Chinese Economics Thread

Just4Fun

Junior Member
Registered Member
He can sanction China the same way they sanction Iran. We’ll see if they’re willing to go that far

It won't work in Trump's favor.

First, China's economical output is already about one third larger than the US currently, and will grow to 2X, 3X, may be even 4X of the US economic output in the future. It is always awfully difficult when you try to beat a guy whose body weight is one third heavier than yours, and never try to think to beat a guy whose body weight is twice heavier as yours.

Second, the Chinese economy is the most diversified in the world. It has every industry specialty monitored by the UN, covering the full spectrum of all economic activities in the world. There is no other country in the world that has so completed industry specialties. Even the US economy can't cover so broad economic activities, not to mention the Iranian economy which is heavily dependent on oil and gas industry.

Third, China's economy is a growing economy, while the US economy is a saturated economy. About half of population in China are still living in rural area and they are future consumers, thus are the drive of future growth of internal consumption. In the US, almost all population are living in urban area, and there is no inflow of new consumers, thus there is little room for internal consumption to expand, unless Trump agrees to accept huge numbers of immigrants. If the both countries cut exports to zero, and cut governmental spending to zero, then, the two economies must survive on internal consumption only. In this extreme scenario, the Chinese economy can still move forward by attracting rural population to cities, while the US economy will standstill unless it has a huge immigrant inflow.

To examine the validity of the above scenario, one must remember the basic economics teaching, that is, exports, investment, governmental spending and internal consumption are the most important factors that can fuel a country's economic growth. None of the these factors works in Trump's favor. Therefore, no matter how hard he tries and no matter trickery he may apply, Trump has zero chance to win his trade war against China.

But, Trump may try two novelty weapons in order to win the trade war. Weapon number one, import about 1 billion immigrants, popping up US population base to 1.4 billion. Or, weapon number two, cut American worker wage to about one fourth of Chinese worker wage. Of course, he can use any combination of the two weapons.

Because Trump hates immigrants, so we know what weapon he is going to use: lower American worker wage by de-valuating the dollar.

To get an American worker paid as little as one fourth of a Chinese worker wage, Trump will have to make Americans as poor as Haitians. Ten years from now, the greenbacks may be de-valuated to the level that are no better than toilet papers.

Buy gold, boys. Sell your house sell your car, sell your wife sell your cat, Just buy gold.
 
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Just4Fun

Junior Member
Registered Member
LOL, a former Fed vice chairman stopped short to call Trump a stupid dotard.


Former Fed official says Trump’s trade war with China is a ‘stagflationary shock’


Published: Aug 24, 2019 4:25 p.m. ET

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Alan Blinder, former Fed Vice Chairman says U.S. economic outlook obscured by president’s behavior

President Donald Trump’s trade war with China is likely to generate a supply shock for the U.S. economy similar to the stagflation that hamstrung the U.S. economy after the 1973-1974 OPEC oil embargo, a former top Federal Reserve official said, on the sidelines of the Fed’s Jackson Hole conference.

“It’s a stagflationary shock. Hopefully a small one,” Alan Blinder said, in an interview.

Blinder was vice chair of the Federal Reserve board between 1994 and 1996.

In the 1970s, oil prices quadrupled in the wake of the OPEC ban on oil exports.

This resulted in slow economic growth and higher inflation, something central bankers had never seen before.

At first, the Fed didn’t know how to respond, Blinder said.


There are no perfect answers for policy makers. The central bank can either respond to the inflation or the stagnation, he said.

Supply shocks disrupt the efficiency of the economy,“ an economic machine that was able to produce this much output will now produce less,” Blinder said.

After a while, businesses will adjust, he said.

Blinder said he is not sure whether the OPEC embargo is a perfect analogy for the Trump trade war.

One notable difference is that when the U.S. responded to the oil embargo, “we weren’t’ making enemies, he said.

Blinder said it was hard for the Fed to guage the future given the president’s actions.

“The trend seems bad,” he said.

If it weren’t for the distortions Trump is causing to international trade, Blinder would not be worried about a severe economic downturn.

