China's Space Program News Thread

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iantsai

Junior Member
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Yes it's on the card. I've seen a photo of both Tianhe module side by side on the ground even.

Here's a visualization what it would look like if phase 2 expansion is completed:
View attachment 95813
Note that Tianhe 1's solar panels have been detached and moved to Mengtian and Wentian while Tianhe 2 still has its solar panels attached. If you look up the official animation of the functions of the large robotic arm detaching and moving solar panel is listed as one of its capabilities.
New crew ships are needed for this ambitious plan.

If the second core module would be identical with Tianhe and the new lab modules would be like Wentian and Mengtian, then with a structure expected above there would be at least 12 astronauts in the orbit (3 x 2 beds in the core modules and 3 x 2 in two Wentian clasd module), or 18 astronauts at max (3 x 6 = 18).

But with only three ports for the crew ships (the fwd port and two radial ones) they could only evacuate 9 astronauts in a state of emergency.

So the new generation crew ship which is supposed to have seven seats is the key factor for this phase-two model.

I would be very anxious to see the new 100t core module to be launched as the first or second payload of the new CZ-9 rockets. ;)
 

iantsai

Junior Member
Registered Member
在8月20日清晨,央视《朝闻天下》频道播出的“长征系列火箭创造连续发射成功新纪录”系列报道中介绍到长征火箭自2020年5月5日至今,实现连续103次发射成功,打破此前保持的连续102次发射成功纪录!另外报道中,新一代载人火箭和重型火箭也双双现身。
The Changzheng series rockets achieved 103 consecutive successful launches between May 5, 2020 and August 20, 2022.

This refreshed their previous record of 102 consecutive success between two failure in August 18, 1996 and August 18, 2011 (yes the two FTO incidents were both in August 18, with a 15 years interval).
 

Strangelove

Colonel
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China's top space contractor CASC reveals new launch vehicle able to send Chinese to Moon by around 2030

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Published: Aug 21, 2022 07:48 PM

Long March-5 Y5 carrier rocket commissioned for the Chang'e-5 lunar mission has started fuel injection on Monday, and is set to launch the probe on Tuesday between 4 to 5 am at the Wenchang Space Launch Center in South China's Hainan Province on Tuesday. Photo: VCG

Long March-5 Y5 carrier rocket commissioned for the Chang'e-5 lunar mission has started fuel injection and is set to launch the probe on Nov 24, 2020, between 4 to 5 am at the Wenchang Space Launch Center in South China's Hainan Province. Photo: VCG

China's new-generation manned rocket, which is currently under development, will possess the capability to send taikonauts to the Moon by around 2030, Global Times has learned from China's state-owned space giant China Aerospace Science and Technology Corporation (CASC).

A CASC spokesperson made the remarks to the media after the Long March 2D carrier rocket smoothly sent the remote sensing Yaogan-35 04 group of satellites on early Saturday morning, which saw the country's Long March rocket series breaking its own record with 103 consecutive successful space launch missions.

According to the CASC spokesperson, the country's super heavy-lift launch vehicle, which is also under development, will receive further strengthening to become capable of sending payloads of 50 tons to the Earth-Moon transfer orbit on completion, in order to support future lunar activity.

CASC is also working on a series of reusable space launch and transport systems, which will greatly boost the country's space shuttle capability, lowering costs and empowering future development in this domain, the spokesperson said, per a statement the CASC provided to the Global Times.

Meanwhile, the US is busy preparing for the launch of the massive Space Launch System (SLS) rocket, which is set to take place on the morning of August 29 [US local time] from the US Kennedy Space Center for the Artemis I mission - the first test of NASA's deep space exploration systems.

The Artemis I, according to the US space center, will be the first in a series of missions to demonstrate NASA's ability to extend human existence to the Moon and beyond.

The US series' first crewed flight, the Artemis III, will see boots on the lunar surface no earlier than 2026, more than half a century since NASA successfully sent humans to the moon in December 1972 in the Apollo 17 mission.

The US website space.com pointed out in an article on Friday that the 2026 mission is still "highly uncertain," given that the mission is relatively far away, but NASA does have some early-stage planning for the later 2020s.

