china/taiwan news

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PiSigma

PiSigma

"the engineer"
If the mainland decided to takeout any of ROC's hardware, then it won't be some antiquated subs, it will be their newest and greatest then go all in. There won't be any time given for US to mobilize or the ROC to mobilize.

No one cares what the Dutch call Taiwan or the straight, there had been Chinese names for this area for 2000+ years. Or are you one of those guys that thinks it's not European name then it don't count?

US can try to "retaliate" but what's their reason?? Why don't the Dutch try to "retaliate" as well? The above two posts are the dumbest thing I have read on this forum for awhile now.
 
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SpicySichuan

Senior Member
Registered Member
PiSigma said:
it will be their newest and greatest then go all in.
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Well, I highly doubt that the PLA possess the capacity to take (I mean landing/air dropping thousands of ground troops to occupy strategic infrastructures and defend them for a day or two) within the first 12 hours of the opening salvo. Keep in mind that the F-22s in Okinawa and F-35s in Iwakuni could still reach Taiwan within hours of the opening salvo. As soon as the U.S. forces in Okinawa and main islands of Japan are activated, you got U.S.-China war, which is something Beijing will try to avoid. That's why the North Korean hit-and-run tactics make sense under such scenario. You want to punch your opponent hard enough to send a message of defiance, especially where it hurts, but you don't want to provoke an overwhelming response from his big bros.
 
plawolf

plawolf

Lieutenant General
Josh Luo said:
Well, I highly doubt that the PLA possess the capacity to take (I mean landing/air dropping thousands of ground troops to occupy strategic infrastructures and defend them for a day or two) within the first 12 hours of the opening salvo. Keep in mind that the F-22s in Okinawa and F-35s in Iwakuni could still reach Taiwan within hours of the opening salvo. As soon as the U.S. forces in Okinawa and main islands of Japan are activated, you got U.S.-China war, which is something Beijing will try to avoid. That's why the North Korean hit-and-run tactics make sense under such scenario. You want to punch your opponent hard enough to send a message of defiance, especially where it hurts, but you don't want to provoke an overwhelming response from his big bros.
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Please don’t be stupid. If China uses direct military force against Taiwan, it will be for only one purpose, reunification.

Your silly ‘hit and run’ stunts would achieve nothing but have China take the full diplomatic damage without any meaningful military gains all the while giving US forces plenty of time to mobilise. That’s pretty much the worst of all worlds for China, and one struggles to think how someone who has China’s best interests at heart could honestly think of such a god-awful strategy.

US forward deploy forces are within a few hours of Taiwan, sure, but they haven’t got the numbers or the hardware to make a meaningful difference. It’s hardware and numbers that matter in the real world. This isn’t some Hollywood wet dream where a handful of Americans will turn the tide by their mere magical white presence.

For US forward deployed forces to jump in immediately and attack Chinese forces directly would be just as stupid for the US as your hit and run tactics would be for China, as all that will achieve is give China the perfect pretext to obliterate all US forward based while they are all weak and under-strength for minimal cost.

At the end of the day, it’s raw power that counts, America can pass any silly laws it wants, but at the end of the day, it needs the raw military might to follow-through, and it does not have that against China in China’s own front yard any more.
 
manqiangrexue

manqiangrexue

Brigadier
Orthan said:
They will never be able to get taiwan back. At least, not without taiwan consent. And taiwan will never agree to join the PRC, and will only accept joining the ROC. The lack of formal relationships has not impeded taiwan from being an economic and technological powerhouse.

So, i think that it would be better for the chinese government to stop being bellicose every time that taiwan makes relations to other countries. No one will cut relations with china in order to start relations with taiwan. The two sides of the taiwan strait (or the formosa strait, the name my countrymen gave to the island when they arrived there in 1516 ;) ) should maintain at least peaceful relations.

But i think that the chinese government may have a fear that acepting this could jeopardize their legitimacy as the government of china in the eyes of the chinese people. So, they keep the hostility toward taiwan.
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Never is a long time and Chinese ambitions are not small like yours. Territories get taken by force all the time in history so it would be better for you to stay in your own nation's politics. It's not 1516 and you have no power anymore :p . Peace and war are the choice of the PLA; your choice is to watch or not, and Taiwan's choice is how peaceful or violent do they want the eventual reunification to be.
 
PiSigma

PiSigma

"the engineer"
plawolf said:
Please don’t be stupid. If China uses direct military force against Taiwan, it will be for only one purpose, reunification.

Your silly ‘hit and run’ stunts would achieve nothing but have China take the full diplomatic damage without any meaningful military gains all the while giving US forces plenty of time to mobilise. That’s pretty much the worst of all worlds for China, and one struggles to think how someone who has China’s best interests at heart could honestly think of such a god-awful strategy.

US forward deploy forces are within a few hours of Taiwan, sure, but they haven’t got the numbers or the hardware to make a meaningful difference. It’s hardware and numbers that matter in the real world. This isn’t some Hollywood wet dream where a handful of Americans will turn the tide by their mere magical white presence.

