China Geopolitical News Thread

[Blackstone]

But you didn't say so, how was I suppose to know? You just posted something irrelevant as to avoid answering my question when the subject is still fresh.

Alright, Equation... I'll answer your quibs, just this time. I hope we don't go round and round. You said:

Reasonable people don't need sensationalism they just need the facts on the report. Sensationalism are for drama queens and gullible readers.

What am I suppose to say about that rhetorical statement? It's just your editorial, and I read it as such.


You then said-

Aren't they Chinese too? How come no or hardly any critical news about the Taiwanese government? Shouldn't they be subjected to the same criticism as well as the PRC government? That's my point.

So what? Your statement had nothing to do with my original posting on CCP policy, and I didn't want to get into the old tired game of moral equivalencies.

 

[Equation]

Alright, Equation... I'll answer your quibs, just this time. I hope we don't go round and round. You said:

What am I suppose to say about that rhetorical statement? It's just your editorial, and I read it as such.


You then said-

So what? Your statement had nothing to do with my original posting on CCP policy, and I didn't want to get into the old tired game of moral equivalencies.

But you always quote about CCP policy but NOT Taiwan policy why is that? That's the key point to my question. You said you don't want to "get into the old tired game of moral equivalencies" but yet you always post an article about the CCP but not Taiwan. Shouldn't Taiwan be subjected to the same standard of criticism as much as the CCP according to your logic? Any reasonable people would see it that way.

 

[Blackstone]

But you always quote about CCP policy but NOT Taiwan policy why is that? That's the key point to my question. You said you don't want to "get into the old tired game of moral equivalencies" but yet you always post an article about the CCP but not Taiwan. Shouldn't Taiwan be subjected to the same standard of criticism as much as the CCP according to your logic? Any reasonable people would see it that way.

Equation mon ami, am I to discuss topics that interest me, or someone else? Nothing stops you from posting subjects that interest you, even if the rest of us don't care about them. I don't limit your choice and frequency of topics, and I ignore messages you post that don't interest me. You could extend the same courtesy, or not.

 

[AssassinsMace]

The exodus of Chinese story is the old propaganda rehashed in light of the recent story of corrupt Chinese who hide in the US. Remember, the Western elite just as much as the communist party has to justify to the people that the system they've established serves the people as to say they should stay in power. The propaganda that Chinese would rather live in the US is about fear the West is losing supremacy in this world. There's a false perception among Americans that China is the biggest economy in the world. That's dangerous to the power elite because it says the Western system doesn't guarantee Western supremacy and the people might want to change the system. That's why you see stories that lie about how Chinese would rather live in the US than China to allay fears of those who believe China is the ahead of the US that the Chinese see the Western system as superior. Wasn't the propaganda that China doesn't allow anyone to be free to travel? How did these people get to the US? How are there any honest rich people in China if according to the West China is built on corruption? Chinese are the largest group of tourists that travel overseas in the world. Do you see all these tourists asking for asylum? Do you see these tourists staying in the Western countries that are suppose to be so much superior and never go back to China? Around 100 million Chinese tourists travel abroad. I bet if just a few of them every year asked for asylum that would make headlines. Yet you see nothing of the sort. The Chinese rich they use for propaganda purposes are criminals by the West's own definition. Don't blame China when they bring their corrupt practices to the loving embrace of the West. Don't you think if they could make an honest buck, they would if they were so ethical to prefer the West in the first place?

 

[broadsword]

The Wall Street Journal has an article on another "Great Chinese Exodus." The article says, "many Chinese are leaving for cleaner air, better schools and more opportunity. But Beijing is keeping its eye on them."

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The article is clearly sensationalizing. Juxtaposing the following line

And Chinese nationals are leaving in vast waves: Last year more than 100 million outbound travelers crossed the frontiers.

only serves to exaggerate the issue when travelers and emigrants are not the same numbers.

I see the problem as China teething pains in growing up. Pollution and corruption are not unique to China and it is good on them they are tackling the problem the best they can. As some people leave, there are new ones to take their place. China is so over-populated the competition is extremely intense. At the turn of the century, I was suprised to learn that business there is more competitive than my country. But people who make their money there are much less tempted to leave the country permanently and physically even if they change their citizenship.

This is a problem all developing countries face. You can see long lines of people queuing outside the US embassy in Manila. People in developed countries also emigrate, although often to countries with blood ties or where their race dominates. And there is the group of people who emigrate for tax-avoidance purpose and retirement.