“It looks like pretty smooth sailing for the economy,” Blinder said.

“But this [president] is capable of killing it, and shows no judgement or intelligence,” Blinder said.

Blinder said he was worried about Trump’s tweet asking American companies to leave China, suggesting he thinks he can order American companies to do what he wants.

“That has the potential... for really killing investment,” Blinder said.

 

Quickie

Colonel
The same stance from Beijing since day one of the trade war.

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Commentary: Washington's bullying only to toughen Beijing's fighting will

BEIJING, Aug. 25 (Xinhua) -- Again, Washington has decided to up its ante in its trade offensive against China by threatening on Saturday additional tariffs on almost all of its imported goods from China.

The latest escalation in their tariff warfare seems to have shown that Washington's trade hawks are getting increasingly hysterical and desperate as they seek to force China into submission.

A few weeks ago, Washington, disregarding the plain fact, labeled China as a "currency manipulator."

The U.S. administration may feel free to press its luck in a trade fight they have initiated, but China will not be intimidated.

For more than a year since Washington fired the first shot of the trade war against China, the Chinese side has all along been acting in good faith in search of a win-win solution to their trade disputes, like buying U.S. farm products and tightening its control over fentanyl-like drugs.

Yet China's utmost sincerity has been met with smearing, flip-flopping and bullying from the trade hawks in Washington, who view China as a pushover.

By ratcheting up its rhetoric and threatening more trade levies, Washington seems to gamble that China would budge first. However, it is making a losing bet.

China hardliners in the Trump administration have overestimated their ability to cow Beijing into concessions that are detrimental to China's core interests, and underestimated the Asian country's determination to defend its vital stakes.

For these hardliners, Beijing's countermeasure announcement on Friday against earlier U.S. tariff hike threats may serve as another clear-cut remainder that China will only grow more resolute in the face of swelling pressure.

Trade war produces no winners, especially in today's increasingly intertwined global economy. So when Washington is trying to recklessly hit China with punitive tariffs, it is in fact taxing its own people, hurting its own economy, rattling and unnerving stock markets worldwide, and dragging down the global economic growth.

Washington's reckless and capricious trade bullying has already roiled U.S. stock markets and triggered global concerns, notably from its European allies.

In a red Friday, all three major U.S. indexes tumbled, with the Dow dropping 623 points.

At the on-going Group of Seven summit in France, European Council President Donald Tusk sounded the alarm that "trade wars will lead to a recession" while French President Emmanuel Macron warned that trade wars are bad for everyone.

For the benefit of both China and the United States, as well as that of the wider international community, negotiations are still the only way out of their trade disputes.

Yet, Washington's trade hardliners should bear in mind that spike in pressure is not giving them more chips on the negotiating table, but placing more roadblocks on the way towards a final settlement of the trade friction.

Therefore, the earlier these China hawks let go of their addiction to the tactic of maximum pressure, the sooner the two sides can figure out their trade problems.

Washington needs to show enough sincerity to convince Beijing that the potential trade deal is going to be pursued on the basis of respect and equal treatment, and that the deal itself is going to accommodate China's major concerns, not only those of the United States.

If Washington's trade hawks do not respect this bottom line, they will be held responsible for the dire consequences for the United States and the wider world brought about by their arrogance and bigotry.
 
now I read
U.S. urged to not misjudge situation, immediately stop wrong actions
Xinhua| 2019-08-26 20:40:42
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A foreign ministry spokesperson on Monday urged the United States to not misjudge the situation and immediately stop its wrong actions.

Spokesperson Geng Shuang made the call in response to a query about China's countermeasures to the U.S. announcement on Aug. 24 of a decision to levy an additional duty on some 550 billion U.S. dollars worth of Chinese imports.

"We strongly urge the United States not to miscalculate the situation and immediately cease its wrong actions. If the United States implements its plan of raising tariffs, China will definitely continue to take measures and safeguard its own legitimate rights," said Geng.

He reiterated the position that China is firmly opposed to and will not accept the trade bullying and maximum pressure by the United States, noting that "I hereby warn the United States once again that China does not accept any threats or intimidation."

