Chinese Economics Thread

tidalwave

Senior Member
Registered Member
India media claiming success at boycotting Chinese goods because China 's denial of NSG and China support of Pakistan.

Well, how come China have No success in boycotting Japanese, korean goods?

Have to learn from the Indians.?

ww.thehindu.com/news/international/china-warns-boycott-of-its-goods-will-hit-indiabound-investments/article9276419.ece
 

Blackstone

Brigadier
US intelligence in US embassy in Germany tells German officials to block CHina purchase of AIXTRON , citing defense risk WITHOUT Giving Any Evidence. That's PURE BS. More likely, US doesn't want China to advance.

AIXTRON is a maker of LED equipment for Diodes. It doens't make Military products or

Germany subsequently take away the approval for CHina to buy AIXTRON.

So, Germany is a DAWG of US now?
puppet master is everywhere now and alot of it is under the table.

This is how insecure the hegemon becomes. It's stuff pure economic reason and it spins around and tag as military issue.

Using military issue to enhance its protectionism.
Germany isn't a "DAWG" of US or anyone else. It has its own national interests, which dictate its actions. American neocons and liberal imperialists, in their infinite "wisdom," have decided China must be contained, so they're pulling out the stopper for the try. Given that, it's more accurate to consider Aixtron IP and products might have duel-use capabilities, which make encircling China harder. Ergo the acquisition must be stopped. It also 'feels good' to irk those Commie bastards in Beijing, but that's just icing on the cake.

Personally, I think these people are delusional and therefore dangerous to US security and national interests. I say that because China is no longer containable, in the old Soviet-era sense, and anything less would ultimately be ineffective. Worse, the pursue of an unattainable objective against another nuclear-armed great power would end up harming US interests and security in Asia and around the world. Those caught between Washington and Beijing would end up paying most of the bill. They know it. They don't like it. They don't want it. They have no choice.
 

Blackstone

Brigadier
China seems to be doing well in Africa, and enjoys support from most Africans.

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Scholars and analysts debate about China’s growing influence in Africa. Just in The Monkey Cage, we’ve featured posts asking whether China’s influence in Africa is
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, how China’s role in Africa
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, why fearing Chinese aid to Africa
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, and still
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. These accounts are largely written from an American perspective.

But what do Africans think of China’s influence in Africa?

This week,
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— an African-led research network conducting surveys in 36 African countries — released
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. They’re mostly positive.

imrs.php

Across the countries surveyed, 63 percent of respondents thought China’s economic and political influence in their country was positive. In Mali, 92 percent of citizens said China’s influence in Mali was positive. The countries in which less than half of the respondents had a positive opinion about China’s influence included Algeria, Egypt, Ghana, Lesotho, Madagascar, Morocco and Zimbabwe.

While still positive, the average African opinion on China’s economic development assistance was less enthusiastic. Afrobarometer asked, “In your opinion, does China’s economic development assistance to your country do a good job or a bad job of meeting the country’s needs, or haven’t you heard enough to say?” More than half (56 percent) of the nearly 54,000 survey participants though China’s development assistance was doing a good job in their country, with Malians again having the highest proportion of citizens with favorable attitudes (88 percent).

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Commentary on political science and political issues.



Why does China have such a positive image in Africa? Afrobarometer asked survey participants to name what factor contributes most to a positive image of China in their country. The most frequent response was China’s investment in infrastructure and development (32 percent), followed by the low cost of Chinese products (23 percent).

Cheap Chinese products, however, are also a source of China’s negative image in Africa. The poor quality of Chinese products was the most significant factor shaping Afrobarometer’s survey participants’ negative images of China — mentioned by 35 percent of respondents. Second to product quality in shaping a negative image of China was the perception among Africans that Chinese take jobs or business from locals — mentioned by 14 percent of respondents.

