen consequences is true, Im not confident that they would do a better job managing the increased flow from the melting glaciers in Tibet.

Warmer temps mean less seasonal snow and ice forming, this could result in less water over time flowing into the dams if it became serious enough.

 

[AssassinsMace]

And do environmentalists tell the straight truth or do they exaggerate to the least in order to scare people into action? Can you really trust people who know that viliflying the US about being worst polluter in the world doesn't get sympathy to their cause so they wait until China coughs up one particle of carbon more to sound the alarm bells? And we're suppose to believe anything they say when that alone say they're motivated by politics?

 

[bladerunner]

Cuts both ways, using a phrase that has become popular,'We are just kicking the can down the road if we dont take serious steps to lessen man's footprint'

 

[AssassinsMace]

And who was the first one to kick the can? And who was against nuclear power for energy? I've read some the anti-nuclear activists back in the day now regret their actions? And the world is suppose to obey anyone that hides behind the environment?

And I love how US and European wind farmers are complaining about China not buying their windmills. If China can make windmills faster and cheaper isn't that better for the environment? WHich bring ups the green activists who think about the dollar before the environment. The developed world wants the developing world to go green... by buying their expensive technology.

 

[vesicles]

And do environmentalists tell the straight truth or do they exaggerate to the least in order to scare people into action? Can you really trust people who know that viliflying the US about being worst polluter in the world doesn't get sympathy to their cause so they wait until China coughs up one particle of carbon more to sound the alarm bells? And we're suppose to believe anything they say when that alone say they're motivated by politics?

I know one thing. Most of the theories in environmental science are being done in computer simulations. If their simulation is similar to anything being done in biology/medicine, I would think that the outcome of these simulations only can only be true and applicable under certain pre-set conditions or assumptions. No one ever mentions those conditions or assumptions when they talk about "dooms day" scenarios. Some of the mathematical conditions they set for their calculations may not even exist in our solar system.

I don't know if you guys are familiar with a discovery channel show called "storm chaser". It talks about a bunch of meterologists chasing tornatos. It's been 2 seasons and they have not yet caught one good tornato. And the lead meterologist is said to be one of the best in the field and got some of the most fancy equipments out there. If their theories and models can't even predict where a tornato would hit within the next day or two, how can I believe that they can predict the climate of our planet in the next ten thousand years?:nono::nono::nono:

Also if you look at the weather forecasts, they always say we got 30% chance storm, etc... If they can only predict next week's weather to the acuracy of some percentage, what is the percentage of global warming? 100%? 10%? or 0.0000001%?

 

[AssassinsMace]

People should be concerned about the environment and preservation of nature. But are we going to obey the likes of people who obviously have a bad track record and are only now being alarmed because prosperity is not just a first world's game now? And you really have to be suspicious that they continue to use the tactic of intimidation through vilifying people. That's act of those concerned with power and not of the environment.

China doing it faster and cheaper is probably going to do more for the developing world going green than anything the usual suspects will ever do. Anybody watch Whale Wars? Those people outright lie and it's on tape and they don't care. Do they care about convincing the Japanese people not to consume whale meat? No, because as usual this more about power and seeing people obey their commands than saving the whales. This display of arrogance is really more for people in the US. You see this mentality in Washington. If one thinks they're right, they don't have to educate or convince or sway. They just bark out orders and they expect you to obey. That's all in fine if you're exercising you're belief in your own power. But is that going to get the job done faster or will that just piss people off where nothing ever gets done? And just like in Washington anything less than barking out an order and expecting obedience is a sign of weakness so they have no other tactic except barking out orders and expecting people to obey. Yeah sure the'll say they tried to educate but I bet the first thing they ever did was intimidate through vilifying.

 

[Engineer]

The developed world wants the developing world to go green... by buying their expensive technology.

The classic example of that is where a bunch of people "concerned" about poverty encouraging people in Africa to use solar energy -- the most expansive method of power generation possible for the poorest people.:roll:

 

[bladerunner]

It can only get cheaper now that Chinas entered the solar power, game.

 

[Engineer]

It can only get cheaper now that Chinas entered the solar power, game.

China brought the price down on solar cells, but solar power still remains the most expansive method of producing electricity. The solar panels are expansive to produce, they are expansive to install, and you get very little out of them. In fact, solar power is still beyond the reach of average people in the West. And yet, you see these people pushing solar power onto poor people in Africa.