China's Space Program News Thread
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Re: Chinese Satellites
Its not 50t to GTO, but rather 50t to LEO. It will be a powerful rocket, but not that powerful. AFAIK, its capacity to GTO is 19t
No variant of the LM5 has been decided or approved. In fact, the manned lunar program hasnt been decided or approved yet. Its still a ideia in the air.
Its not 50t to GTO, but rather 50t to LEO. It will be a powerful rocket, but not that powerful. AFAIK, its capacity to GTO is 19t
No variant of the LM5 has been decided or approved. In fact, the manned lunar program hasnt been decided or approved yet. Its still a ideia in the air.
Re: Chinese Satellites
An idea in the air, but certainly one that's likely to happen.
There's obviously been some quite detailed study into a manned lunar program, if you have a CDF account there's been a series of good notes and pictures on the proposed heavy 130 ton payload to LEO rocket/saturn 5 equivalent posted by user xyz
Post 86 onwards.
A series of sample pictures from some of his posts:
LM-5 compared with proposed 130 t LEO rocket
More detailed look
Moon module
Step by step plan.
I think it'll only be a matter of years before we hear definite plans of a manned moon landing.
An idea in the air, but certainly one that's likely to happen.
There's obviously been some quite detailed study into a manned lunar program, if you have a CDF account there's been a series of good notes and pictures on the proposed heavy 130 ton payload to LEO rocket/saturn 5 equivalent posted by user xyz
Post 86 onwards.
A series of sample pictures from some of his posts:
LM-5 compared with proposed 130 t LEO rocket
More detailed look
Moon module
Step by step plan.
I think it'll only be a matter of years before we hear definite plans of a manned moon landing.
Last edited:
escobar
Brigadier
Re: Chinese Satellites
sorry my mistake
Not yet approved by the politburo but initial reseach have probably began
Hendrik_2000
Lieutenant General
Re: Chinese Satellites
I don't know about approval to the moon but seem they already tested the LM 5 rocket engine and start manufacturing the rocket.Maybe they are talking even bigger rocket here
China considers big rocket power
By Anatoly Zak Science reporter
Chinese engineers are considering a new super-powerful engine for the next generation of space rockets, say officials.
According to Li Tongyu, general manager of the marketing department at the China Academy of Launch Vehicle Technology (CALT), engineers are currently studying a rocket engine capable of generating thrust of 600 tonnes.
If China succeeds in the development of such power, it would increase the nation's capabilities in space by orders of magnitude.
For comparison, China is currently well in the development of its most powerful rocket to date - Long March-5 - that would sport engines with the thrust of 120 tonnes.
"Rockets (with 600-tonne thrust engines) would only be justified for things like sending humans to the Moon, if such projects are approved," Li Tongyu told BBC News.
In March, the official China Daily newspaper disclosed that CALT was studying a super-heavy launch vehicle, which could be used to mount lunar expeditions.
At the time, the newspaper quoted CALT Vice President Liang Xiaohong as saying that the total lift-off thrust of the future heavy launcher would be 3,000 tonnes.
'Grander scale'
To develop such thrust, the first stage of the proposed rocket would need five 600-tonne engines, possibly distributed between one central stage and four strap-on boosters.
Computer graphic of the separation stage of a Long March-5 rocket (Image: CALT) China hopes to carry out its first LM-5 test launch in 2014
The rocket's architecture would thus be similar to the one adopted for the Long March-5 rocket, but at a considerably grander scale.
Although the expected payload of the future heavy lifter had not been disclosed, available details allow placing it close to the same category with that of the Saturn-5 rocket, which carried US astronauts to the Moon.
In the meantime, the development of the Long March-5 rocket was proceeding well toward its first test launch, currently expected in 2014, Li Tongyu said.
The vehicle's first stage engine had already accumulated more than 10,000 seconds of firing during tests - an important milestone on the way to its certification for real missions.
A full-scale prototype of the Long March 5 rocket would be ready for testing in 2012 and a year later, test firing of fully assembled rocket stages would be conducted.
When operational, Long March-5 is expected to deliver up to 25 tonnes of payload, including space station modules to the low Earth orbit, and up to 14 tonnes to the so-called geostationary transfer orbit, where most communications satellites are released after launch.
