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nameless

Junior Member
bladerunner said:
THat doesnt mean they didn't have time to take it out on the Chinese on the way home or in the ensuing minutes and hours hours
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So then these "peaceful protestors" just suddenly started to murder innocent civilians including children? That is not something sane human being do, certainly not for people who calls themselves "peaceful protestors" right?

What is there to twist, Im simply going with the statement that the police fired first which resulted in the riots and killings.
Its simply a case of shoot and we'll fudge the issue later by blaming Kadeer
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You can choose to believe those murders, but that only shows your ignorance.

Reasons for the riots aside, The riots were handled completely differently by the respective police forces. While the Chinese decided to go in heavy and try to nip in the bud, the British police went for a policy of containment and hoping the riots would burn itself out.
The British police in an enviroment of PC correctness and newspapermen and cameras just a few yards away were careful not to resort to thuggish means which would have all the newspapers screaming about Police brutality, while the Chinese police had no such qualms, given most likely there would have only been poor quality cell phone cameras if anything.
If they do get filmed shooting somebody they would probably react in the sameway they did with the Tibetean refugees that were shot at. BLUSTER. Remember the girl that got filmed shot in the back while fleeing?

With that type of record , its pretty hard to give the Chinese police or security any credibility with their excuses.
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Funny you say that when one considers British history of imperialism, colonialism, murdering natives that continues to this day with current wars. Not to mention that the riot was started by the questionable shooting death of a civilian. Nothing new here remember the Iraq whistle blower Dr Kelly that "committed suicide"? And There were plenty of video and pictures of the Xinjiang incident and eye witness accounts from foreigners of what really happened but that is not what you are interested in.
 
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LesAdieux

Junior Member
US Military loses contact with hypersonic test plane

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - An unmanned experimental aircraft designed to glide down from the upper atmosphere at 20 times the speed of sound lost contact with ground control on its second test flight on Thursday, a Pentagon agency said.

The Falcon HTV-2 was launched from Vandenberg Air Force Base in California on a rocket and successfully separated from the launch vehicle, the Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency said.

The arrowhead-shaped plane was expected to separate from the rocket near the peak of its ascent and glide back to earth, reaching hypersonic speed before rolling and plunging into the Pacific ocean, according to a test diagram posted online.

About 10 minutes after the flight began, DARPA tweeted that the mission was "on track, entering glide phase." But about 26 minutes later, DARPA tweeted that its monitoring stations had lost contact with the glider.

"Downrange assets did not reacquire tracking or telemetry," DARPA tweeted about an hour later. "HTV-2 has an autonomous flight termination capacity."

The loss of communications in the final stages of the test flight was a failure for the agency. During the initial flight test in April, researchers lost contact with the vehicle about nine minutes into the flight.

The Falcon HTV-2 glider is part of the Defense Department's effort to build what it calls a "prompt global strike" capability that would enable it to hit targets worldwide within an hour with conventional or nuclear warheads.

in other news, China put a Pakistani communication satellite into space early this morning.
 
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bladerunner

bladerunner

Banned Idiot
nameless said:
So then these "peaceful protestors" just suddenly started to murder innocent civilians including children? That is not something sane human being do, certainly not for people who calls themselves "peaceful protestors"
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They a built up hatred for the Chinese could do it. Besides the killings took place after they were shot at.
The police fired warning shots which were ignored as the protesting crowd continued to move forward, tearing down barricades on the way it was then that the police shot to kill.

You can choose to believe those murders, but that only shows your ignorance.
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. Im basing mine on what I remember the then Govenor of Xinjiang was reported to have said.





Funny you say that when one considers British history of imperialism, colonialism, murdering natives that continues to this day with current wars. Not to mention that the riot was started by the questionable shooting death of a civilian.
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Sigh The person in question had drawn a gun. Would you wait and let him shoot you first?
 
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plawolf

plawolf

Lieutenant General
bladerunner said:
How about applying a little logic yourself?

THat doesnt mean they didn't have time to take it out on the Chinese on the way home or in the ensuing minutes and hours.
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Well another fact you conveniently ignored is how a great many of the dead and wounded were attacked with knives, clubs and a whole range of weapons.

So either those 'peaceful protestors' were not so peaceful to start with and were armed for murder. Or they went home after being seeing people shot by police and came out again with weapons. But explain how that would work exactly.

You just seen police shoot unarmed people in the streets and you go out with a weapon? Yeah, real believable.

What is there to twist, Im simply going with the statement that the police fired first which resulted in the riots and killings.
Its simply a case of shoot and we'll fudge the issue later by blaming Kadeer
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Where did they say police fired first? They just said police opened fire.

