Aircraft Carriers III

FORBIN said:

The budget is signed wrong infos in december 532 bill base + 3 bill with last
Unfunded requests always in march, april.

Your always anxious pessimistic relax dude obviously Congress help he have always do at less the minimum necessary i have see 3 - 4 years ago USN have 8 - 9 CVNs in 2020 the true 11...

Look good things which worck they have not always problems ...

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Our military is in a real mess thanks to the Sequester in addition to Obama's budget cuts, we've operated on a shoe string for the last 8 years. Obama inheriting Bush's budget for DOD, immediately began "taking apart" the very expensive funding process for the US military and basically "shutting their water off"! So these Admirals/Generals are now free under President Trump and with his blessing, offering a warning for lawmakers and the general public!

No matter how much "money, we throw at this problem" in "supplementals", it does NOT meet basic funding levels in peace time, much less in a time when we are at war with Terrorists though-out the world, particularly in the Middle East, the US military as Master Jura continues to warn are up "Krap Kreeck!"

Eliminating the individual/employer mandate under Obamacare, will free up Federal Govt money's that Obama had "tied up" as part of his "social engineering", take from the middle class, and give to Obama voters. Restoring business to a level playing field, instead of forcing them to pay every workers very expensive healthcare,,,, literally a thousand or so per month, in addition to paying them a living wage. Many American workers lost their jobs, (I did), and their health insurance, (I did).

So these articles are not just "whining" by the Admirals/Generals to get a bigger slice of pie, they are "existential" alarms that would have been going off for the past 7 years, had Obama not "gagged" any criticism from DOD, over funding or lack of readiness. Those who spoke out were "burned", some lost their jobs, others were forced out later? so Master Jura, whom I often love to argue with, is spot on in his financial concern! it is beyond serious, the US military is in an economic hole, that will likely pile up more debt in order to get them back up to speed

I hope the congress does come up with the money, but many of these concerns are constrained by our present non-workable budget, many of the Republicans in the house while concerned, are "budget hawks". President Trump has made it very clear that he intends to ride to the rescue of the US military, but our congress holds the "purse strings" and its going to take some major work to "get things back on track".

Seeing the Obama policies unfold was a major contributor to my heart attack and subsequent "triple bi-pass",,,, its hard to "relax" when everything you believe in is going down the "Sh---er--Krapper!

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Jura said:

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What we expect ! for Europe also.

Fixed it for you:

Obi Wan Russell said:

Fixed it for you:View attachment 36314

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while in the meantime ...
How the Royal Navy is all at sea over an appeal to ancient mariners to crew its new £6.2 billion aircraft carriers

• £6.2 billion aircraft carriers could be crewed by mariners aged 60 and above
• Naval chiefs are to appeal to ex-sailors to apply to key posts due to manpower crisis
• In 2015 a recruitment drive aimed to bring in 4,000 additional personnel but only a few hundred new sailors were hired

Read more:

Britain's two new £6.2 billion aircraft carriers have been heralded as the beginning of an exciting era in naval warfare – but due to a manpower crisis, they will be crewed by some of the saltiest sea dogs of modern times.

The Mail on Sunday can reveal that this week the Ministry of Defence will begin a recruitment drive begging ex-sailors who have retired or been made redundant to come back to man the ships.

Normally, only sailors aged up to 59 are considered for duty. But a shortage of personnel has led naval chiefs to appeal to mariners aged 60 and above to apply for key posts.

Admirals have also been forced to waive rules which say that applicants for top jobs must have served in the Royal Navy in the past five years – intended to ensure their skills are up to date.

Such is the severity of the manpower shortage that applications will be considered on a case-by-case basis, irrespective of how long ago they last went to sea.

Sailors paid off by the MoD as part of various redundancy programmes are also being invited to apply for jobs on the new aircraft carriers and across the Royal Navy fleet. The old sea dogs are being enticed with five-year contracts under the Royal Navy's Full Time Reserve Service (FTRS) scheme.