The timeline for these missions depends a great deal on how much funding the agency receives from US Congress, along with the technical progress of the Artemis program, the report said.

Even if NASA could pull off the ambitious plan, it would already be a two-year delay as the US space agency has abandoned its original goal of sending humans to the moon by 2024.

Drawing a comparison between the lunar manned landing plans of China and the US, Chinese space experts pointed out that the US' practice of setting specific year deadlines is very rare in the industry, given the complex nature of deep space exploration, while China focuses more on technology readiness in a rather broad time frame, going forward steadily and surely.

China's crewed moon landing is more in line with scientific principles, but NASA might grow more hostile against China in the space domain given the huge pressure it is facing to maintain its global leadership in moon exploration, Wang Ya'nan, chief editor of the Beijing-based Aerospace Knowledge magazine, told the Global Times on Sunday, when asked if there would be a new space race between space powers around 2030.

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, in a groundless accusation that China wants to "occupy the moon," citing the lunar research base that China and Russia are co-building, which he is "very concerned about."

It is very likely that in order to meet the goals of the Artemis mission, given its tight timeline, NASA will further open management access of the International Space Station (ISS) to commercial space players such as SpaceX after 2024, as Russia has warned of its intention to pull out from the ISS by that year, and shift focus and resources to its lunar plans, Wang noted.

Space observers also pointed out that as NASA is trying hard to relive its Apollo glories, China is working on innovative plans to carry out its own crewed moon landing missions.

Even without the new-generation manned rocket and super-heavy lift launch vehicle, leading Chinese rocket scientist Long Lehao revealed in August 2021, China could use two rocket launches to send two taikonauts to the moon by around 2030.

Long, an academician of the Chinese Academy of Engineering and chief designer of the Long March rockets, said during a speech that China was planning to use new variants of the Long March-5 launch vehicle - the strongest member of the Long March rocket family - to carry out the manned space launch missions.

Long referred to the new variant as Long March-5 DY, which stands for "dengyue," meaning "lunar landing" in Chinese.

Two rockets carrying a lunar lander and a next-generation manned spaceship will be launched for the mission, and the two parts of the spacecraft will rendezvous and dock in near-lunar orbit, before executing the landing process. The two taikonauts are expected to work on the moon's surface for some six hours, according to Long. However, there is no mention of a specific landing site.

The new manned spaceship will then take off from the moon and carry out another docking with the orbiting module before heading back to Earth.
 

SinoRoger

Just Hatched
Registered Member
New crew ships are needed for this ambitious plan.

If the second core module would be identical with Tianhe and the new lab modules would be like Wentian and Mengtian, then with a structure expected above there would be at least 12 astronauts in the orbit (3 x 2 beds in the core modules and 3 x 2 in two Wentian clasd module), or 18 astronauts at max (3 x 6 = 18).

But with only three ports for the crew ships (the fwd port and two radial ones) they could only evacuate 9 astronauts in a state of emergency.

So the new generation crew ship which is supposed to have seven seats is the key factor for this phase-two model.

I would be very anxious to see the new 100t core module to be launched as the first or second payload of the new CZ-9 rockets. ;)
There is no way that 12 or even 18 astronauts are going to be onboard the Space Station, ever after expansion. The current station is meant for 3 with a maximum of 6 for 1-2 weeks. After expansion there is going to be room for 6 astronauts for six months. This will only require two docking ports. Also, we don't have evidence that the backup module Tianhe is going to have beds (it might me modified) and we certainly don't know if Wentian #2 is going to have beds. The beds on Wentian are not even meant to have astronauts sleeping in them for six months (the beds are right next to the inside gyroscopes on Wentian for example, so more noise). They only exists as extra beds during crew transfer onboard the station. So when the next crew arrives on the station they can use them for 1-2 weeks and then when the old crew leaves they would switch to the Tianhe beds.

On the leng term the issue of docking ports might not even exists, because the next generation spacecraft can carry six astronauts at once. The issue is more that the station can't support that many astronauts for such a long time. Even the ISS only has 7 astronauts. So yeah maybe for a very short time we will see 12, but certainly not long term.
 

taxiya

Brigadier
Registered Member
New crew ships are needed for this ambitious plan.

