China's SCS Strategy Thread

[2handedswordsman]

In the late 80s, Vietnam began to realize that the Soviet downfall is imminent. That's why it reached out to China for peace and attempted to copy China's model by opening up its economy. In the 90s, many Vietnamese returned from oversea and pro-West factions in the South is strengthened due to the focus is turning to economy. Vietnam has slowly become pro-West and anti-China become more prominent.

The story behind bad Sino-Viet relations is complicated. After the North Vietnam win and withdrawal of US forces from Vietnam, Vietnam forces started a campaign against the red Khmer's regime in Cambodia. Khmer's behind their pro-communist camouflage, was a regime supported by CIA who suppressed the real Cambodian Communists and used by US as a distraction to Vietcongs, harrasing villages in Vietnam and claiming Vietnam territories. So Vietnam undistracted (Americans left) turned full on against Khmers. That's when PRC started a low profile war against Vietnam to make them stop. My belief is that it was a tactic mistake from Chinese side turning against a real communist ally, to justify the compliance of PRC to US interests, since it was those times that Nixon and Mao got in contacts. Maybe Nixon blackmailed like "stop them, or we are not coming to invest to your free economic zones". Vietnam after the fall of the USSR suffered a lot, like every other Soviet ally, they needed bad financial assistance which they got it from IMF and Word bank, while giving up to western requirements, like stop anti west propaganda and open up the economy to foreign capital.

 

[bajingan]

There are suggestions within US think tanks to seize territories of neutral countries in the South China sea in the event of a military conflict against China. This is a clear indication that the US is not genuinely interested in protecting the sovereignty of the countries involved in SCS dispute.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1367914657634152452

I have discussed this with my indonesian source, he said any attempts by the us or anyone to forcefully land forces in indonesia will be met by force
Not like the military have a choice, if this aggression is not challenged, the youth students will join forces with the islamic factions within indonesia they will riot and declare jihad especially if this america a christian country, it will be a nightmare of social unrests and islamic extremism will rise again
Any indonesian president who agreed to let indonesian territory be used as a military facility base for any country will be coup by the military
This will backfire really badly for americans if they seriously contemplating this

 

[Yodello]

There are suggestions within US think tanks to seize territories of neutral countries in the South China sea in the event of a military conflict against China. This is a clear indication that the US is not genuinely interested in protecting the sovereignty of the countries involved in SCS dispute.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1367914657634152452

The Murderous American Thugs. They are getting bolder and their word are becoming more blunt. This should be published and pasted in every website and social media to show the world what a war-mongering bunch of racist thugs the Americans are.

 

[Hendrik_2000]

The story behind bad Sino-Viet relations is complicated. After the North Vietnam win and withdrawal of US forces from Vietnam, Vietnam forces started a campaign against the red Khmer's regime in Cambodia. Khmer's behind their pro-communist camouflage, was a regime supported by CIA who suppressed the real Cambodian Communists and used by US as a distraction to Vietcongs, harrasing villages in Vietnam and claiming Vietnam territories. So Vietnam undistracted (Americans left) turned full on against Khmers. That's when PRC started a low profile war against Vietnam to make them stop. My belief is that it was a tactic mistake from Chinese side turning against a real communist ally, to justify the compliance of PRC to US interests, since it was those times that Nixon and Mao got in contacts. Maybe Nixon blackmailed like "stop them, or we are not coming to invest to your free economic zones". Vietnam after the fall of the USSR suffered a lot, like every other Soviet ally, they needed bad financial assistance which they got it from IMF and Word bank, while giving up to western requirements, like stop anti west propaganda and open up the economy to foreign capital.

I don't think that is right and distortion of China position There is no doubt a congruence of US and China position in regard to Vietnam invasion of Cambodia. There is no arm twisting or bribery from US to invade Vietnam. If I remember correctly it was Vietnam that invade Cambodia because the Khmer rouge was harassing Vietnamese settler along the border As well those area was part of Ho Chi min trail that provide supply to Vietcong during the war So Vietnam was well entrench in those area. Don't forget that South Vietnam territory was carved out from old Cambodia kingdom, were it not for the Chinese and later French Cambodia will be annexed by Vietnam. Vietnam is very aggressive thru history annexing neighboring country the Cham what is now South Vietnam. So China has always been protector of Cambodia coupled with good relation between Norodom Sihanouk with Chinese leadership it is expected that China intervene on behalf of Cambodia. Sihanouk live in Beijing after Lon Nol coup and stay there during the war. Vietnam taking side with Soviet Union only aggravate the situation. I think they the Vietnamese are overconfident after defeating the US resulting in border war with China But Vietnam economy is in shamble and they need peace coupled with their patron Soviet collapse they have no choice but to sue for peace with China

 

[KYli]

The story behind bad Sino-Viet relations is complicated. After the North Vietnam win and withdrawal of US forces from Vietnam, Vietnam forces started a campaign against the red Khmer's regime in Cambodia. Khmer's behind their pro-communist camouflage, was a regime supported by CIA who suppressed the real Cambodian Communists and used by US as a distraction to Vietcongs, harrasing villages in Vietnam and claiming Vietnam territories. So Vietnam undistracted (Americans left) turned full on against Khmers. That's when PRC started a low profile war against Vietnam to make them stop. My belief is that it was a tactic mistake from Chinese side turning against a real communist ally, to justify the compliance of PRC to US interests, since it was those times that Nixon and Mao got in contacts. Maybe Nixon blackmailed like "stop them, or we are not coming to invest to your free economic zones". Vietnam after the fall of the USSR suffered a lot, like every other Soviet ally, they needed bad financial assistance which they got it from IMF and Word bank, while giving up to western requirements, like stop anti west propaganda and open up the economy to foreign capital.

