Aircraft Carriers III

FORBIN

Lieutenant General
Registered Member
It is not cheaper a CV ...

NAe São Paulo: abandoned modernization, advanced replacement

Marinha da Brasil announced in a communiqué that the modernization of the NAe São Paulo (2000-2020) is abandoned. The replacement of the Brazilian aircraft carrier, former Foch (July 15, 1963 - November 15, 2000) in the Navy, is advanced and becomes the third priority in Brazilian naval investments.

The new redesign project will eventually be right for the Brazilian aircraft carrier. The former Foch left the Navy after much savings on maintenance and large fairings because in the initial programming of the French Navy this aircraft carrier had to be "quickly" replaced by R92 Richelieu from the mid-1990s Brazil buys this ship for 12 million euros in 2000 with a large number of works to be carried out.

The first overhaul between 2005 and 2010 is not sufficient to restore a satisfactory operational potential for the vessel. The main difficulty is propulsion, which, in addition to the fact that it is old, had virtually no stock left after the withdrawals and deconstruction of the Clemenceau (22 November 1961 - 1 October 1997), Jeanne d ' Arc (July 16, 1964 - June 7, 2010) and Colbert (May 5, 1959 - May 24, 1991). Damage to the boat follows and Brazilian naval pilots must even train in the United States to maintain their skills.

This is why an ambitious overhaul was mainly aimed at replacing propulsion and a number of other equipment in order to guarantee an active service until 2040. The expenditure would have amounted to no less than 500 million euros . The weapon system is fully modernized or even simply replaced, just like the propulsion that would be completely landed in favor of an electric propulsion, perhaps even by pods. On-board aviation was to receive modernized aircraft at the end of 2017.

On February 14, 2017 the Brazilian navy announces by a communiqué a great turnaround: the overhaul is abandoned. "Almirantado concluiu que o Programa de Modernização exigiria alto investimento financeiro, conteria incertezas técnicas e necessitaria de um longo período de conclusão e decidiu pela desmobilização do meio, a ser seriento ao longo dos próximos três anos." The Marinha da Brasil welcomes the operational interest realized by the purchase of the former Foch for the maintenance of Brazilian skills following the withdrawal of the Minas Gerais (1956-2001). Even the Argentinean aviation embarked could come to train on board.

Finally, the solution of disarmament seems wiser to the Brazilian Admiralty which maintains and even advances the objective of replacement of Sao Paulo by a new unit. "Um programa de The implementation of these two programs refers to the question of the new Brazilian aircraft carrier in the period 2025-2030.

In the meantime, it will be especially the first nuclear-powered submarine that will bring the decisive nuclear advantage against Argentina which does not disarm its ambition to equalize the Brazilian naval power even in this case.

In parentheses, the Sea Gripen, navalization of the Swedish fighter, loses a significant opportunity to credibilize its existence in Brazil before claiming anything in other navies. The Indian market could suddenly move strongly, if not definitively.

The date when France could have re-launched studies for a new aircraft carrier to replace Charles de Gaulle (2001 - 2041) in order to maintain competence in nuclear naval propulsion. India would have to assert its competence in this matter depending on the degree of involvement of foreign manufacturers in IAC-2 or INS Vishaal but should not be placed on hold until after 2030 or even 2035. United Kingdom and Italy would have new arguments to argue just as, and perhaps, Russia, even Japan and South Korea

But the biggest novelty would be a Chinese proposal whose assembly line of aircraft carriers turns quite well and could find the material to propose a new boat, or even to place its first two aircraft carriers STOBAR, Liaoning and Type 001 , Destined for marine clients so as, in the years 2020 - 2030, to count only units CATOBAR. This would relate a not so important naval budget.

Hervé Coutau-Bégarie (The problem of the aircraft carrier, Paris, Economica, 1990, 191 pages) is not within the reach of all navies. It is easy to lose the rank, it is difficult to afford a new unit, while all the remaining naval forces rested essentially on the transfer of aircraft carriers from the Royal Navy. The purchase of a new unit, according to its characteristics, would require no less than 2 to 3 billion euros.

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São-Paulo.jpg
 

bd popeye

The Last Jedi
VIP Professional
The first overhaul between 2005 and 2010 is not sufficient to restore a satisfactory operational potential for the vessel.

