Western mindset all over again. I can see it now, Christianity all over. Gee, you can imagine all the missionary going out to "tame the savages".
White man's burden MKII.
China's strategy in Afghanistan.
- Thread starter ohan_qwe
- Start date
Western mindset all over again. I can see it now, Christianity all over. Gee, you can imagine all the missionary going out to "tame the savages".
White man's burden MKII.
If you want to do it in money terms, go and ask the Xiongnu or the Tujue (Turks), what they paid for picking up China. Ops, they don't exist any more.
Sorry for the interruption but i see some methodological mistakes that have to be pointed out. You talk about ancient China as something united that reflects to the modern PRC almost identical, which is absolutely wrong. Even nowdays "Xi calls for national rejuventation" which i think this is like the Stalin's diplomatic nationalist "motherland's" calling for WW2 (which motherland, the Soviet? The Rus? The Pan-slavic? The Atheist? The Christian? The Muslim? The Buddhist? The Tribal?). National rejuventation is a call to form a new national conscioussness, above and beyond the present ones. To make my point more clear, i will bring examples comparable to China qualitative and quantitive. USSR after decades of propagating and impying the union, the union broke up, several slavic nations, speaking the same or at least similar language, having common past etc became enemies, several wars between these nations occured and 30 years after the USSR's break up there are many tension hotspots in the region. The quantitive example is Europe. Both Latin and Slavic alphabet have their roots in Greek. Greek culture and philosophy set the foundations for the coming cultures etc. If we advocate that Europe is somewhat "Grecified" we can present a situation where Franks attacking the Byzantines, or Venetians is something internal, something that have to do about the damn Greeks. Which is not! Keep in mind that Min speaking territories and Jin speaking territories are as far apart (or more) as France to Italy or Turkey.
When China was weak, the nomads invade and build their own dynasties. Gradually the offspring of the nomads became farmers and sinicized. Again this is not something that China actively sought, but rather voluntarily taken by the invaders.
And which China was weak? The Han? The Tang? The Qing?The Mandarin Speaking? the Jin speaking?
The same question could be put like which Greeks were weak? The Macedonians, The Romans, The Byzantines? The Greek speaking, the Latin speaking etc. IF this was not something that China actively sought, why China built the biggest ever fortification on the planet, the Great Wall?
There is something foul to this kind of narration. This narration gives the courage to the average Greek nationalist to claim that he is the direct child of Plato and has the glorious Greek DNA. While he is just the mixture of generations of wars and cultures that passed through the region he was born. This narration makes the average Jai Hind to claim the glorious past, hoping to erase his unfortunate present. I believe that you see what i struggle to tell, no offence
Last edited:
solarz
Brigadier
Sorry for the interruption but i see some methodological mistakes that have to be pointed out. You talk about ancient China as something united that reflects to the modern PRC almost identical, which is absolutely wrong. Even nowdays "Xi calls for national rejuventation" which i think this is like the Stalin's diplomatic nationalist "motherland's" calling for WW2 (which motherland, the Soviet? The Rus? The Pan-slavic? The Atheist? The Christian? The Muslim? The Buddhist? The Tribal?). National rejuventation is a call to form a new national conscioussness, above and beyond the present ones. To make my point more clear, i will bring examples comparable to China qualitative and quantitive. USSR after decades of propagating and impying the union, the union broke up, several slavic nations, speaking the same or at least similar language, having common past etc became enemies, several wars between these nations occured and 30 years after the USSR's break up there are many tension hotspots in the region. The quantitive example is Europe. Both Latin and Slavic alphabet have their roots in Greek. Greek culture and philosophy set the foundations for the coming cultures etc. If we advocate that Europe is somewhat "Grecified" we can present a situation where Franks attacking the Byzantines, or Venetians is something internal, something that have to do about the damn Greeks. Which is not! Keep in mind that Min speaking territories and Jin speaking territories are as far apart (or more) as France to Italy or Turkey.
When China was weak, the nomads invade and build their own dynasties. Gradually the offspring of the nomads became farmers and sinicized. Again this is not something that China actively sought, but rather voluntarily taken by the invaders.
And which China was weak? The Han? The Tang? The Qing?The Mandarin Speaking? the Jin speaking?
The same question could be put like which Greeks were weak? The Macedonians, The Romans, The Byzantines? The Greek speaking, the Latin speaking etc. IF this was not something that China actively sought, why China built the biggest ever fortification on the planet, the Great Wall?
There is something foul to this kind of narration. This narration gives the courage to the average Greek nationalist to claim that he is the direct child of Plato and has the glorious Greek DNA. While he is just the mixture of generations of wars and cultures that passed through the region he was born. This narration makes the average Jai Hind to claim the glorious past, hoping to erase his unfortunate present. I believe that you see what i struggle to tell, no offence
Your rambling makes no sense whatsoever to anyone with a modicum of understanding of Chinese history.