I dont have an issue if the police feel there is the necessity to shoot. However in this case the uighurs claim the shooting inspired the riots which lead to the killing spree
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In which case have they NOT claimed the police shot first? Have there, in recorded history, ever been a case of violence breaking out in Xinjiang that those some Uighurs' whose word you quoting as the truth not pinned the blame entirely on the Chinese police? :rolleyes:

And you are also utterly failing to present any half-way believable account of how a peaceful demonstration could suddenly magic knives, axes, iron bars and a whole arsenal of weapons out of thin air and decide to attack innocent people after they just been shot at by police instead of running home and hiding like any rational human being.


Reasons for the riots aside, The riots were handled completely differently by the respective police forces. While the Chinese decided to go in heavy and try to nip in the bud, the British police went for a policy of containment and hoping the riots would burn itself out. (sadly neither worked)

The British police in an enviroment of PC correctness and newspapermen and cameras just a few yards away were careful not to resort to thuggish means which would have all the newspapers screaming about Police brutality,(much to the disapointment of many members here) while the Chinese police had no such qualms, given most likely there would have only been poor quality cell phone cameras if anything.
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Yet the British PM has gone on the record criticizing the way the British police handled the situation.

And you are still completely ignoring the central point that the police tactics and response will vary massively depending on the situation.

The police might stand by and let the riots loot shops, but if those rioters were armed with deadly weapons and committing murder on the streets as they were doing in Xinjiang, do you think for a second the police would have just stood back and 'let the riot burn itself out'? :rolleyes:

No, armed police would have move in in force, and anyone who was wielding a weapon who refused to yield after warning shots have been fired would have been put down. Exactly like what the Chinese statement described what their police did.

If they do get filmed shooting somebody they would probably react in the sameway they did with the Tibetean refugees that were shot at. BLUSTER. Remember the girl that got filmed shot in the back while fleeing?

With that type of record , its pretty hard to give the Chinese police or security any credibility with their excuses.
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What is the point in bring this utterly unconnected event up? One can dredge up all sorts of examples of past police brutality or excesses on the part of any police force in the world.

To be honest, I had expected better than such a transparent attempt at smearing from you, but then I tend to expect too much of people.
 
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bladerunner

bladerunner

Banned Idiot
plawolf said:
In which case have they NOT claimed the police shot first? Have there, in recorded history, ever been a case of violence breaking out in Xinjiang that those some Uighurs' whose word you quoting as the truth not pinned the blame entirely on the Chinese police? :rolleyes:
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Your'e forgetting that Xinjiang is a region that had frequent tourists, many of them also journey up to Urumqi, so its not unimaginable that there were a few there at the time and who then went on to describe what they saw.

And you are also utterly failing to present any half-way believable account of how a peaceful demonstration could suddenly magic knives, axes, iron bars and a whole arsenal of weapons out of thin air and decide to attack innocent people after they just been shot at by police instead of running home and hiding like any rational human being.
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Apparently there were a few thousand participants , so even if they were fifty plus wide, the demonstration would have stretched back several hundred meters. , around corners out of harms way when the shooting first started so apart from the poles and what not used to support placards/banners there would have been plenty of time to grab anything from the nearby buildings. Unless Im mistaken I vaguely remember reading on a forum (could be this one) that Uighurs as per their nomadic culture, were allowed to carry knives.


You are also forgetting this riot also lasted a few days, plenty of time for enraged uighurs who have seen their friends wounded, work up enough rage to go on revenge spree. Besides if the most recent behaviour by the uighurs are anything to go buy ( remember their attack a couple or so weeks ago), they don't behave rationally. Chinas fortunate that havent reached that suicide bombing stuff on a regular basis yet)



What is the point in bring this utterly unconnected event up? One can dredge up all sorts of examples of past police brutality or excesses on the part of any police force in the world.
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Merely illustrating what one thinks they might get away with if they dont believe theyre being watched. Yes the Western enforcement agencies as well

To be honest, I had expected better than such a transparent attempt at smearing from you, but then I tend to expect too much of people.[/QUOTE
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I guess one should not engage in tit for tat exchanges but theres been a fair bit of smearing all round.and im ensuring thatThe Uighurs are not getting the short shift. Glad to yo read that you were'nt disinclined towards Chinas minority people. However I don't think all Chinese share that view as evidence by the way they treated the Uighurs in that Toy factory in Southern China.

