China ICBM/SLBM, nuclear arms thread

King ZhaoXiang

New Member
Registered Member
To my count, 641, 644, 645, 651, 652, 664 is very likely to be DF-41 brigade and 647 is a potential candidate. You are right that they might not be fully operational but the estimation won't change that much in overall warheads count.

The main indicator is the 23m garage to house the 21m DF-41.
For example, 652 brigade garrison here.
View attachment 109135


Yumen 120 silos, Hami 110 silos, Ordos 90 silos.

DF-26/27 could deal with regional nuclear demand and it doesn't count in arm control meanwhile DF-31 definitely will be counted as launcher/missile in arm control and not very potent on MIRV and survivability.

Question regarding these missile base !!

In the even of a US first strike, would all the base housing ICBM be taken out ?

How to deal with this ?
 

King ZhaoXiang

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I'm half way through the
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, a
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specializing in space program and strategic weapon.
At 1:57:45, while discussing peak cold war ICBM production rate 萌虎鲸 makes a big statement that made me sit up. He says currently China is building ICBM at a similar speed to cold war peak. In particular he said in recent days there's been a news from a certain factory that produces ICBM casing where they said they are producing these casing at a rate of 8 per week.

8 per week, 400 ICBM per year ?

:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:
 

Kalec

Junior Member
Registered Member
Question regarding these missile base !!

In the even of a US first strike, would all the base housing ICBM be taken out ?

How to deal with this ?
1686055018448.png

8 per week, 400 ICBM per year ?
You do understand that it is an engine factory not an ICBM assembly plant. Each ICBM needs three or four engines and 8 per week could just be a lucky week.
 

Kalec

Junior Member
Registered Member
It looks that there indeed exists a 130 ton class 20 x20 hybrid-powered TEL.

For those wondering where the source is from
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The first chapter mainly said how they developed HTF5680, the TEL for DF-26 in 2004 and the "100t class eight-axle series chassis", obviously for DF-41 and DF-31AG.
为了满足更大吨位装备的大载荷、高机动性、高适应性要求,需要研制 6 轴及以上、承载能力 40 t 及 以上的超重型高机动特种轮式底盘。2004 年,北京航天发射技术研究所开发出 70 t 级六轴底盘 HTF5680(如图 9 所示),作为 HTF 系列的首款底盘,采用了底盘-上装结构一体化设计的创新方案,研制出油气弹簧独立悬架、新型大扭矩高速比断开式驱动桥、组合断面焊接式整体车架、多桥同步转向系统。在此基础上成功开发出 35 t 级三轴系列底盘、45 t 级四轴系列底盘、70t 级六轴系列底盘、100 t 级八轴系列底盘等,并成功应用于多型装备。
In order to meet the large load, high mobility and high adaptability requirements of larger tonnage equipment, it is necessary to develop super heavy-duty, high mobility special wheeled chassis with 6 axles and above and a load capacity of 40 t and above. As the first chassis of the HTF series, it adopts the innovative solution of integrated chassis-upholstery design and develops an oil-pneumatic spring independent suspension, a new type of high-torque, high-speed ratio disconnected drive axle, a combined section welded overall frame, and a multi-axle synchronized steering system. On this basis On this basis, we have successfully developed 35t class three-axle series chassis, 45t class four-axle series chassis and 70t class six-axle series chassis. chassis, 100t class eight-axle series chassis, etc., and successfully applied to many types of equipment.

