Chengdu next gen combat aircraft (?J-36) thread

[reservior dogs]

The game plan for US has to be to stay at distance and let China attack, especially make them waste resources and war weariness on the 2IC while US itself attrits China in the mid Pacific.

B-21 + F-35 combo will work well with friendly seas beneath, and China can't air defense it's advance forces anywhere near as well as the mainland and Taiwan.

I looked what scenarios will lead to war. Taiwan and maybe Philippines is certainly one. Cutting off oil from the Middle East is another. There is absolutely no reason for the Chinese to fight a war in the middle of the Pacific. The U. S., if we want to choke off the commercial traffic to and from America, just have to issue an edict. The Chinese will not fight a war to force the U.S. to take their shipments. By definition, any commercial traffic across the Pacific is agreed to by both sides, even in a war. In a war, the Chinese will go as far as Guam, but will only intermittently, strategically bomb assets in Hawaii and Australia. Before the J-36, there was at least theoretically possible for the U.S. to stop the oil flow from the Middle East, though in practice such an undertaking will be very expensive and the Chinese still have ways to counter such a move. With the J-36, I just don't see how even this is an option.

 

[AndrewS]

> If they had made B-21 as US version F-36, it might have flown before China's, and would have been a game changer the way US hoped B-21 would be.

That's not the role of the B-21. The B-21 is a supporting asset. The B-21 and the NGAD are more or less completely seperate, even though the B-21 is expected to work in tandem with the PCA fighter component of NGAD and the Navy NGAD (F/A-XX).

I highly doubt the US doctrine sees the Raider go over mainland China and dropping dumb bombs. Rather it will be the launch platform for whatever system comes out of the USAFs efforts to field a hypersonic ALCM. Which gives it significant stand off range and doesn't make it necessary to leave the friendly AD umbrella provided by naval assets and aviation.

I also don't really know how the J-36 would engage a B-21 which is stealthy and puts heavy emphasis on electronic countermeasures. Unless there is a super missile that negates stealth somehow.

The concept of hunting B-2s, B-21s or H-20s down like that just because the aircraft that's being vectored in has speed and AAMs isn't really realistic at this point. Especially when the next generation of figters like the J-36 and NGAD will mostly rely on CCAs to do the frontline fighting.

If the J-36 is built in sufficient numbers, then you're looking at Chinese air superiority to Guam some 3000km away.
Any friendly AD umbrella would be beyond this distance

What air-launched hypersonic missiles do you propose the B-21 to use?
Before it was cancelled, the ARRW was estimated at $15 Mn each with a range of 1600km.

 

[taxiya]

A better example of the US failure in system design was how the EMALS components couldn't be electrically isolated from each other.

It's like building a house without a fusebox and circuit breakers.
So you can't isolate each circuit and their components.

This is really, really basic stuff in electrical system design

It is a more complicated subject which we should leave out of this thread. In short "lack of isolation issue" is an inherent problem from AC archetecture. Isolating section of equal power ratings is not as easy and simple as fusebox in a house whose power level is ignorable to the grid. So EMALS "lacking" isn't really a failure of itself but rather a consequence.

 

[Mearex]

I believe J-36 likely has 3D TVC capability.

praying that this is the case, but unfortunately from what we've seen, the nozzles don't seem to have yaw TVC. Unless they are using some new TVC method that doesn't involve moving the nozzles. I think it's called 射流矢量 or something

 

[Jilternj]

Well, DF-17 is range limited and DF-27s are in stock in limited numbers. And they will be facing strong counter measures from adversary to cause them to miss target. Hitting moving ships with strong counter measures while traveling at mach10 isn't easy.

Having J-36 and H-20 + CCAs around will make things significantly more difficult for defensive force. Since you are dealing with better targeting (provided by your high end platforms that are not too far away), more EW pressure on defense, additional type of missiles and directions where defense will have to figure out how to defend. Variety, directions and breadth of attack make a huge difference in hit probability.

That's why I expect J-36 to be testing for a while. Being able to severely disrupt adversarial naval radar system is a huge difference maker.

There is some discussion and calculation of DF17 and DF27's production capability , based on open market information on the materials and factory, it is really easy to achieve 100k DF17 per year production without any mobilization. It is curious to compare the cost effectiveness between produce 100 J36 only to do air strike on 1IC or 2IC.

 

[Mearex]

So it's like this. Chinese people can say this thing isn't gonna win any beauty contests. That's what I thought when I first saw it. But we can say it cus it's ours. But it's offensive when other people say it. Just like how one can joke with others about how his own wife has been putting on a few pounds and how he could whisk her up the stairs effortlessly when they first met but can barely piggy-back her on flat ground anymore... but if another man starts making fat jokes at this man's wife, it is likely to become a very hostile exchange.

I'm (former) chinese too and let's be real here it's ugly AF from the side and it doesn't matter who says so. They could have given the dorsal intake a different shape to not have a round bump, or just not use a dorsal intake at all. The j50 on the other hand makes my eyes drool, and if CAC and SAC really are competing I hope Shenyang wins lmao

 

[tphuang]

I deleted a few posts for off topic. Let's try to mention J-36 in our posts here please.

 

[pokepara]

I'm (former) chinese too and let's be real here it's ugly AF from the side and it doesn't matter who says so. They could have given the dorsal intake a different shape to not have a round bump, or just not use a dorsal intake at all. The j50 on the other hand makes my eyes drool, and if CAC and SAC really are competing I hope Shenyang wins lmao

The hump kinda looks like the back of some of the older 911 Porsches to me. Personally, I like it!

 

[cryptum]

大多数人都没有意识到存在一种并不昂贵的情况。如果美国和中国之间爆发战争，那么中国方面是一个大陆规模的国家，拥有大量可部署的空中、出发和海军资产。而美国方面，在核武器澳大利亚或夏威夷之前，我们只有少量空军基地和一些岛屿。我们还有一批且非常脆弱的水面舰队。一旦战争爆发，日本、韩国、防疫和关岛的所有机场都可能被摧毁。所有的水面舰队都可能被摧毁。只有当美国拥有世代优势和非常大的数量优势时，这种不方便改变

未来如果开战，即使空中加油让B-21能够轰炸中国装备，在西太平洋，B-21也必须在没有其他装备支持的下飞行。我们的清醒情况可以在这样的环境中知道生存，但我不知道我们即将如何支持 B-21。

 

[Blitzo]

ain't no way
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Can you chill out with the memeposting a bit in the flagship military threads please.

I agree.

Posting a one liner of "I agree" is unnecessary. The react button to write a "like" is fine.