Five years in the shipyard and not enough was accomplished to get the ship in a condition where it could operate as an aircraft carrier should? Wow.. as an example a RCOH for a Nimitz class takes four years.

In parentheses, the Sea Gripen, navalization of the Swedish fighter, loses a significant opportunity to credibilize its existence in Brazil before claiming anything in other navies. The Indian market could suddenly move strongly, if not definitively.

The Sea Gripen has never spent one single minute at sea. A truly unproven platform. Sea duty is very hard on Naval aircraft.

So what shall become of NAe São Paulo? Will she be scrapped?
 

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
It is not cheaper a CV ...

NAe São Paulo: abandoned modernization, advanced replacement

Marinha da Brasil announced in a communiqué that the modernization of the NAe São Paulo (2000-2020) is abandoned. The replacement of the Brazilian aircraft carrier, former Foch (July 15, 1963 - November 15, 2000) in the Navy, is advanced and becomes the third priority in Brazilian naval investments.

The new redesign project will eventually be right for the Brazilian aircraft carrier. The former Foch left the Navy after much savings on maintenance and large fairings because in the initial programming of the French Navy this aircraft carrier had to be "quickly" replaced by R92 Richelieu from the mid-1990s Brazil buys this ship for 12 million euros in 2000 with a large number of works to be carried out.

The first overhaul between 2005 and 2010 is not sufficient to restore a satisfactory operational potential for the vessel. The main difficulty is propulsion, which, in addition to the fact that it is old, had virtually no stock left after the withdrawals and deconstruction of the Clemenceau (22 November 1961 - 1 October 1997), Jeanne d ' Arc (July 16, 1964 - June 7, 2010) and Colbert (May 5, 1959 - May 24, 1991). Damage to the boat follows and Brazilian naval pilots must even train in the United States to maintain their skills.

This is why an ambitious overhaul was mainly aimed at replacing propulsion and a number of other equipment in order to guarantee an active service until 2040. The expenditure would have amounted to no less than 500 million euros . The weapon system is fully modernized or even simply replaced, just like the propulsion that would be completely landed in favor of an electric propulsion, perhaps even by pods. On-board aviation was to receive modernized aircraft at the end of 2017.

On February 14, 2017 the Brazilian navy announces by a communiqué a great turnaround: the overhaul is abandoned. "Almirantado concluiu que o Programa de Modernização exigiria alto investimento financeiro, conteria incertezas técnicas e necessitaria de um longo período de conclusão e decidiu pela desmobilização do meio, a ser seriento ao longo dos próximos três anos." The Marinha da Brasil welcomes the operational interest realized by the purchase of the former Foch for the maintenance of Brazilian skills following the withdrawal of the Minas Gerais (1956-2001). Even the Argentinean aviation embarked could come to train on board.

Finally, the solution of disarmament seems wiser to the Brazilian Admiralty which maintains and even advances the objective of replacement of Sao Paulo by a new unit. "Um programa de The implementation of these two programs refers to the question of the new Brazilian aircraft carrier in the period 2025-2030.

In the meantime, it will be especially the first nuclear-powered submarine that will bring the decisive nuclear advantage against Argentina which does not disarm its ambition to equalize the Brazilian naval power even in this case.

In parentheses, the Sea Gripen, navalization of the Swedish fighter, loses a significant opportunity to credibilize its existence in Brazil before claiming anything in other navies. The Indian market could suddenly move strongly, if not definitively.

The date when France could have re-launched studies for a new aircraft carrier to replace Charles de Gaulle (2001 - 2041) in order to maintain competence in nuclear naval propulsion. India would have to assert its competence in this matter depending on the degree of involvement of foreign manufacturers in IAC-2 or INS Vishaal but should not be placed on hold until after 2030 or even 2035. United Kingdom and Italy would have new arguments to argue just as, and perhaps, Russia, even Japan and South Korea

But the biggest novelty would be a Chinese proposal whose assembly line of aircraft carriers turns quite well and could find the material to propose a new boat, or even to place its first two aircraft carriers STOBAR, Liaoning and Type 001 , Destined for marine clients so as, in the years 2020 - 2030, to count only units CATOBAR. This would relate a not so important naval budget.

Hervé Coutau-Bégarie (The problem of the aircraft carrier, Paris, Economica, 1990, 191 pages) is not within the reach of all navies. It is easy to lose the rank, it is difficult to afford a new unit, while all the remaining naval forces rested essentially on the transfer of aircraft carriers from the Royal Navy. The purchase of a new unit, according to its characteristics, would require no less than 2 to 3 billion euros.