It will be interesting to see the new trio of China, Pakistan, and the Taliban. Will it work? Will the Taliban finally have the means to run a smooth Afghanistan?
European and Chinese civilizational state history don't have any similarities period. When was the whole of Europe ever unified as a single entity?Sorry for the interruption but i see some methodological mistakes that have to be pointed out. You talk about ancient China as something united that reflects to the modern PRC almost identical, which is absolutely wrong. Even nowdays "Xi calls for national rejuventation" which i think this is like the Stalin's diplomatic nationalist "motherland's" calling for WW2 (which motherland, the Soviet? The Rus? The Pan-slavic? The Atheist? The Christian? The Muslim? The Buddhist? The Tribal?). National rejuventation is a call to form a new national conscioussness, above and beyond the present ones. To make my point more clear, i will bring examples comparable to China qualitative and quantitive. USSR after decades of propagating and impying the union, the union broke up, several slavic nations, speaking the same or at least similar language, having common past etc became enemies, several wars between these nations occured and 30 years after the USSR's break up there are many tension hotspots in the region. The quantitive example is Europe. Both Latin and Slavic alphabet have their roots in Greek. Greek culture and philosophy set the foundations for the coming cultures etc. If we advocate that Europe is somewhat "Grecified" we can present a situation where Franks attacking the Byzantines, or Venetians is something internal, something that have to do about the damn Greeks. Which is not! Keep in mind that Min speaking territories and Jin speaking territories are as far apart (or more) as France to Italy or Turkey.
When China was weak, the nomads invade and build their own dynasties. Gradually the offspring of the nomads became farmers and sinicized. Again this is not something that China actively sought, but rather voluntarily taken by the invaders.
And which China was weak? The Han? The Tang? The Qing?The Mandarin Speaking? the Jin speaking?
The same question could be put like which Greeks were weak? The Macedonians, The Romans, The Byzantines? The Greek speaking, the Latin speaking etc. IF this was not something that China actively sought, why China built the biggest ever fortification on the planet, the Great Wall?
There is something foul to this kind of narration. This narration gives the courage to the average Greek nationalist to claim that he is the direct child of Plato and has the glorious Greek DNA. While he is just the mixture of generations of wars and cultures that passed through the region he was born. This narration makes the average Jai Hind to claim the glorious past, hoping to erase his unfortunate present. I believe that you see what i struggle to tell, no offence
You're a European telling us Chinese that what? CHINA is an invented country? As advocated and espoused by your ethnic and cultural contemporary Bill Hayton writing on his dumb and insulting book "The Invention of China."
LOL judging from the ad hominem from Solarz and the bullshits about invention of China that you both threw to me, seems that i scratched the right chord. I am not trying to dissolve the national identity of anyone. I'm just a poor Greek that just above i dissolved my national ID to the pieces that is formed of and found that is nothing to be afraid of . Nationalism on the other hand is something to be afraid of. And yes, during Roman and Byzantine times, large parts of Europe and more, were enforced to a single entity. Could anyone kindly inform me, the poor European, when China was a single entity that was in par with the PRC and for how long?
All you're doing is trying to turn an embarrassing US defeat into a shared-global-tragedy, which then automatically makes the US look like the hero for going to war with Muslims in the first place. You now want China to be afraid of Muslims, and you want Muslims to turn against China. But our civilization has never had any major issue with China historically. There were no 'Chinese Crusades' etc.
But the real issue is deeper still. The problem between 'the West' and Islam is much more fundamental. One can even say that this dichotomy is existential, at a philosophical and theological level. This is why when one side is on top, the other slips into a psychotic nightmare. Psychologists call this an "identity crises." Theologists simply call it "hell." The same thing happened to you in your 'dark age.' But just as your side woke up, eventually, so will we. And by the time we wake up, we will already be the imminent demographic global majority (bonus points.) Your side; however, looks like it's already slipping back into its second Dark Age. All your systems are starting to crumble, again, like the great aqueducts of Rome.
The Taliban are the result of that strategy. We'd need to ask our American friends how much it cost (the Saudis were only the middle men). Can't see the Taliban being interested in trying to export their business unless they're getting paid. They're sellers of rent-a-militia, not buyers. This can work in China's favour... China has cash, Taliban need cash. There's potential for a deal right there.
solarz
Brigadier
Ok, so you're just trolling. Got it.
Xia dynasty, 400 years.
Shang dynasty, 500 years.
Zhou dynasty, 800 years.
Han dynasty, 400 years.
Tang dynasty, 300 years.
Ming dynasty, 300 years.
Qing dynasty, 300 years.
Last edited: