Chinese Aviation Industry

See Yuan Class sub

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Yuan is diesel-electric.

You have forgot the J11. Now it's 100% produced in China, sinodefence is just not enough updated on this things.

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Produced, yes, but the airframe and engines are both Russian in design and those are the parts that China has most difficulty with. However, as the J-11 incorporates far greater use of composites and lightweight material than any other Flanker derivative, we can assume that China has been making advancements in the field of material science.

Yet Chengdu managed to come up with two respectable design in these past 30 years

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How many military designs have Boeing came up with since 1979? Lockheed? Northrup?

FriedRiceNSpice said:

Produced, yes, but the airframe and engines are both Russian in design and those are the parts that China has most difficulty with. However, as the J-11 incorporates far greater use of composites and lightweight material than any other Flanker derivative, we can assume that China has been making advancements in the field of material science.

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Well, I agree, but they are making progress very quickly.
For example, on sinodefence.com, is written that the J11 is made by 70% chinese indigenous tecnology. In December 07, on ifeng TV (a broadcast TV in Hong Kong), they annunced that the WS10A was successfully developed, and will be equipped on the new J11B replacing the russian engine. The commentator also said that this achivement means that China can now produce about 90% of the J11 components.
In October 08, ifeng TV announced that J11 is now 100% indigenous, all the avionics and elettronics are now produced with chinese tecnology.
So, what is next?

I have yet to see civilian launchers and civilian nuclear submarines.

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There is some connection between the civilian nuclear power plant industry and the ability to produce safe and reliable nuclear reactors for submarines. Companies like GE and Westinghouse are doing both. China's lack of expertise in the nuclear power plant industry has its consequences on the power plants of its nuclear submarines.

Engineer said:

I'm not saying ARJ-21 is a knock off of a DC-9. I'm saying it is taking a DC-9 fuselage, literally. Of course changes have to be to accommodate new wings and engines, but given that they needed help from Antonov to even modify a Y-8, I am doubting that the modification designs are actually done by Chinese aviation companies.

Like I've said, it is problem solved when the problem is just given to someone else to solve. Changing this would be a great improvement to the aviation industry.

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remember their are also other goals within a joint development. not just taking shortcuts or your incapable. so many joint projects china could've finished themselves but with more cash and time needed, but in the end it can be done.

joint projects help boost and improve friendship and cooperation between the nations. have a think of this you know your already pretty capable but wanna boost military relationship and also business so a joint development is a good idea. and also it gives you insight into the technology depth that the nation posess and see where you stand with them

PrOeLiTeZ said:

remember their are also other goals within a joint development. not just taking shortcuts or your incapable. so many joint projects china could've finished themselves but with more cash and time needed, but in the end it can be done.

joint projects help boost and improve friendship and cooperation between the nations. have a think of this you know your already pretty capable but wanna boost military relationship and also business so a joint development is a good idea. and also it gives you insight into the technology depth that the nation posess and see where you stand with them

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Well said. Isn't the F-35 a joint development project too?

cloyce said:

Well said. Isn't the F-35 a joint development project too?

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The US is the primary lead in the project, while the UK, Canada, Norway, Netherlands, Australia, Denmark, Italy, Turkey, Israel and Singapore are associates; they fork over some money to help fund development, and occasionally allow some of their companies to bid on JSF-related contracts. All of the major development work is done in the US, or by US companies.

cloyce said:

Well said. Isn't the F-35 a joint development project too?

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without other nations funding US will be struggling to finance the project. the original allocated budget had to be changed several times due to over cost, and delays.

the JSF is also building upon Existing tech the Airframe is based on the Research from the F22 the Avionics Eurofighter/ Lockheed/ BAE. the HMD is Israeli the Radar is American. originally a German gun was too be mounted. the Lift system is loosely based on the Russian YAK 141 Freestyle. a English Engine option.

From a logistical stand point Joint projects can be a blessing or a curse the JSF and Eurofighter is a good case for the Blessing the MBT 70 ( joint US German tank ) is a good case for a Curse.

there important things that need too be looked into when entering such a project.
First is it feasible? the JSF was built upon the Success of the F22, Eurofighters, F117, F16 and FA-18 Aircraft well taking lessons from the Yak development group and BAE. it's intention was not too build the uber plane that would render every thing a target but a multi role good enough to get the job done plane to aid the "Uber" plane weather that be EF2000 or Raptor.

How much is new and developmental? how much do you have too build from scratch?brand new is pricey.

Who's in control? one of the Big killers of the MBT 70 was that the German's Used Metric well the American's used SAE. because no one wanted to say yes too one and no too the other they used both... and the Price sky rocketed. this may seem small now but think about it if your building a fighter do you use Western or Eastern Weapons? is the tooling compatible? can an Engine made in your country fit in a air frame made by the other partner? will your avionics fit the other nations systems? do you have the quality control of the other guy? this is why thus far the J 10 is using Russian engines.
in the Case of China they seem to be able to be compatible with both east and west in most cases using European and western Helicopters well Russian fighters.

Who foots the Bill? the big question in military spending. After all jet fighters don't grow on trees. so who spends the most on the plane? Who holds the Rights? In the Case of the JSF the answer was so obvious it's almost a joke, the Us Government makes up 48% other the worlds military spending compared too 28% for Europe, Australia and Eastern Asia. for comparison the Chinese And Russian Military spending makes up 13%.

this may seem small now but think about it if your building a fighter do you use Western or Eastern Weapons? is the tooling compatible? can an Engine made in your country fit in a air frame made by the other partner? will your avionics fit the other nations systems?

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China in particular seem to be very experienced at creating fighters that are very adapatable to foreign avionics/weapons suites. From the F-7 to the highly-modular JF-17/FC-1, a variety of radar, electronic, avionic, and weapon systems packages of Russian, Chinese, Israeli, Italian, and French origin were made available to their export customers.

Also, China has had much experience integrating Russian missiles alongside Chinese ones as well as using Russian avionics and engines.

FriedRiceNSpice said:

China in particular seem to be very experienced at creating fighters that are very adapatable to foreign avionics/weapons suites. From the F-7 to the highly-modular JF-17/FC-1, a variety of radar, electronic, avionic, and weapon systems packages of Russian, Chinese, Israeli, Italian, and French origin were made available to their export customers.

Also, China has had much experience integrating Russian missiles alongside Chinese ones as well as using Russian avionics and engines.

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One of the Largest Reasons I am Expecting too see and hear about a lot of new Chinese Aircraft form today into the next decade. Especially given the Threat too a number of Chinese Military shoppers posed by the F35 Lightning II. In particular the Popularity of the F35B Vtol Fighter which hands down smokes Currently in production VTOL fighters. As these Aircraft near production I have no doubt a Counter super Sonic VTOL Fighter Project will become a interest, And the Chinese Seem too at least be the best prepared too built the avionics if not a whole plane.