In 2015, the Royal Navy asked the MoD to provide 4,000 additional personnel but only a few hundred sailors were brought in.

As of January 1 this year, the Royal Navy and the Royal Marines had 29,190 personnel – down from 29,530 in 2016 and ten per cent less than their operational requirement.

At 920ft long and displacing 65,000 tons, the new carriers are the largest British warships ever built. Each will carry 40 aircraft and will be crewed by 700 sailors and officers. Each carrier is the height of a 12-storey block of flats.

HMS Queen Elizabeth is due to start sea trials this summer, with sister ship HMS Prince of Wales following a year later. The final piece of construction on the Queen Elizabeth will be the fitting of her 25ft-wide propellers by divers at the Rosyth dockyard in Scotland.

A Navy spokesman said: 'We are gauging interest in Reserve service across the fleet. Specific requirements have yet to be determined but all are welcome to apply.'

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Obi Wan Russell said:

Fixed it for you:View attachment 36314

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Yes Sir ! You imitate US 100000 tons of diplomacy for me only 42000 t
Russians do diplomacy from the land with a CV completely unusual the CV is in fact a transport hahaha all including reliable watchers laugh, Syrian deployment ridiculous

Ofc interesting a new capacity but " have cost " the 4 Type 22 IIRC BTW in 2010 they want sold all or almost

Jura said:

while in the meantime ...
How the Royal Navy is all at sea over an appeal to ancient mariners to crew its new £6.2 billion aircraft carriers

• £6.2 billion aircraft carriers could be crewed by mariners aged 60 and above
• Naval chiefs are to appeal to ex-sailors to apply to key posts due to manpower crisis
• In 2015 a recruitment drive aimed to bring in 4,000 additional personnel but only a few hundred new sailors were hired

Read more:

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Ahh, the Daily Fail and the Fail on Sunday. Missing the target as usual. The fault and blame lies squarely with Cameron's Government and Osbourne's unnecessary Defence cuts several years ago, which are having long term implications (which many of us predicted back then. May's administration is only compounding the problem, like a long line of Conservative administrations, they talk tough but are only interested in tax cuts for their rich friends. Labour aren't much different to be fair, and Corbyn's lot would be even worse given half a chance. Sixty years of relentless defence cuts and redundancies for service personnel leave an impression that joining up does not offer any job security, which causes big problems in recruitment and retention.

Government screws up, and the paper makes it look like the Navy is to blame.

Obi Wan Russell said:

Ahh, the Daily Fail and the Fail on Sunday. Missing the target as usual. The fault and blame lies squarely with Cameron's Government and Osbourne's unnecessary Defence cuts several years ago, which are having long term implications (which many of us predicted back then. May's administration is only compounding the problem, like a long line of Conservative administrations, they talk tough but are only interested in tax cuts for their rich friends. Labour aren't much different to be fair, and Corbyn's lot would be even worse given half a chance. Sixty years of relentless defence cuts and redundancies for service personnel leave an impression that joining up does not offer any job security, which causes big problems in recruitment and retention.

Government screws up, and the paper makes it look like the Navy is to blame.

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now that's interesting, I have always thought the Admiralty is responsible for the Navy, but in this Forum I've been hearing about Politicians, and I'm not buying it, as Politicians don't issue sailing orders, but Admirals issue sailing orders

oh and in this Forum I've repeatedly seen Journalists blamed, too, which I'm not buying either, because if there had been no serious issues, they wouldn't have reported them! (I said 'serious', for example going to sea without AShMs after 2018; cover-up of the Trident failure; cover-up of Type 45 loosing power ... I think you know I could pull links here ... I wouldn't post about anything minor (for example I've recently noticed an article claiming some Barracks can't afford running CCTV anymore; even if it was true, it shouldn't hurt the soldiers to walk around the compound) or sickening like, how do I call it politely? TRANS-GENDER personnel issues: it could make me puke)

EDIT
anyway Happy Birthday to you
Today is Obi Wan Russell's birthday.