At the UK's Farnborough airshow, CALT demonstrated computer-generation videos, showcasing impressive new assembly and launch infrastructure of the Long March-5 rocket.
Newly built facilities will feature a sprawling campus not far from Chinese capital Beijing, where the rocket would be assembled.
The rocket stages would then be shipped to the launch site in the very south of China, where it could take advantage of the Earth rotation to maximise its cargo capabilities.
Along with Earth-orbiting satellites, the Long March-5 is expected to carry Chinese spacecraft into deep space, including unmanned missions to return soil samples from the Moon.
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I don't know about approval to the moon but seem they already tested the LM 5 rocket engine and start manufacturing the rocket.Maybe they are talking even bigger rocket here
China considers big rocket power
By Anatoly Zak Science reporter
Chinese engineers are considering a new super-powerful engine for the next generation of space rockets, say officials.
According to Li Tongyu, general manager of the marketing department at the China Academy of Launch Vehicle Technology (CALT), engineers are currently studying a rocket engine capable of generating thrust of 600 tonnes.
If China succeeds in the development of such power, it would increase the nation's capabilities in space by orders of magnitude.
For comparison, China is currently well in the development of its most powerful rocket to date - Long March-5 - that would sport engines with the thrust of 120 tonnes.
"Rockets (with 600-tonne thrust engines) would only be justified for things like sending humans to the Moon, if such projects are approved," Li Tongyu told BBC News.
In March, the official China Daily newspaper disclosed that CALT was studying a super-heavy launch vehicle, which could be used to mount lunar expeditions.
At the time, the newspaper quoted CALT Vice President Liang Xiaohong as saying that the total lift-off thrust of the future heavy launcher would be 3,000 tonnes.
'Grander scale'
To develop such thrust, the first stage of the proposed rocket would need five 600-tonne engines, possibly distributed between one central stage and four strap-on boosters.
Computer graphic of the separation stage of a Long March-5 rocket (Image: CALT) China hopes to carry out its first LM-5 test launch in 2014
The rocket's architecture would thus be similar to the one adopted for the Long March-5 rocket, but at a considerably grander scale.
Although the expected payload of the future heavy lifter had not been disclosed, available details allow placing it close to the same category with that of the Saturn-5 rocket, which carried US astronauts to the Moon.
In the meantime, the development of the Long March-5 rocket was proceeding well toward its first test launch, currently expected in 2014, Li Tongyu said.
The vehicle's first stage engine had already accumulated more than 10,000 seconds of firing during tests - an important milestone on the way to its certification for real missions.
A full-scale prototype of the Long March 5 rocket would be ready for testing in 2012 and a year later, test firing of fully assembled rocket stages would be conducted.
When operational, Long March-5 is expected to deliver up to 25 tonnes of payload, including space station modules to the low Earth orbit, and up to 14 tonnes to the so-called geostationary transfer orbit, where most communications satellites are released after launch.
At the UK's Farnborough airshow, CALT demonstrated computer-generation videos, showcasing impressive new assembly and launch infrastructure of the Long March-5 rocket.
Newly built facilities will feature a sprawling campus not far from Chinese capital Beijing, where the rocket would be assembled.
The rocket stages would then be shipped to the launch site in the very south of China, where it could take advantage of the Earth rotation to maximise its cargo capabilities.
Along with Earth-orbiting satellites, the Long March-5 is expected to carry Chinese spacecraft into deep space, including unmanned missions to return soil samples from the Moon.
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Re: Chinese Satellites
Only two stages. Maybe it uses some sort of relax into orbit methods, a derivative of the relaxed trajectory used by the two-stage JL-2. SLBM.
More detailed look
Only two stages. Maybe it uses some sort of relax into orbit methods, a derivative of the relaxed trajectory used by the two-stage JL-2. SLBM.
escobar
Brigadier
German Satellite Almost Crashed into Beijing
The research satellite Rosat, seen here in a computerized reprodution, crashed to Earth last October.
Last October, the German research satellite Rosat plunged into the Bay of Bengal, more than 20 years after it had been launched into orbit. But had it remained aloft for just seven more minutes, it would have landed in Beijing instead, new calculations show.