For US forward deployed forces to jump in immediately and attack Chinese forces directly would be just as stupid for the US as your hit and run tactics would be for China, as all that will achieve is give China the perfect pretext to obliterate all US forward based while they are all weak and under-strength for minimal cost.

At the end of the day, it’s raw power that counts, America can pass any silly laws it wants, but at the end of the day, it needs the raw military might to follow-through, and it does not have that against China in China’s own front yard any more.
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Josh supports hk terrorists, so he doesn't have China's best interest at heart.
 
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tamsen_ikard

Junior Member
Registered Member
Orthan said:
They will never be able to get taiwan back. At least, not without taiwan consent. And taiwan will never agree to join the PRC, and will only accept joining the ROC. The lack of formal relationships has not impeded taiwan from being an economic and technological powerhouse.

So, i think that it would be better for the chinese government to stop being bellicose every time that taiwan makes relations to other countries. No one will cut relations with china in order to start relations with taiwan. The two sides of the taiwan strait (or the formosa strait, the name my countrymen gave to the island when they arrived there in 1516 ;) ) should maintain at least peaceful relations.

But i think that the chinese government may have a fear that acepting this could jeopardize their legitimacy as the government of china in the eyes of the chinese people. So, they keep the hostility toward taiwan.
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May I know why you think China cannot take Taiwan back?

China is a country with 1.4 billion people. Its bigger than US, EU and all their vassals in Asia combined and then double that. China is slowly modernizing and urbanizing into a developed country. I expect in 10 years China surpass US GDP. By 2050 it will be equal to Japan in GDP per capita and thus will be at least 3 times bigger than US GDP. In the mean time China's military budget will be double or triple US numbers, its naval and air power will double US numbers.

China will be the absolute dominant power in East Asia. Imagine China trying to fight US in Mexico, well that's the kind of impossible war US will face when fighting China in its own backyard. Its a hopeless suicide. As this kind of power disparity emerges US will simply give up on Asia. Or they can be foolish and fight China in its own backyard and gets beaten into humiliation.

The point is, Chinese people are equal to US people in terms of talent and they will not remain poor. They will be developed and rich and just by sheer numbers they will dominate Asia.


US with just 300 million people can no longer dominate the world when China exists with 4 times more people that are more hard working and equally talented.
 
Gatekeeper

Gatekeeper

Brigadier
Registered Member
Orthan said:
They will never be able to get taiwan back. At least, not without taiwan consent. And taiwan will never agree to join the PRC, and will only accept joining the ROC. The lack of formal relationships has not impeded taiwan from being an economic and technological powerhouse.

So, i think that it would be better for the chinese government to stop being bellicose every time that taiwan makes relations to other countries. No one will cut relations with china in order to start relations with taiwan. The two sides of the taiwan strait (or the formosa strait, the name my countrymen gave to the island when they arrived there in 1516 ;) ) should maintain at least peaceful relations.

But i think that the chinese government may have a fear that acepting this could jeopardize their legitimacy as the government of china in the eyes of the chinese people. So, they keep the hostility toward taiwan.
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So a Dutchman trying to tell Chinese that Taiwan is Formosa. Figures.
 
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SpicySichuan

Senior Member
Registered Member
plawolf said:
For US forward deployed forces to jump in immediately
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Keep in mind that the U.S. forward-deployed forces include large batches of F-22s and F-35s, as well as Virginia class submarines constantly patrolling the waters of South and East China Seas. The stealth weapons could degrade large numbers of PLA naval and air assets during the "jump-in." Yes, the PLARF will annihilate large numbers of U.S. and Japanese bases, but the forward- deployed F-22s and F-35s, along with the Virginias, could do tons of damage to the PLA to significantly slow down the invasion. Yes, large numbers of U.S. pilots and sailors will die, but that's called war.
Do not underestimate Washington elites' and decision makers' will to maintain their hegemonic position. It was stupid for Britain to try to contain Germany and bled white after the two world wars, but the fears of relative decline drive decision makers of a status-quo power mad (or rational, if you believe in hegemonic war), and they will do anything to hold onto whatever they still possess. And since Washington still arguably "possess" Taiwan, the former will likely fight due to self-perceived strategic and ideological interests. In reality, nobody would peacefully handover something that he or she already possesses (or believe that he or she possesses), especially if that person is in a position of perceived material and ideational domination over others.
 
Gatekeeper

Gatekeeper

Brigadier
Registered Member
Josh Luo said:
Yes, large numbers of U.S. pilots and sailors will die, but that's called war.
Do not underestimate Washington elites' and decision makers' will to maintain their hegemonic position. It was stupid for Britain to try to contain Germany and bled white after the two world wars,
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Large number of US death. Lol. You believe that US is willing to take large casualties for tiny Taiwan says all about your assumption.

And as for Britain containing Germany after two world wars.... well I haven't got a clue what you're on about!
 
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