IMO this topic went askew aways back with many members displaying shades of Schadenfreude.
Its a pity because it ruined a good opportunity on how to handle riots. As I said earlier the British lost it with their PC Correctness. The Chinese were unprepared for such an explosion of violence. The Chinese were in a state of denial over relations between the two peoples in Xinjiang otherwise they could have had more sophisticated riot control gear or water cannons handy. But I suppose that would have contradicted the image they are trying to portray.
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Blitzo

Blitzo

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Registered Member
bladerunner said:
IMO this topic went askew aways back with many members displaying shades of Schadenfreude.Its a pity because it ruined a good opportunity on how to handle riots
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No one here is enjoying the fact that innocent people, their livelihoods and properties are being ransacked and set ablaze. But the parallels with these riots and how the west in general responded to similar riots in china is interesting, if not ironic.
I do admit I have a grim satisfaction that the shoe is on the other foot now, for a moment. But that's mostly because it's showing some hypocrisy on the british/western part -- not because this is simply a "bad look" for the country, that property is being desecrated and certainly not because I'm a malicious b*st*rd. It's the biased way the media is responding to these incidents compared with riots in china and other countries which makes me gnash my teeth. I suppose the "gloating" on my part is how blatant and obvious this bias is prevalent to everyone now.
If Britain, and more importantly, the west hasn't been such... annoyances (I use for the lack of other words) in the past in similar situations with china then I'd have no reason to tsk at the current riots in britain.

Besides, if these riots were happening in major cities around china you can bet the west will be gloating far more heavily. We can play the blame game all we want but I speak for myself, that I would be less cynical about the current situation in britain if they and other western countries (and especially their media) were not so... "annoying" in similar situations in past few years. Also, there's the whole call for "jasmine revolution" and massively heaviy reporting on it and the implications how an uprising in china seemed imminent (every other week a story insinuating that comes out)... #karma?

I hope post this isn't too inflammatory (I think everyone's been quite civil so far), but I simply cannot agree to bladerunner's statement that people are simply "gloating" at britain's misfortune with the rioters. It's hardly that simple.
Maybe a mod should make a new thread about riots and social disturbances around the world?
 
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zoom

zoom

Junior Member
bladerunner said:
Sigh The person in question had drawn a gun. Would you wait and let him shoot you first?
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We don't know that. All we know is there is a non-police issue gun that the police have apparently recovered from the scene.That's all the detail we have until the investigation concludes.
 
A

airsuperiority

Captain
Bltizo said:
No one here is enjoying the fact that innocent people, their livelihoods and properties are being ransacked and set ablaze. But the parallels with these riots and how the west in general responded to similar riots in china is interesting, if not ironic.
I do admit I have a grim satisfaction that the shoe is on the other foot now, for a moment. But that's mostly because it's showing some hypocrisy on the british/western part -- not because this is simply a "bad look" for the country and certainly not because I'm a malicious b*st*rd. It's the biased way the media is responding to these incidents compared with riots in china and other countries which makes me gnash my teeth. I suppose the "gloating" on my part is how blatant and obvious this bias is prevalent to everyone now.
If Britain, and more importantly, the west hasn't been such... annoyances (I use for the lack of other words) in the past in similar situations with china then I'd have no reason to tsk at the current riots in britain.

Besides, if these riots were happening in major cities around china you can bet the west will be gloating far more heavily. We can play the blame game all we want but I speak for myself, that I would be less cynical about the current situation in britain if they and other western countries (and especially their media) were not so... "annoying" in similar situations in past few years. Also, there's the whole call for "jasmine revolution" and massively heaviy reporting on it and the implications how an uprising in china seemed imminent (every other week a story insinuating that comes out)... #karma?

I hope post this isn't too inflammatory (I think everyone's been quite civil so far), but I simply cannot agree to bladerunner's statement that people are simply "gloating" at britain's misfortune with the rioters. It's hardly that simple.
Maybe a mod should make a new thread about riots and social disturbances around the world?
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You've spoken my mind once again. Many of us don't hate the British people; this time we're going against the pr**kish media and enjoying that satisfying feeling of their media getting a taste of their own medicine. After all these years of bias reporting, taunting others, hate spreading, misinformation, misinterpretation, badmouthing, cursing others for instability, flamebaiting, framing others of undeserved crimes, lying to their readers, brainwashing countless minds, and stepping on other's sorrow, karma came for them. There's a reason why China Daily jumped at this opportunity and poked at the British when they are down. When the West is being so nasty and disrespectful, sometimes playing the nice game just doesn't cut it. For situations like these, it is absolutely the perfect chance to step on them as hard as possible while knowing there are no consequences. What are they going to do? Complain? If so, we'll just tell them that we're just reading off sentences written from articles their tabloid wrote.
 
A

airsuperiority

Captain
bladerunner said:
JUst making sure thatThe Uighurs are getting the short shift. My congratulations to you upon reading that you werent disinclined towards Chinas minority people. However I don't think all Chinese share that view as evidence by the way they treated the Uighurs in that Toy factory in Southern China.

.
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You used a small incident to generalize and predict a 1.3 billion population AGAIN?! oh boy...
 
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