Vietnam had already allied itself with the Soviet unlike NK which chose not to take side. At that time, the Soviet was threatened to use nuclear bombs on China and invade China. It is Deng that initiated the border war with Vietnam not Mao.

Strategically, it is a very brilliant move to punish Vietnam for betrayal and allying itself with the Soviet against China. Firstly, the Sino-Vietnam border war had exposed that the Soviet didn't want to engage a two front wars with China in the east and the American in the Europe. Which essential is calling the Soviet bluff and removing the imminent threat of a Soviet invasion and ending the urgency to move all major Chinese industries to Sichuan and Chongqing. Secondly, Chinese military is in a bad shape due to the culture revolution and the war with Vietnam has reinvigorated the PLA and boosted its moral. Thirdly, the border war ensured that Vietnam couldn't conquer the Indochina and become a regional power that could further threaten the stability in the SEA. Lastly, the border war removed any illusion that the Soviet and China break can be repaired. Consequently, the US and other Western powers would have no reservation to restore tie with China and cooperate with China against the Soviet.

 

[KYli]

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[HybridHypothesis]

I have discussed this with my indonesian source, he said any attempts by the us or anyone to forcefully land forces in indonesia will be met by force
Not like the military have a choice, if this aggression is not challenged, the youth students will join forces with the islamic factions within indonesia they will riot and declare jihad especially if this america a christian country, it will be a nightmare of social unrests and islamic extremism will rise again
Any indonesian president who agreed to let indonesian territory be used as a military facility base for any country will be coup by the military
This will backfire really badly for americans if they seriously contemplating this

Inshallah

 

[Insignius]

If it comes down to it, no asian nation can deny the US from forcibly invading and making their country into missile bases against China. Dont delude yourself thinking you can resist the US, or that your government, that will be heavily pressured by the US at that point and/or sanctioned to hell, WILL EVEN WANT to resist.

This will be like Belgium during the Nazi Invasion of France all over again.
You cant stop it, you cant fight it, and the US wont care if they have to murder millions of you and take millions more of you hostage to make your country into their staging ground.

Sorry if this sounds harsh, but when great powers fight, there is no mercy for the small guy. Especially not if this is a fight for the survival of american hegemony; something on which the living standards of 300+ million US citizens vitally depends on every single day.

 

[2handedswordsman]

@Hendrik_2000 @KYli

Depends at your point of view. As a european Communist i read the history through the cause i give my support to. Sorry for the mistake, i said Mao without source just false memory recall but to give the general image, which i think was understood. Sino-Soviet split came after USSR's denounce of Stalin and the opportunistic peaceful coexistence (with imperialists), pro market reform tactic in CPSU and the end of revolutionary era of USSR. The era of political and economic stagnation of SU begun. CPC strongly opposed CPSU opportunists even breaking relations, after nuclear threats which is correct. I also condemn CPSU after this era, don't get me misunderstood. The communist cause took a huge hit after the split and CPC made a lot of tactical maneuvres just to survive. I said it was a wrong tactic for the communist cause, to throw a war against Vietnam which just threw away USA out of its land. Vietnam invaded Cambodia to put down the fascist Khmers, known US allies, not to incorporate Cambodia into Vietnam. When it comes to geopolitics unfortunately ideology steps back. Something similar happened to my homeland (Greece ) , where the Communist rebels left alone to fight Fascists-Royalists, English and Americans at the civil war (1946-1949) without any substancial support of the Soviet Union. Yalta conference was already decided that Greece was meant to be in the Western sphere of influence.

@Insignius Unfortunately USA got the inevitable downturn and it is more wise for US politicians to really focus to the US citizens and their rapidly declining living standards.

 

[HybridHypothesis]

@Hendrik_2000 @KYli

Depends at your point of view. As a european Communist i read the history through the cause i give my support to. Sorry for the mistake, i said Mao without source just false memory recall but to give the general image, which i think was understood. Sino-Soviet split came after USSR's denounce of Stalin and the opportunistic peaceful coexistence (with imperialists), pro market reform tactic in CPSU and the end of revolutionary era of USSR. The era of political and economic stagnation of SU begun. CPC strongly opposed CPSU opportunists even breaking relations, after nuclear threats which is correct. I also condemn CPSU after this era, don't get me misunderstood. The communist cause took a huge hit after the split and CPC made a lot of tactical maneuvres just to survive. I said it was a wrong tactic for the communist cause, to throw a war against Vietnam which just threw away USA out of its land. Vietnam invaded Cambodia to put down the fascist Khmers, known US allies, not to incorporate Cambodia into Vietnam. When it comes to geopolitics unfortunately ideology steps back. Something similar happened to my homeland (Greece ) , where the Communist rebels left alone to fight Fascists-Royalists, English and Americans at the civil war (1946-1949) without any substancial support of the Soviet Union. Yalta conference was already decided that Greece was meant to be in the Western sphere of influence.

@Insignius Unfortunately USA got the inevitable downturn and it is more wise for US politicians to really focus to the US citizens and their rapidly declining living standards.

The US has been robbing its citizens for its global empire / world order ever since 1945. Its baked into the self conceptions of the decision makers.