Chinese Economics Thread

tamsen_ikard

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China’s Factory Floor Is Moving—But Not to India or Mexico​

Companies seeking alternatives to China are finding the country’s vast interior still holds big advantages​




This is an awesome article that shows the developments I have been looking for many years. Now my predictions are correct. China's interior is more competitive for cheap manufacturing compared to Vietnam or India. So China will continue to have both advance and cheap manufacturing at the same time due to differences between interor and coast.

But China's future massive growth to Japan or Korean levels of Prosperity cannot happen if the interior is not developed with Manufacturing. And the fast rise of the interior will support high growth rate for years to come.

But this wouldn't have been possible without massive investment in expressway network, waterway network and rail network. So, prudent choice by China to invest in the interior instead of the coast which will automatically develop. But the interior needed govt help
 

azn_cyniq

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China’s Factory Floor Is Moving—But Not to India or Mexico​

Companies seeking alternatives to China are finding the country’s vast interior still holds big advantages​




This is an awesome article that shows the developments I have been looking for many years. Now my predictions are correct. China's interior is more competitive for cheap manufacturing compared to Vietnam or India. So China will continue to have both advance and cheap manufacturing at the same time due to differences between interor and coast.

But China's future massive growth to Japan or Korean levels of Prosperity cannot happen if the interior is not developed with Manufacturing. And the fast rise of the interior will support high growth rate for years to come.

But this wouldn't have been possible without massive investment in expressway network, waterway network and rail network. So, prudent choice by China to invest in the interior instead of the coast which will automatically develop. But the interior needed govt help
Can someone post the entire article here?
 

drowingfish

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China’s Factory Floor Is Moving—But Not to India or Mexico​

Companies seeking alternatives to China are finding the country’s vast interior still holds big advantages​




This is an awesome article that shows the developments I have been looking for many years. Now my predictions are correct. China's interior is more competitive for cheap manufacturing compared to Vietnam or India. So China will continue to have both advance and cheap manufacturing at the same time due to differences between interor and coast.

But China's future massive growth to Japan or Korean levels of Prosperity cannot happen if the interior is not developed with Manufacturing. And the fast rise of the interior will support high growth rate for years to come.

But this wouldn't have been possible without massive investment in expressway network, waterway network and rail network. So, prudent choice by China to invest in the interior instead of the coast which will automatically develop. But the interior needed govt help
interesting, the only way to retain manufacturing really is to also be the market. the only viable option for manufacturers to move from coastal shores to hinterlands is for the coast to become the market that consumes their product. without this huge domestic market, then any competitive edge created by superior workforce quality and infrastructure will erode over time. so what this article describes here really is simply a sign that China's consumer market is quite large, nothing new here.
 

In4ser

Junior Member
I'm glad China is succeeding with its interior development. I haven't very heard very much about it aside from occasional reference to it related to BRI.

From what I see this approach has a multi-faceted strategy:
  1. Provide jobs and opportunities to poorer interior
  2. Prevent the need for mass migration to cities and Hukou system
  3. Offer cheaper cost of living and housing to overcrowded coastal cities (which in turn should also encourage people to settle down and have more kids as Tier 1 and even Tier 2 cities are getting expensive)
  4. Add strategic depth from naval blockade by securing routes to key resource providers like Russia and Central Asia
  5. Keep manufacturing supply chains and expertise within China from being moved abroad like Viet Nam.
 

Maikeru

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Registered Member
From the "Beijing to Britain" newsletter:

Baillie Gifford China Growth Trust PLC posted weak half-year results - but is actually similar to other funds in this space.
• Less than ideal results from Baillie Gifford China Growth Trust PLC, the Edinburgh-based China-focused fund. Tuesday’s half-year results noted that its net asset value (NAV) total return underperformed against its benchmark in the six months to July 31. Per share fell 19% to 265.66 pence from 328.87p at January 31.
• The trust blamed China’s property market, which it observed has “deteriorated further, leading to concerns around financial stability.” Dryly it noted “Property company Country Garden and trust company Zhongzhi Enterprise Group made headlines for missing coupon payments on their debt. This led to predictions of the collapse of China's financial system - the same kind of dire prognostications made in 2001, 2008 and the Covid lockdowns.”
• However, justifying their optimism that things may yet turn around in China, BGCG said in its report “While weakness in property hurts growth within the economy, we think the risk of financial instability is low. Property sales are down almost 50 per cent from their 2021 peak but prices have barely budged. Why? Because China never experienced the asset price bubble that has precipitated almost every property market collapse in developed markets. Property prices have grown at around 7 per cent per annum over the last decade, but income growth has surpassed this at around 10 per cent per annum. Property should have become more affordable. And while developers such as Country Garden have become over-indebted, the Chinese consumer remains in very good health.”
• Policymakers should note BCGC’s following observations on why activity is “so depressed”:
• “Firstly, Covid lockdowns undoubtedly hurt consumer confidence. It's important to remember that lockdowns only ended in China in January this year, versus almost 18 months ago in the west. In addition, the size of the Chinese government's stimulus package equated to around only 10 per cent of GDP versus an average of 70 per cent in the West, and Chinese stimulus did not take the form of direct handouts. Instead, consumers saved
up an estimated $7tn of excess savings from their own earnings. Consumers, therefore, have money to spend and, as the trauma of Covid fades and income growth continues, we expect confidence to return and activity to improve.
• Secondly, the government's regulatory crackdown damaged private sector confidence. Indeed, the private sector's contribution to the Chinese economy is frequently underestimated. It accounts for nearly 50 per cent of tax revenue, 60 per cent of GDP, 70 per cent of technological innovation and most importantly, 80 per cent of jobs. It's been weak, partly because of Covid, and partly because of concerns that Xi Jinping no longer supports entrepreneurs. Over the past 12 months, the government has attempted to address these concerns by clarifying the rationale behind the regulatory crackdown. Some of our third party research providers argue that we're now witnessing the most concerted effort to support the private sector in the history of the People's Republic. This culminated in a 31-step support package aimed at promoting 'a bigger, better and stronger private sector'. The package seeks to improve market access, level the playing field with state-owned enterprises, strengthen access to finance and incorporate more private sector input into policymaking. Importantly, the latter may reduce the risk of future policy errors. As with the Chinese consumer, the private sector remains, on average, in very good health, with strong balance sheets and the ability to invest once confidence improves.
• Finally, what about debt and the risk of contagion? Aggregate debt levels are a challenge, but we think the risk of financial instability is low. The majority of debt in the Chinese system circulates within a closed loop, ie it is issued by state-owned banks to state-owned enterprises within the context of a closed capital account. This gives the government the ability to decide how quickly bad debts are recognised and to stagger recognition in line with economic activity. In addition, the risk of contagion from hidden debt within the system has been drastically reduced after the government's 2016-2017 campaign to clean up balance sheets and reduce shadow banking.
• Debt levels do limit the government's ability to offer a very large stimulus package. However, gradual easing remains viable. Indeed, the government's prudent approach to Covid stimulus and to the property market over the last decade means that it has many levers to pull. China is one of the very few countries that can lower interest rates in response to economic weakness without raising fears of stagflation. It has also begun to relax the restrictions it put on property in the early 2010s. For example, in July it gave local and city governments the go-ahead to relax restrictions on home purchases. In August we saw Guangzhou, a major tier-one city, become the first to act. We expect others to follow suit and for the government's gradual easing approach to bear fruit.”
• On the geopolitical front, BCGC stated “We continue to expect geopolitics and the US-China relationship to provide a long-term headwind to investor sentiment, particularly in the context of the upcoming election cycle in the US. However, we believe that the worst-case scenario of a clash of arms is unlikely.” It also relayed that having spoken to CEOs and boards of the major Chinese companies it invests in, there was “broadly positive and complimentary [feedback] about the new Premier, Li Qiang.”
________________________________________
________________________________________
Spotted - business
A short section of things we jotted down this week
• British luxury car manufacturer Aston Martin says China is "tremendously important" to its future and has tipped the country to become its second biggest market behind the United States in the years ahead. Aston Martin's Executive Chairman, Lawrence Stroll, told CGTN Europe that China represents a key market for the company's future and expects the relationship with Geely to continue to go from strength to strength. He said: "China is tremendously important to Aston Martin. In the future, we believe it will be our second largest market after the United States and eventually obviously behind Europe and here in the UK. The UK is still very important being our home.”
 

sunnymaxi

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This is probably one of the most important charts right now about the Chinese economy..

China is already well into transitioning the economy away from the property sector..

Image
 

zbb

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China’s Factory Floor Is Moving—But Not to India or Mexico​

Companies seeking alternatives to China are finding the country’s vast interior still holds big advantages​




This is an awesome article that shows the developments I have been looking for many years. Now my predictions are correct. China's interior is more competitive for cheap manufacturing compared to Vietnam or India. So China will continue to have both advance and cheap manufacturing at the same time due to differences between interor and coast.

But China's future massive growth to Japan or Korean levels of Prosperity cannot happen if the interior is not developed with Manufacturing. And the fast rise of the interior will support high growth rate for years to come.