These mostly positive assessments of China do not necessarily mean China has displaced the West in Africans’ attitudes toward external influences. On the contrary, many Africans (30 percent) see the United States as the most popular model for national development, followed closely by China (24 percent). Likewise, more Africans see their former colonial powers as having the greatest influence (28 percent), compared to China (cited by 23 percent) and the United States (cited by 22 percent).

So, if we had to place this report of citizens’ attitudes on a continuum of concern about China in Africa, it would join the growing chorus of scholars that China’s influence in Africa is not something to be feared.
 

Blackstone

Brigadier
China's reform from a manufacturing and export-based economy to one based on service and consumption seems to be doing well.

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While China's position as factory to the world gets a lot of attention, the country's economy is building out its service sector — and it is making rapid progress.

Services now account for 50% of China's GDP, up from 42% 10 years ago, according to
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. This continuing shift may indicate the government's planned move toward services, innovation, and household consumption as the new economic drivers is going along to plan.

As
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, "the answer to the question of whether China's economy is sinking or swimming lies in its service sector."

china2-chart.png


Source: World Bank, World Databank, as of 2015.



Services still have significant room to grow
Bloomberg reports there are already
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in retail, restaurants, hotels, and real estate. But the size of the service sectors in both developed and developing nations around the world suggests China still has significant room to grow.

The United States, for example, derives almost 80% of its GDP from services, according to
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. Japan and Germany get more than 71% each, while the United Kingdom and France are both near 80%.

Fellow emerging market countries Brazil, Russia, and India also have greater service sector contributions than China, deriving 67%, 60% and 57% of their GDP from services respectively.

This is a lead China wants to follow, with the country's
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. It's anticipated by China's leaders that growth driven by consumption and services can drive it to become a high-income nation.

This makes the current trajectory of China’s service sector worth a closer look.
 

Equation

Lieutenant General
Here's a good article on the prospective of China's economy.

[QUOTE
China's Only 15% Of The Global Economy But Contributes 25 - 30% Of Global Growth

It’s entirely possible to become a little over-enthusiastic about the size of China’s economy. Yes, assuming that we don’t count the European Union as one economy, it’s the second largest economy on the planet. If we do agglomerate Europe then it’s the third. But it’s also true that it’s around 15% or so of the global economy. That’s massively up from where it was in recent decades, entirely true, but it’s not that it is anything like the majority of what is going on out there.

We should be careful with these numbers of course, they’re not going to be accurate. We simply don’t measure the global economy in any particularly accurate manner. We could well be out by a few percentage points either way here. So keep that in mind.

However, there’s another way of looking at that Chinese economy and that’s to think of its contribution to global growth. There it’s more like 25-30% of total growth as the Chinese themselves
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:

On the other hand, as the second largest economy, China’s economic transition and growth is increasingly influencing the world economy. “It is estimated that the contribution of China’s economic growth to the world economy is expected to maintain at 25 to 30 percent, he said.


That the global economy is growing is of course a good thing. It means that more people can have more of what they desire–rather the point of our having an economy in the first place of course. And this greater contribution to global growth from that one, Chinese, economy is obviously because China is growing faster than the other similarly large economies. Yes, we can say that India is growing faster than China at present but that’s from a lower base. That extra size of the Indian economy each year is still very much smaller than the extra size of
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.

BEIJING: The contribution of China to the world economy will remain around 30 percent for the next five years, an expert said in remarks published on Sunday.

No, that’s not really what is being said. It is that the growth in China will be up to 30% of global growth, not that China is 30% of the global economy.


As to how much this matters to the rest of us the correct answer is not a lot. Most of this growth is within China and benefits Chinese people. Yes, a larger Chinese economy will mean more value being created which human beings can enjoy. But the vast majority of that increase in value is going to be enjoyed by the people in China. This isn’t a problem, it’s obviously good for the Chinese, but it doesn’t change our living standards all that much.