It was a proud day for German science when, on June 1, 1990, Rosat was launched into orbit from Cape Canaveral. The research satellite was chock full of the most modern technology available, allowing scientists the ability to search the skies for the source of X-ray radiation for the first time.
Rosat didn't disappoint. Originally, it was to remain in operation for 18 months, but ultimately in collected data for almost nine years. The satellite registered tens of thousands of radiation sources, which included distant galaxies and black holes.
In the end, though, Rosat nearly caused what would have been among the worst catastrophes in the history of space exploration. In the night from Oct. 22 to 23 last year, the defunct satellite fell to Earth -- just barely missing the Chinese capital Beijing, population 20 million. According to calculations by the European Space Agency, satellite fragments, travelling at speeds of some 450 kilometers per hour, came perilously close to crashing into the city.
The satellite needed 90 minutes to orbit the Earth, "Beijing lay directly in the path of its last orbit," said Manfred Warhaut, a unit head at the European Space Operations Centre in Darmstadt, Germany. An impact "was very much within the realm of possibility," added Heiner Klinkrad, head of the ESA's Space Debris team.
The consequences could have been grave. Rosat weighed 2.5 tons. Normally, some 20 to 40 percent of a satellite reaches the Earth's surface when it falls out of orbit. "But with Rosat, we knew it would be around 60 percent because it was made out of particularly heavy and durable parts," said Klinkrad.
Deep Craters and Casualties
Parts of the satellite would likely have torn deep craters into the city, may have destroyed buildings and almost certainly would have resulted in human casualties. German-Chinese relations would likely have suffered as well.
The experts at ESA had had their eye on Rosat for many years. Once the satellite ceased operations in 1999, there was no longer any way to steer or otherwise control it. Slowly it began descending out of its orbit.
In Darmstadt, Klinkrad's team attempts to identify dying satellites like Rosat and to calculate as early as possible where they might strike the Earth's surface. But precision remains elusive. Only just before impact is it possible to calculate the corridor most at risk.
Officials at the ESA and at the German space agency DLR were thus greatly relieved when Rosat plunged into the Bay of Bengal's waters on the night of the Oct. 22 and not into the Chinese capital. But it was close. "Our calculations showed that, if Rosat had crashed to the ground just seven to 10 minutes later, it would have hit Beijing," says Klinkrad.
In addition to the likely human toll, it would also have been expensive for Germany. An international treaty makes those responsible for placing a satellite in orbit responsible for any damage caused when it comes down.
It is a provision that almost had to be applied to China and Russia in mid-January. The Russian space probe Phobos-Grunt, which was also carrying a Chinese orbiter to Mars, crashed back to Earth on Jan. 15 due to a technical defect. It fell into the eastern Pacific Ocean. Had it remained aloft for just a few more minutes, it would have crashed into South America.
---------- Post added at 05:30 AM ---------- Previous post was at 04:47 AM ----------
ISS Orbit Raised to Avoid Collision with Space Junk
Specialists of Russia's Mission Control Center raised the orbit altitude of the International Space Station (ISS) in the early hours of Sunday to prevent a possible collision with a Chinese satellite fragment, a spokesman for the Center said.
"The maneuver was performed using Zvezda service module engines," the spokesman said.
The altitude of the ISS orbit was raised by 1.7 kilometers to 391.6 kilometers, he said, adding that the maneuver lasted 64 seconds.
NASA earlier reported on its website that 32 hours after Russia's Progress-M-14M docks with the ISS - which occurred at 4.08 am Moscow time (00:08 GMT) on Saturday - a fragment of the Chinese Fengyun-1C weather satellite is likely to pass in dangerous proximity to the space station.
The satellite fragment approached the ISS several times in the past, most recently on January 24, but there was no need to change the station's altitude at that time, the spokesman said.
The aging Fengyun-1C satellite was destroyed in 2007 during Chinese anti-satellite missile tests. Thousands of its fragments have since remained in orbit.
The research satellite Rosat, seen here in a computerized reprodution, crashed to Earth last October.