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View attachment 36404
Too bad.

The carrier is certaianly capable of being overhauled. The Brazilians just do not want to spend the money for it.

I believe the Sea Gripen will be a good aircraft...but they will have to spend a good deal of money to get that aircraft developed.

Perhaps they will build a new carrier.

but their initiaal plans called for upgrading the A-4s to a more modern standard with radar A2A missiles, with Trakcer AEW aircraft upgrades, and with tankers. Even without the Sea Gripen that would have been a nice thing for the Sao Pauol.

Now they will scrap it and have no carrier until the build a new one.

...somehow I am beginning to believe the Brazilians do not have the economy or stomach for what it will take to even get one carrier operational.
 

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
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160611-N-ZE240-178.jpg

US Naval Institute said:
ug boats maneuver the aircraft carrier Pre-Commissioning Unit Gerald R. Ford (CVN 78) into the James River during the ship’s turn ship evolution June 11, 2016. US Navy Photo

This post has been updated to correct the title of Ye-Ling Wang, who now serves as program manager for future aircraft carriers. A previous version of this post referred to her as deputy program manager, which is her previous title.

Aircraft carrier Gerald R. Ford (CVN-78) will head to sea for builders trials next month, a next step leading up to its commissioning later this year.

The ship is currently participating in a series of certifications – part of the critical path testing that ensures the ship is in good material condition to go to sea and the crew is proficient enough to safely operate the carrier, Ye-Ling Wang, program manager for future aircraft carriers at the Program Executive Office for Aircraft Carriers (PMS 378), said today at the American Society for Naval Engineers’ Technologies, Systems and Ships event.

As part of this “safe to sail” event, she said navigation certification activities are currently taking place, as well as an overall crew certification effort run by the type commander.

Before the ship can go to sea for builders trials, the crew and the ship will go through certifications on navigation, communications, ship handling, habitability, propulsion plant, damage control and more. Those involved will also be looking ahead for any possible hazards during the planned builders trials and, if any exist, find ways now to mitigate those potential problems.

Builders trials are hosted by the contractor to demonstrate the ship’s quality and ability to perform at sea. Wang told USNI News that Ford would not launch or recover any airplanes during this test, but rather just demonstrate the ship’s more basic functions.

Acceptance trials would be the next step, when a government team of evaluators would ensure the ship and crew are ready to join the fleet. PEO Carriers officials told USNI News that a commissioning date has not yet been scheduled and is currently slated for “later this year.”

I am really looking forward to seeing this carrier go out to sea!
 

FORBIN

Lieutenant General
Registered Member
Too bad.

The carrier is certaianly capable of being overhauled. The Brazilians just do not want to spend the money for it.

I believe the Sea Gripen will be a good aircraft...but they will have to spend a good deal of money to get that aircraft developed.

Perhaps they will build a new carrier.

but their initiaal plans called for upgrading the A-4s to a more modern standard with radar A2A missiles, with Trakcer AEW aircraft upgrades, and with tankers. Even without the Sea Gripen that would have been a nice thing for the Sao Pauol.

Now they will scrap it and have no carrier until the build a new one.

...somehow I am beginning to believe the Brazilians do not have the economy or stomach for what it will take to even get one carrier operational.
I have read she have also cats problems so much problems...
 

Miragedriver

Brigadier
Back a few years ago Brazil economy was booming they visited DCNS and wanted not only a carrier but also SSN fleet like the RAN deal

But as the economy slipped they became less ambitious and now these items are not only on hold but scrapped

I think Brazil lost enthusiasm due to finances

That is exactly the case......
 

FORBIN

Lieutenant General
Registered Member
Carrier air wing of the 2020s with mix of F-35C and F/A-18E/F

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USN Planned CVW.jpg

I have udapted mainly for helos :
HSC have 8 MH-60S deployed in general 7
HSM have 11 MH-60R " " 8 whose in average 6 on CG/DDGs to consider also Burke Fl I 28 / 62 don' t have hangar for helos
And removed SV-22B.

Author’s Note: Part II will discuss the CVW's power projection capabilities against the PRC.
Waiting :p:p:p

US Navy CAW 1990-2010-2025.jpg
 
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