We will all gain, yes we will, but only at the margin. Greater Chinese exports, higher value exports, will mean that we can consume more and better products. Chinese consumption of what we make will produce more jobs and so on. But as with any economy the vast majority of what is going on is going on within the economy, not spilling out of it via trade. Thus this very conception of the global economy isn’t all that important. It’s interesting to note and of course we should all be happy that other people are getting richer. But the important economic point will be, as it always has been, how much are we producing and how well are we producing it? Because that’s what is going to determine what we can consume, our consumption being rather the point of the exercise as far as we are concerned.

][/QUOTE]

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Blackstone

Brigadier
A good article on China's re-balancing shortcomings. Agree or disagree, it's an interesting read.

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Leland Miller is the founder of China Beige Book, a highly coveted survey of what's going on with China's economy.

We asked him about the country's future, whether or not things are actually stabilizing, and what hedge fund billionaire Kyle Bass is missing with his famous prediction
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Linette Lopez: The Chinese are trying to pivot their economy from one based on manufacturing and industry to one based on services and domestic consumption - are they making a lot of headway there?

Leland Miller: No.There are two ways to look at this, either as a multi-year trend line or in terms of a Q3 snapshot, and neither of them suggest the Chinese economy is successfully rebalancing.The third quarter was particularly telling.China Beige Book data showed the growth drivers of the economy last quarter were exclusively "old economy" sectors - manufacturing, property, commodities - while the "new economy"-services and retail, for example - both weakened, quite notably in the latter’s case. Q3 is only one quarter, but it was a case study in how not to rebalance an economy.

Lopez: What do you think is the biggest misconception about the state of China's economy right now?

Miller: That recent data confirm China is once again "stable," and therefore not something that will likely disrupt portfolios or trading strategies over the coming year.

The new "stability" narrative goes something like this: After a tough early 2016, China recovered nicely in Q2 and then basically saw a repeat performance in Q3 (as evidenced by static official GDP and the recent PMIs).With a politically sensitive Party Congress scheduled for next fall, Beijing couldn’t be foolish enough to allow conditions to falter in the run-up, considering they can always use stimulus at will.So, all signs point to Beijing ensuring a continuum of stability between now and the end of 2017.

The problem is, this whole "China stability narrative" is flawed.From 30,000 feet, our Q3 headline revenue data also looked stable - but the underlying metrics from our 3,100+ firm survey were anything but: Nationwide we saw weaker profits, deteriorating cash flow, a complete reversal of rebalancing priorities, an increasingly stressed property sector, and a notable one-off jump in leveraged borrowing.

The quarter wasn’t a disaster by any means.But it’s critical to understand that stable headline numbers are not the same thing as a stable economy.If Beijing does indeed wish to ensure stability at all costs over the next year, it will be far more difficult, and much more costly, than investors realize.Too many investors are conditioning themselves to view any volatility over the coming year as a major surprise.That likely won’t end well.

Lopez: What are your clients asking you about these days? What are their concerns?

Miller: Over the past few months clients have been particularly focused on two (related) areas of the economy: property and commodities.In terms of property, everybody knows there is a bubble, but there really isn’t any consensus on how best to assess its fragility.China Beige Book data provide an edge here because we track cash flow, and in Q3 we saw this gauge slide deep into the red in each of our five property sub-sectors.When the so-called "moneyball" of trapped domestic capital does leave property - and that time is fast approaching - we’ll have advance notice of its departure.

Commodities is even more fascinating.There appears to be strong conviction amongst many hedge funds right now that the price rebound in coal is due primarily to the Chinese government finally following through on its pledges to shut down capacity.(It’s the same thesis, more or less, for steel and aluminum.)But is this really happening?China Beige Book’s capex and net capacity tracking data suggest a very different dynamic is at play, with major implications for next year.In other words, chances are rising that there could be even more buy-side blood on the street by early 2017.

Lopez: The Chinese government has said that it is going to try to be more transparent in its dealings - at least in terms of its economy. Have you seen any improvement there? Has data become more plentiful/reliable?