Last October, the German research satellite Rosat plunged into the Bay of Bengal, more than 20 years after it had been launched into orbit. But had it remained aloft for just seven more minutes, it would have landed in Beijing instead, new calculations show.
It was a proud day for German science when, on June 1, 1990, Rosat was launched into orbit from Cape Canaveral. The research satellite was chock full of the most modern technology available, allowing scientists the ability to search the skies for the source of X-ray radiation for the first time.
Rosat didn't disappoint. Originally, it was to remain in operation for 18 months, but ultimately in collected data for almost nine years. The satellite registered tens of thousands of radiation sources, which included distant galaxies and black holes.
In the end, though, Rosat nearly caused what would have been among the worst catastrophes in the history of space exploration. In the night from Oct. 22 to 23 last year, the defunct satellite fell to Earth -- just barely missing the Chinese capital Beijing, population 20 million. According to calculations by the European Space Agency, satellite fragments, travelling at speeds of some 450 kilometers per hour, came perilously close to crashing into the city.
The satellite needed 90 minutes to orbit the Earth, "Beijing lay directly in the path of its last orbit," said Manfred Warhaut, a unit head at the European Space Operations Centre in Darmstadt, Germany. An impact "was very much within the realm of possibility," added Heiner Klinkrad, head of the ESA's Space Debris team.
The consequences could have been grave. Rosat weighed 2.5 tons. Normally, some 20 to 40 percent of a satellite reaches the Earth's surface when it falls out of orbit. "But with Rosat, we knew it would be around 60 percent because it was made out of particularly heavy and durable parts," said Klinkrad.
Deep Craters and Casualties
Parts of the satellite would likely have torn deep craters into the city, may have destroyed buildings and almost certainly would have resulted in human casualties. German-Chinese relations would likely have suffered as well.
The experts at ESA had had their eye on Rosat for many years. Once the satellite ceased operations in 1999, there was no longer any way to steer or otherwise control it. Slowly it began descending out of its orbit.
In Darmstadt, Klinkrad's team attempts to identify dying satellites like Rosat and to calculate as early as possible where they might strike the Earth's surface. But precision remains elusive. Only just before impact is it possible to calculate the corridor most at risk.
Officials at the ESA and at the German space agency DLR were thus greatly relieved when Rosat plunged into the Bay of Bengal's waters on the night of the Oct. 22 and not into the Chinese capital. But it was close. "Our calculations showed that, if Rosat had crashed to the ground just seven to 10 minutes later, it would have hit Beijing," says Klinkrad.
In addition to the likely human toll, it would also have been expensive for Germany. An international treaty makes those responsible for placing a satellite in orbit responsible for any damage caused when it comes down.
It is a provision that almost had to be applied to China and Russia in mid-January. The Russian space probe Phobos-Grunt, which was also carrying a Chinese orbiter to Mars, crashed back to Earth on Jan. 15 due to a technical defect. It fell into the eastern Pacific Ocean. Had it remained aloft for just a few more minutes, it would have crashed into South America.
---------- Post added at 05:30 AM ---------- Previous post was at 04:47 AM ----------
ISS Orbit Raised to Avoid Collision with Space Junk
Specialists of Russia's Mission Control Center raised the orbit altitude of the International Space Station (ISS) in the early hours of Sunday to prevent a possible collision with a Chinese satellite fragment, a spokesman for the Center said.
"The maneuver was performed using Zvezda service module engines," the spokesman said.
The altitude of the ISS orbit was raised by 1.7 kilometers to 391.6 kilometers, he said, adding that the maneuver lasted 64 seconds.
NASA earlier reported on its website that 32 hours after Russia's Progress-M-14M docks with the ISS - which occurred at 4.08 am Moscow time (00:08 GMT) on Saturday - a fragment of the Chinese Fengyun-1C weather satellite is likely to pass in dangerous proximity to the space station.
The satellite fragment approached the ISS several times in the past, most recently on January 24, but there was no need to change the station's altitude at that time, the spokesman said.
The aging Fengyun-1C satellite was destroyed in 2007 during Chinese anti-satellite missile tests. Thousands of its fragments have since remained in orbit.
Equation
Lieutenant General
Yep, and don't forget the lasers.
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