The United States' moves severely violated the consensus reached by the heads of state of China and the United States in Osaka, Japan, trampled on the multilateral trading rules, undermined the interests of both countries, threatened the security of the global value and supply chains and impeded world trade and economic growth, Geng said.

"It is an act solely intended to injure others, but it will only end up ruining themselves, and it is not constructive at all," he said.

When responding to a question about President Trump's tweets asking U.S. companies to "find alternatives to China," Geng said they run counter to the market economy and free competition rules, as well as the trend of economic globalization.

"It will surely be questioned and opposed by all stakeholders, including U.S. companies," he said.

Describing the two countries' economies as inextricably interwoven and mutually beneficial, Geng said that cutting their ties is definitely not a wise solution to easing the two countries' trade frictions, nor a way to resolving the United States' own problems.

He called on the United States to heed opinions from different fields, seriously consider the pros and cons and not to act on impulse.
 

Hendrik_2000

Lieutenant General
Do anyone knows if Navarro ever got to china?
No he never went to China His wife is chinese so she might went there
Peter Navarro never publish an economic paper about Chinese economy sanction by peer review Nope nothing
He hate China because as an evening class professor on economic his student can't find a job and He blame it on China
He seem to be harking back to America in 50's when jobs were plentiful and High school graduate can work in factory and make a decent living buying house married early and have alot of kids
Those days are gone forever yet this people still dream pf good ole days

Here is good article by George Koo about Peter Navaro
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Why would a Harvard PhD economist and tenured university professor make ridiculous assertions about China that no self-respecting economist would claim ownership of?

This question is hanging over prominent China-basher and director of the White House National Trade Council, Peter Navarro.

I went for answers to Professor John Graham, who had been Navarro’s colleague at the University of California at Irvine’s Paul Merage School of Business. He joined the faculty in 1989, the same year as Navarro. Now that Navarro has left to join the Trump administration, Graham has taken over Navarro’s course on China.

“I am not sure I know why,” Graham said. “In sum, the three books he’s written about China are xenophobic trash. They contain some truths, but Navarro cherry-picks the data to prove his points. Ultimately it’s nothing but yellow journalism.”

Graham went on to say, “Navarro has no first-hand familiarity of China, doesn’t show any understanding of China and doesn’t speak Chinese. When asked how many times he’s been to China, he evades and doesn’t answer.”

A former UC Irvine professor and colleague confirmed this, saying, “He generally avoided people who actually knew something about the country.”


Needed help to teach a course on China
After publishing several China-related books, Navarro decided to create his own course on China relations, named “China and the Global Order.” When Benjamin Leffel, a China specialist and sociology PhD student at UC Irvine, became aware of Navarro’s writings, he reached out to him and questioned his views.

The meeting led to Navarro asking Leffel to act as the counterweight in his China class. Leffel created most of the syllabus using respected academic material in China studies, Navarro’s contribution being his own book and documentary.
 
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manqiangrexue

Brigadier
Lying fail. Bold part especially funny since he's always said that China really wants to make a deal; this is basically like saying, "Seriously, I'm not lying to you this time."

Trump claims serious trade negotiations with China to begin

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•August 26, 2019

Trump said his trade negotiators had received two "very good calls" from China on Sunday. But a spokesman for China's foreign ministry said Monday that he didn't know what calls Trump was talking about.

He declined to say whether he's spoken to President Xi Jinping or to identify those involved in the most recent conversations, saying only that they were at the "highest levels."

"This is the first time I've seen them where they really want to make a deal. And I think that's a very positive step," Trump added...

The Chinese were unaware of any recent conversations.

"I have not heard of the weekend calls mentioned by the United States," said Geng Shuang, a spokesman for China's foreign ministry.
 

styx

Junior Member
Registered Member
i'm seriously suspecting that Trump Clan are using potus deranged TWEETS to make money speculating in stock market. What if Chinese media start to investigat in this direction? Should explain White House silence on the hong kong issue (piece of cake to attack china on human rights and other shit trying to destabilize it)
 
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