Miller: There are a lot of misconceptions over the quality of Chinese data.As everyone now knows, or should know, certain types of official data are simply laughable on their face - employment data, for instance.

A second category of data may provide some clues on directionality, but suffers from a variety of methodological and time-lag flaws, and is often manipulated anyway.GDP falls into this category.Western analysts use them, but they often do so (quite justifiably) with an asterisk.

Finally, there is a category of data which when used properly can provide some measure of helpful insight.I would put newer metrics such as Total Social Finance (TSF) into this category.However, even these data rarely say what analysts think they say.For example, annual TSF figures, notwithstanding some major methodological problems, are a substantial upgrade from their antecedent, which was bank lending.But when Beijing mandated its Statistics Bureau (NSB) provide that data monthly, the series became worthless - the NSB is simply not able to effectively break the data down into those shorter time periods.The NSB knows it, and most China watchers have caught on as well.But it’s astonishing how often monthly TSF volatility is treated by analysts as meaningful, when it’s usually just noise.

In sum, they are making some efforts to expand and improve official data, at least at the margins.But because political sensitivities predominate, the overall reliability continues to get worse, not better.

Lopez: Hedge fund billionaire Kyle Bass thinks the Chinese banking system could see a crisis by mid 2017. Do you think that's possible?

Miller: That depends entirely on how you define "crisis."Today, the banking system is effectively insolvent: It’s awash in non-performing loans; firms no longer respond to lower interest rates, and haven’t for a long time; SOEs don’t pay back their loans; local governments don’t pay back their loans; and most of shadow finance is a Ponzi scheme backstopped by implicit government guarantees.So, some might say, not unfairly, that we’re already seeing a crisis unfold.

However, if we’re to assume he means true contagion, then that is a far bolder call.The central problem with all of these hard landing/mega-devaluation theses has always been the presumption that China’s banking system is vulnerable to the same type of banking crisis that investors like Kyle successfully forecasted in the US and Europe.

That’s just not the case.China is a non-commercial financial system, which makes it much less likely to suffer all of the so-called "falling dominoes" that you might see play out in commercial financial systems: Widespread deposit flight out of banks, counterparties refusing to deal with each other, insolvent institutions taking down the system, etc.Leaving aside that Beijing has much greater firepower to push back against capital outflow pressures than just its oft-quoted forex reserve number (there is plenty more to tap inside the banking system, for instance), Beijing can simply move money around the system at will to ensure the most pressing problems are dealt with as they arise.

Make no mistake, this is not a recipe for success.In fact, it is inherently debilitating and will likely result in many years of economic stagnation.But in the shorter term, it does mean that China’s leaders have far more tools to fight their battles than most Western analysts, and way too many hedge funds, currently recognize.
 

Hendrik_2000

Lieutenant General
@Blackstone Those beige book has been consistently negative when it come to China Yet they were never been right I guess because they focus on large company or state own company which has low profitability.and drain o credit.But they are only half side of the story.And their share are shrinking with every year.
On the other had the small and medium enterprises are growing and profitable, dynamic .They provide the bulk of employment in Chinese economy

Today news of PMI proof that China economy are stabilizing. They are too fixated on classical indices common in the west. But Chinese economy are different the government has a lot of lever which is not available in the west

First posted by ZZabur

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---
Surprise SME surge pushes China’s PMI to a two-year high

Index rose to its highest level since July 2014, boosted by growth in new orders and improved readings from small and medium-sized enterprises

By BENNY KUNG and STEVE WANG CHINA, NOVEMBER 1, 2016 12:35 PM (UTC+8)
00
China’s official Purchasing Managers’ Index increased to its highest level since July 2014 in October, supported by growth in new orders and production activity. Improved readings from small and medium-sized enterprises led the jump while those from larger producers declined marginally.

