Chinese Economics Thread

NiuBiDaRen

Brigadier
Registered Member

Chinese trustbusters’ pursuit of Alibaba is only the start​

Beijing has put online giants on notice
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Acting on information, China’s State Administration for Market Regulation [SAMR] has started investigation [into] Alibaba Group for alleged monopoly conduct including implementing an ‘exclusive dealing agreement’.” This brief note, posted by Xinhua, the state news agency, on December 24th, was all it took to cut China’s mightiest online titan down to size. Not even the announcement three days later of an extra $6bn in share buy-backs arrested the slide in its market value. By December 28th it had fallen by 13%, or $91bn. By comparison, American regulators’ detailed charge-sheets against tech giants such as Facebook and Google in recent weeks elicited a yawn from investors.

The Alibaba investigation is the first of its kind into Chinese e-commerce. Its timing—a month after authorities suddenly halted the $37bn initial public offering (ipo) of Alibaba’s fintech affiliate, Ant Group, and days before regulators told Ant to curtail lending and wealth-management activities—hints it is China’s way of chastening the two firms’ flamboyant co-founder, Jack Ma.

That could be. Ant’s ipo was put on ice after Mr Ma likened China’s state banks to pawn shops. Chinese watchdogs often launch lightning crackdowns to deter others from misbehaving, says Angela Zhang of the University of Hong Kong. But the probe also signals concerns over the online economy, which is effervescent but also ever more concentrated. As investors parsed the Xinhua note, share prices of other internet giants, such as Tencent and Meituan, fell nearly as steeply as Alibaba’s.

The complaint against Alibaba centres on the practice of having merchants or brands sign contracts to sell products exclusively on its platform. Those that do business on rival marketplaces risk having internet traffic diverted from their online shopfronts on Alibaba’s Tmall emporium to other sellers.

Such arrangements aren’t new. In 2015 jd.com, a smaller e-emporium backed by Tencent, filed a legal claim against Alibaba over a similar issue. Nor are they unique to Mr Ma’s firm, which launched a competing complaint against jd.com the same year. These and other complaints since have been largely ignored by regulators. Why the about-turn?

Chinese trustbusters long resisted hobbling an industry seen as world-beating, and backed in Beijing. Now, as in the West, they fret that a few giants control indispensable services—e-commerce, logistics, payments, ride-hailing, food delivery, social media, messaging. Common practices, such as selling products below cost to lure customers, look more troubling in an industry where the top three firms control over 90% of the market than they would in a less concentrated one. In November samr said offering shoppers different prices based on their spending power, divined from user data, may be unlawful.

Another reason for China’s newfound zeal (Mr Ma’s jibes aside) is greater trustbusting capacity. samr was formed only in 2018, by combining the offices of three regulators. It still struggles to keep up with the fast-changing online market; most staff are busy assessing mergers and acquisitions. But it has more know-how and manpower than it used to—and looks eager to deploy them.
 

horse

Colonel
Registered Member
Can someone post the full details of the agreement? I would like to know what concessions were given by both sides.
This is my guess, based on no evidence, other than past relationship developments and the future.

China gave a stern pledge not to suppress the labour movement this time, and unionization could be eventually possible. This is what the Europeans call labour standards. Of course, in China, the CCP then might not throw you into jail for organizing a union but for picking fights and starting quarrels. Comrade Deng Xiaoping hated labour unions, so that was a big concession.

The future is more interesting. With increasing automation, how do we organize the robots into a labour union?

Hand in hand, the EU and China will walk together towards the future.

:oops: :p
 

AssassinsMace

Lieutenant General
Has China run out of electricity yet since they're not buying Australian coal like the media reported? I was arguing with a guy on the internet where now they claim the media never reported that. Yes if that were true the big news that they would report would be China's economy has ground to a halt because of no electricity. Do we hear that? All of the sudden simple common sense is inserted and they're in full denial they ever said China is experiencing electricity shortages because they forgot that would happen when they ban Australian coal. It never amazes me how many dumb people are out there that think they're smart and are in influential positions.
 

Xizor

Captain
Registered Member
When I first read about Ant Group's business model back in October, I was floored that any regulators, regardless of nationality, would have allowed Jack Ma to get so far.
Yeah, it's like one of those Amway pyramid schemes which traps the sellers.

Just that here free credit is given to youths(irrespective of their credit worthiness) , who squander it but becomes slave to the bank.

I know it's a flawed comparison but it's not within reach -
Amway has a similar scheme, offload tons of products on its network agents who distribute it to lower agents in the pyramid but mandate that they keep selling. Soon the sellers would buy the products themselves (for easy money) and they'd offload it to another lower agent to rise up the ranks.
The question is -
What stops Alibaba from pursuing it? Never bet against corporate greed for quick money.

Regulations are needed. This isn't the US economy where they can print the currency willy nilly.
 

Petrolicious88

Senior Member
Registered Member
Cursory reading suggests that EU got a much better deal than what China got. How does China gain from this? It seems more of a geopolitical deal with China extending its influence in EU rather than an economic one.
This deal if signed by the European Parliament, will give China legally binding market access to the EU market. Vice versa for EU companies wanting to tap the Chinese market.

China benefits by not being shut out of the Western markets. It complicates Biden’s attempt to form an western alliance against China.
 

Skywatcher

Captain
Yeah, it's like one of those Amway pyramid schemes which traps the sellers.

Just that here free credit is given to youths(irrespective of their credit worthiness) , who squander it but becomes slave to the bank.

I know it's a flawed comparison but it's not within reach -
Amway has a similar scheme, offload tons of products on its network agents who distribute it to lower agents in the pyramid but mandate that they keep selling. Soon the sellers would buy the products themselves (for easy money) and they'd offload it to another lower agent to rise up the ranks.
The question is -
What stops Alibaba from pursuing it? Never bet against corporate greed for quick money.

Regulations are needed. This isn't the US economy where they can print the currency willy nilly.
Apparently, Alibaba's proprietary AI system will predict which borrowers will be more likely to payback the loans.

I'm not making that up.
 
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