The second chapter is much more interesting, on the prospect of their future development plan. It says that they developed a 130 ton class 20 x20 hybrid-powered TEL, and have been applied to an unspecified equipment.
21 世纪 00 年代末,瞄准未来车辆技术发展方向和应用需求,以北京航天发射技术研究所为代表的研制单位开展了特种轮式底盘电驱动技术研究。2015 年,北京航天发射技术研究所、中国重汽、湖北三江航天万山特种车辆有限公司各自研发出 70 t 级的 12×10 型混合动力电驱动特种轮式底盘样车。经过几年的发展,北京航天发射技术研究所进展突出,开发出多款混合动力电驱动特种轮式底盘,主要包括:45 t 级四轴系列底盘、60 t 级五轴系列底盘、70 t 级六轴系列底盘、85t级七轴底盘、100 t 级八轴底盘、130 t 级十轴底盘等,并陆续应用于装备。
In the late 2000s, aiming at the future direction of vehicle technology development and application needs, the development unit represented by Beijing Institute of Space Launch Technology carried out research on special wheeled chassis electric drive technology. 2015, Beijing Institute of Space Launch Technology, China National Heavy Duty Truck, Hubei Sanjiang Space Wanshan Special Vehicle Co. wheeled chassis prototype. After several years of development, Beijing Institute of Space Launch Technology has made outstanding progress and developed a variety of hybrid electric drive special wheeled chassis, mainly including: 45 t-class four-axle series chassis, 60 t-class five-axle series chassis, 70 t-class six-axle series chassis, 85 t-class seven-axle chassis, 100 t-class eight-axle chassis, 130 t-class ten-axle chassis, etc., and have been applied to equipment.

1686093249811.png
 

ZeEa5KPul

Colonel
Registered Member
It looks that there indeed exists a 130 ton class 20 x20 hybrid-powered TEL.

For those wondering where the source is from
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
.


The first chapter mainly said how they developed HTF5680, the TEL for DF-26 in 2004 and the "100t class eight-axle series chassis", obviously for DF-41 and DF-31AG.


The second chapter is much more interesting, on the prospect of their future development plan. It says that they developed a 130 ton class 20 x20 hybrid-powered TEL, and have been applied to an unspecified equipment.


View attachment 114025
This is very interesting. We might cautiously infer from this that the DF-45 will not be an exclusively silo-based missile, but might have a road-mobile option as well. One wouldn't go to the trouble of building a new 130 ton hybrid TEL simply to haul the missile to a silo.
 

Kalec

Junior Member
Registered Member
This is very interesting. We might cautiously infer from this that the DF-45 will not be an exclusively silo-based missile, but might have a road-mobile option as well. One wouldn't go to the trouble of building a new 130 ton hybrid TEL simply to haul the missile to a silo.
Actually I don't really think this 130 ton TEL has to do with the rumored "DF-45".

Because iirc the 130 ton actually means that the total weight of TEL and ICBM combined, not the ICBM itself. The weight usually divided into half for example DF-41 is 52 ton ICBM and the 16 x 16 TEL is classified as 100 ton TEL. It would be quite reasonable, at least from my view that this 130 ton vehicle is intended for an ICBM around 65 ton weight.

Consequently this vehicle is probably from an ICBM in Trident D5 class instead of a monster like Peacekeeper. AFAIK it doesn't exist such thing in current inventory or rumors but we shall see how it unfolds.
 

ZeEa5KPul

Colonel
Registered Member
Because iirc the 130 ton actually means that the total weight of TEL and ICBM combined, not the ICBM itself. The weight usually divided into half for example DF-41 is 52 ton ICBM and the 16 x 16 TEL is classified as 100 ton TEL. It would be quite reasonable, at least from my view that this 130 ton vehicle is intended for an ICBM around 65 ton weight.
The DF-41 is 60 tons and the HTF5980A is 40 tons. If the 60:40 split holds for this new TEL, then it's intended for a missile around 78 tons, which coincidentally fits exactly with what I heard from a very reliable source about the DF-45 (a 78 ton, 2.2m diameter missile).

However, this doesn't fit with the silos' diameter. Their diameter has been estimated at around 4.3m, and going by the two-thirds rule (missile diameter to silo diameter), they can hold missiles of diameter around 2.8m. This would be a much larger missile than this new TEL could support.

It could be that we're looking at two new missiles, a 2.2m diameter successor to the DF-41 and a 2.8m silo-based missile.
 

FairAndUnbiased

Brigadier
Registered Member
Question regarding these missile base !!

In the even of a US first strike, would all the base housing ICBM be taken out ?

How to deal with this ?
those are administrative 'bases' not physical ones. just like the US 5th fleet isn't an actual fleet, for instance, just the administrative designation for naval units that fall under the command station at Bahrain.
 
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