But this wouldn't have been possible without massive investment in expressway network, waterway network and rail network. So, prudent choice by China to invest in the interior instead of the coast which will automatically develop. But the interior needed govt help
It should be mentioned that the rising exports of China's interior provinces could never have happened without the massive investment in high speed rail. Before the development of the high speed rail network, the extreme numbers of workers travelling from coastal areas back to their hometowns in the interior for Chinese New Year (Spring Festival) meant that nearly the entire rail network capacity has to be dedicated to passenger transport during the Spring Festival travel rush from one month before Chinese New Year to one month after (for returning workers). During these two months of the Spring Festival travel rush, the rail network is unable to transport enough coal to keep power plants and heating systems across the country running, so a lot of extra coal has to be transported and stockpiled in the one to two months before the Spring Festival travel rush. This means that for 3~4 months of the year, no cargo other than coal could be transported by rail in most parts of China's interior.

Now, if you are a company looking to build a new factory, would you build your factory somewhere that cannot have inputs shipped in or products shipped out for 3~4 months of the year? Of course the answer is no. This was why despite much lower land and labor prices, factories did not move to interior Chinese provinces before 2010. This led to a vicious cycle as new factories were being built mostly on the coast, more people from the underdeveloped interior went to the coast for work, resulting in ever expanding Spring Festival travel rush periods and ever worsening cargo transport disruptions for the interior.

All of this changed with the massive passenger transport capacity of high speed rail. The Wuhan-Guangzhou high speed rail line was completed in December 2009. Shortly after that, for the first time in decades, the conventional rail line from Wuhan to Guangzhou carried cargo other than coal during the Chinese New Year of 2010. It was not a coincidence that a few months later the same year, Foxconn started setting up a new manufacturing base in Zhengzhou, north of Wuhan on the same conventional rail line to Guangzhou. Similar developments accompanied the expansion of high speed rail all across the Chinese interior.
 
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zbb

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All of this changed with the massive passenger transport capacity of high speed rail. The Wuhan-Guangzhou high speed rail line was completed in December 2009. Shortly after that, for the first time in decades, the conventional rail line from Wuhan to Guangzhou carried cargo other than coal during the Chinese New Year of 2010. It was not a coincidence that a few months later the same year, Foxconn started setting up a new manufacturing base in Zhengzhou, north of Wuhan on the same conventional rail line to Guangzhou. Similar developments accompanied the expansion of high speed rail all across the Chinese interior.
BTW, Zhengzhou's Zhengdong New District, built around its eventual main high speed rail station, was dubbed the largest ghost city in China by Western media in 2010.

Here are a couple of recent videos of "the largest ghost city in China" located in one of China's poorer interior provinces.
 

tamsen_ikard

Junior Member
Registered Member
It should be mentioned that the rising exports of China's interior provinces could never have happened without the massive investment in high speed rail. Before the development of the high speed rail network, the extreme numbers of workers travelling from coastal areas back to their hometowns in the interior for Chinese New Year (Spring Festival) meant that nearly the entire rail network capacity has to be dedicated to passenger transport during the Spring Festival travel rush from one month before Chinese New Year to one month after (for returning workers). During these two months of the Spring Festival travel rush, the rail network is unable to transport enough coal to keep power plants and heating systems across the country running, so a lot of extra coal has to be transported and stockpiled in the one to two months before the Spring Festival travel rush. This means that for 3~4 months of the year, no cargo other than coal could be transported by rail in most parts of China's interior.

Now, if you are a company looking to build a new factory, would you build your factory somewhere that cannot have inputs shipped in or products shipped out for 3~4 months of the year? Of course the answer is no. This was why despite much lower land and labor prices, factories did not move to interior Chinese provinces before 2010. This led to a vicious cycle as new factories were being built mostly on the coast, more people from the underdeveloped interior went to the coast for work, resulting in ever expanding Spring Festival travel rush periods and ever worsening cargo transport disruptions for the interior.

All of this changed with the massive passenger transport capacity of high speed rail. The Wuhan-Guangzhou high speed rail line was completed in December 2009. Shortly after that, for the first time in decades, the conventional rail line from Wuhan to Guangzhou carried cargo other than coal during the Chinese New Year of 2010. It was not a coincidence that a few months later the same year, Foxconn started setting up a new manufacturing base in Zhengzhou, north of Wuhan on the same conventional rail line to Guangzhou. Similar developments accompanied the expansion of high speed rail all across the Chinese interior.

I don't think High speed rail is that important for the development of interior manufacturing. Most important is probably China's expressway network which is the biggest in the world. This allows fast movement of containers via trucks. Another important route is China's development of Waterway network through the Yangtze and Pearl River system. This allows places as deep as Chengdu and Yunnan to transport large goods via ships.

High speed rail is good for convinent and fast movement of people. But for goods transport its not that important.
 
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