 

[AssassinsMace]

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A very honest assessment surprisingly coming from the CATO Institute and the National Interest. The mistake Americans make is they think China will blink first. The Chinese are not going to blink especially if they believe the US and/or another country instigated present events. Remember the whole pivot to Asia came about before any of the these present disputes. So it cannot be said it's the reason why for the pivot. They even said the pivot wasn't targeting China. China knows Obama lied from his first year in office during Copenhagen. That's arrogance to know you're lying and you're telling the world a lie while China, the target of the lie, knows the truth. And he did it again revealed by Edward Snowden over cyber espionage. That's pretty arrogant to think China will be able to trust anything Obama says. And Obama's lies have created international tension not seen since the Cold War. If China did such things, guess who would be called a threat to world peace.

The article is clearly sensationalizing. Juxtaposing the following line
only serves to exaggerate the issue when travelers and emigrants are not the same numbers.

I see the problem as China teething pains in growing up. Pollution and corruption are not unique to China and it is good on them they are tackling the problem the best they can. As some people leave, there are new ones to take their place. China is so over-populated the competition is extremely intense. At the turn of the century, I was suprised to learn that business there is more competitive than my country. But people who make their money there are much less tempted to leave the country permanently and physically even if they change their citizenship.

This is a problem all developing countries face. You can see long lines of people queuing outside the US embassy in Manila. People in developed countries also emigrate, although often to countries with blood ties or where their race dominates. And there is the group of people who emigrate for tax-avoidance purpose and retirement.

Don't forget the rich from the West changing citizenship at "alarming numbers" for them to be attacked by the media. How about Steve Wynn who threatens to move his headquarters to Macau because Obama makes it hostile for American companies?

 

[solarz]

The Wall Street Journal has an article on another "Great Chinese Exodus." The article says, "many Chinese are leaving for cleaner air, better schools and more opportunity. But Beijing is keeping its eye on them." It highlights the many perils of rapid development and uneven distribution of opportunity, wealth, and power. Communist Party of China's achievement in pulling about 500 million people out of abject poverty, and creating around 200 million 'middle-class' consumers is without parallel in human history, but bad often comes with the good, and the WSJ highlights some of them. I suspect things will get worse before they get better.

My wife came to Canada for post-graduate studies. Out of a dozen classmates and friends, only 2 others opted to remain in Canada, and all three of them, including my wife, chose to remain because they met someone and got married. In fact, my wife is often saying to me how she wouldn't have stayed in Canada if it weren't for me.

So you can choose to believe what you want, but the reality on the ground is quite different from what that article attempts to portray.

It's funny because when she gets together with her friends from Philippines, Taiwan, and Ukraine, they all say they love Canada more than their home country, and she's the only one who differs. LOL

 

[SamuraiBlue]

Just injecting my two cents, there should be statistical numbers to show the present status. Figures do not lie so it'S just a matter of how many Chinese are coming on a long stay compared to how many are applying for citizenship obtaining the breakdown in percentage and then compare it with other nations.

Without that it's just a matter of conjecture without any objectivity.

 

[Blackstone]

I see the problem as China teething pains in growing up. Pollution and corruption are not unique to China and it is good on them they are tackling the problem the best they can. As some people leave, there are new ones to take their place. China is so over-populated the competition is extremely intense. At the turn of the century, I was suprised to learn that business there is more competitive than my country. But people who make their money there are much less tempted to leave the country permanently and physically even if they change their citizenship.

Pollution, brand safety, and corruption are not unique to China, but they reduce quality of life to the very people that gained some success and are looking for better life qualities. Exodus out of China is a reflection of those with means looking for better places to live, for a variety of reasons.

This is a problem all developing countries face. You can see long lines of people queuing outside the US embassy in Manila. People in developed countries also emigrate, although often to countries with blood ties or where their race dominates. And there is the group of people who emigrate for tax-avoidance purpose and retirement.

That's right, and China is still a developing country, with all the ills developing countries face. Since it's not a place of choice for many Chinese citizens, they vote with their feet and leave for greener pastures. Solutions will take a long time, and unlike the unwashed masses, those with means could choose to leave. And they do.

 

[Blackstone]

My wife came to Canada for post-graduate studies. Out of a dozen classmates and friends, only 2 others opted to remain in Canada, and all three of them, including my wife, chose to remain because they met someone and got married. In fact, my wife is often saying to me how she wouldn't have stayed in Canada if it weren't for me.

So you can choose to believe what you want, but the reality on the ground is quite different from what that article attempts to portray.

It's funny because when she gets together with her friends from Philippines, Taiwan, and Ukraine, they all say they love Canada more than their home country, and she's the only one who differs. LOL

I don't discount your experience, but your group is too small for valid statistical analysis. Wall Street Journal said many millions left China for other places, and it's reasonable to believe many more would immigrate to US, Europe, Australia, Canada..., etc. if they have the means to to do so.