If the second core module would be identical with Tianhe and the new lab modules would be like Wentian and Mengtian, then with a structure expected above there would be at least 12 astronauts in the orbit (3 x 2 beds in the core modules and 3 x 2 in two Wentian clasd module), or 18 astronauts at max (3 x 6 = 18).

But with only three ports for the crew ships (the fwd port and two radial ones) they could only evacuate 9 astronauts in a state of emergency.

So the new generation crew ship which is supposed to have seven seats is the key factor for this phase-two model.
I doubt there will be more than 3 astranouts living in the phase II station for any long period except the short handover time. Every mission includes a crew ship and a cargo ship for the stay of less than 6 months. Even if the new crew ship can send 6 to the station, there is no cargo ship designed and planned to match the increased supply. Of course they can double the frequency of cargo resupply, but I would expect them double the size of cargo ship, therefor a new design pairing with the new crew ship.
 

iantsai

Junior Member
Registered Member
@taxiya @SinoRoger

I think with 2 core modules and 4 lab modules in orbit when CSS phase II completed there MUST be more beds, living facilities and space arranged.

With 1 core and 2 lab modules in phase I, CSS now has 6 beds. As SinoRoger mentioned the beds in Wentian lab are bear the noisy gyroscopes.

But they don't have to be there. In the #3 and #4 lab module CNSA could rearrange the living space and keep the sleeping zone more comfortable. There is not difficulty for the spacecraft designers.

Also, at CSS phase II, with 4 lab modules in orbit there must be lots of routine work to be done so there should be more than 3 astronauts resident long termly.

I think there would be 7-9 astronauts (one commander, one space engineer, one doctor and 4-6 scientists) and extra beds (maybe with the beds in Wentian) for rotators / visitors. So the ideal beds number would be 15 (9 for residents and 6 for rotation as the next generation crew ship have more seats than Shenzhou).

Although the ISS is much larger in size and weight and with 7 residents in orbit, it just has 3 node module (zvezda, harmony, tranquility), 4 lab module (destiny, nauka, columbus, kibo) and one cargo module (zarya) and several small modules.

Actually the ISS today has less scientific equipments and operating space than the CSS phase II.
 

Temstar

Brigadier
Registered Member
Given Tianhe-2 is backup for Tianhe-1 it's likely that it has 3 more beds.

For lab modules 3 and 4 there's no reason for them to have beds unless there is a burning need for long term 9 man crew. I could see a phase 2 where CSS is intended to have a permanent crew of 6 with 9 during a rotation:

3 on Tianhe-1
3 on Tianhe-2
3 temporarily on Wentian during crew exchange.

Once the four labs are berthed the station would have 4 docking ports - one forward, one aft and two nadir. This would allow:
3 Shenzhou and 1 Tianzhou docked, during a crew exchange
2 Shenzhou and 2 Tianzhou docked, during a cargo delivery

So just have to avoid both crew exchange and cargo delivery a the same time, so same situation as now. With the 3 ports available after phase 1 is complete you can't have both new crew and new cargo at the same time either as that would demand 2 shenzhou and 2 tianzhou docked.

If instead you're using next generation crewed spacraft instead of Shenzhou and have a crew of 6 then maybe you need to have 3 more beds between lab 3 and 4. So then it's just the same model as now except you're exchanging 6 crew at once with 12 onboard during a handover.
 
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iantsai

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2022年8月23日10时36分,我国在西昌卫星发射中心使用快舟一号甲运载火箭,成功将中科院创新十六号卫星发射升空,卫星顺利进入预定轨道,发射任务获得圆满成功。该卫星主要用于科学试验、新技术验证等领域。

此次任务是快舟一号甲运载火箭的第16次飞行。
China launched Chuangxin-16(Innovation-16) satellite by KZ-1A rocket from Xichang Satellites Launch Center at 10:36, August 23 UTC+8. Chuangxin-16 is a scientific experiment / new technology validation satelite developed by China Academy of Science.

This is the 16th launch mission of KZ-1A satelite.
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