The factory gauge reached 51.2, up from 50.4 during the previous two months, representing its fastest pace of growth since March 2011, according to statistics released by the National Bureau of Statistics on Tuesday morning. The numbers chimed with a separate reading from finance weekly Caixin. Any number above 50 signifies an expansion.

“China’s economy is stabilizing, mostly due to government policies,” said Zhong Zhengsheng, director of Macroeconomic Analysis at CEBM Group, a subsidiary of Caixin Insight Group. He worried, however, that factory production could slow down when government measures are stopped.


“The continuous rise in prices has further stimulated production,” said Zhao Qinghe, a senior National Bureau statistician. The Raw Material Purchase Price Index increased to 62.6 from 67.5 last month
.

More take-aways:

The index for large enterprises dropped to 52.5 by 0.1 compared to last month; that for small and medium-sized enterprises increased to 48.3 and 49.9 respectively, by 2.2 and 1.7
Indexes for production and new orders increased to 53.3 and 52.8 respectively, up by 0.5 and 1.9; those for new export orders and imports were 49.2 (down 0.9) and 49.9 (down 0.5) respectively
More than 40% of enterprises have limited liquidity and demand, especially small and medium-sized enterprises, statistician Zhao said
Non-manufacturing PMI increased by 0.3 to 54, with a “speedy growth” in the construction sector
 

Blackstone

Brigadier
@Blackstone Those beige book has been consistently negative when it come to China Yet they were never been right I guess because they focus on large company or state own company which has low profitability.and drain o credit.But they are only half side of the story.And their share are shrinking with every year.
On the other had the small and medium enterprises are growing and profitable, dynamic .They provide the bulk of employment in Chinese economy

Today news of PMI proof that China economy are stabilizing. They are too fixated on classical indices common in the west. But Chinese economy are different the government has a lot of lever which is not available in the west
I didn't say I agree with Leland Miller, only his article is an interesting read. Articles like his also provide balance for holistic evaluation. I currently lean toward views of Nicolas Lardy and Daniel Rosen on relative accuracy of NBS data, and sophisticated algorithms catching fake or erroneous data. But, if facts and data change, then I'll reevaluate my position.
 

Equation

Lieutenant General
Name another country that can tackle this kind of problem at this scale? I thought so.:D Isn't this the "greatest country in the world"?

[/
China to invest $140 billion by 2020 to relocate poor citizens
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October 31, 2016
2016-10-31T101723Z_1_LYNXMPEC9U0JQ_RTROPTP_2_CHINA-PARLIAMENT.JPG.cf.jpg

A man sits on top of a hill in Yuangudui village, Gansu Province February 12, 2013. REUTERS/Carlos Barria
BEIJING (Reuters) - China will invest 946.3 billion yuan ($140 billion) by 2020 to relocate its poorest citizens from remote, inland regions to more developed areas, the state planner said on Monday.

The mass relocation is part of a strategy to lift 10 million people out of poverty by 2020, with 2 million estimated to be moved this year, the state council said in May.

The funds will be used mainly to construct homes, support facilities and basic public infrastructure, with the rest going to the restoration of vacated lands, state planner National Development and Reform Commision (NDRC) said in a document.

The investment will be financed mainly by China's two policy banks - China Development Bank and Agricultural Development Bank of China, who will provide 341.3 billion yuan in long-term loans and 50 billion yuan in construction bonds - as well as by local governments, who will provide 285.8 billion yuan.

Local governments will also raise up to 100 billion yuan through bonds, while the central government in Beijing will allocate around 80 billion yuan. Relocated villagers are expected to contribute 21.5 billion yuan.

China's poor make up about 5 percent of a population of 1.4 billion, living mostly in the countryside and earning less than 2,300 yuan a year, according to the government and state media.

More than 12 million people were moved in earlier relocation efforts as of the end of last year, the NDRC said.

(Reporting by Yawen C

QUOTE]
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