• Obi Wan Russell
  Jedi Master, 47

Jura said:

now that's interesting, I have always thought the Admiralty is responsible for the Navy, but in this Forum I've been hearing about Politicians, and I'm not buying it, as Politicians don't issue sailing orders, but Admirals issue sailing orders

oh and in this Forum I've repeatedly seen Journalists blamed, too, which I'm not buying either, because if there had been no serious issues, they wouldn't have reported them! (I said 'serious', for example going to sea without AShMs after 2018; cover-up of the Trident failure; cover-up of Type 45 loosing power ... I think you know I could pull links here ... I wouldn't post about anything minor (for example I've recently noticed an article claiming some Barracks can't afford running CCTV anymore; even if it was true, it shouldn't hurt the soldiers to walk around the compound) or sickening like, how do I call it politely? TRANS-GENDER personnel issues: it could make me puke)

EDIT
anyway Happy Birthday to you
Today is Obi Wan Russell's birthday.

• Obi Wan Russell
  Jedi Master, 47

Click to expand...

He's just a baby, 47,,,,, and so Smart for his age, you young guys! Happy Birthday Obi Wan, we all love you brother, and thanks to Master Jura for letting us know.

and Jura, in the UK, and here in the colonies, only negative journalism gets "street kred", or should I say "street crud",,, granted the govt does put out some "puff pieces", but anything blatantly untrue, (for example Hillaries emails), does get the "unwashed masses", up in arms.

Flying magazines, Gun magazines, Motorcycle magazines, lots of folks write op-ed pieces, some good, most informative, some along the "national enquirer".

If you want to read an objective, honest, fair write up, check-out the Air Force Magazine, in particular John Tirpak, read the letters to the editor, if anyone gets anything wrong, there is a real "krap storm" in response, with people who "know" making sure they get it right....

I like Tyler, and David,,,, they just want to write "expose" style pieces, because that's thought to be serious journalism... The reality is that all govt programs, particularly defense programs are complicated, bloated, and overly expensive.

Politicians are responsible for most of these overly complex laws and standards, in particular liberals love the minutia, but some conservatives are into their power as well, the top brass in most of the services are of necessity politicians as well as soldiers, so it is what it is?

Chris Bogdan is a fine example of the serious labor that our fine military do everyday, keeping the faith, trying to procure the best tools for the warfighter, the best tool to keep us free.

being "paranoid" is no fun, I understand your situation, and where you grew up, and I absolutely agree with you. My Dad was far more honest and straight than anybody else I know personally, and he told it like it is. He taught me a deep respect for those who are doing their best, to do it right the first time, working on the farm and fixing the stuff we broke, taught me that all machinery has limitations, and that you had to learn to operate within those limitations or you took two days to repair the system you broke trying to "push it" outside of its design operating envelope.

on the other hand, a healthy dose of "skepticism" will keep you from falling prey to "scam artists", I was an early critic of the F-35, a serious critic, but research and the terminal results we are seeing now have won me over...

Air Force Brat said:

He's just a baby, 47,,,,, and so Smart for his age, you young guys! Happy Birthday Obi Wan, we all love you brother, and thanks to Master Jura for letting us know.

and Jura, in the UK, and here in the colonies, only negative journalism gets "street kred", or should I say "street crud",,, granted the govt does put out some "puff pieces", but anything blatantly untrue, (for example Hillaries emails), does get the "unwashed masses", up in arms.

Flying magazines, Gun magazines, Motorcycle magazines, lots of folks write op-ed pieces, some good, most informative, some along the "national enquirer".

If you want to read an objective, honest, fair write up, check-out the Air Force Magazine, in particular John Tirpak, read the letters to the editor, if anyone gets anything wrong, there is a real "krap storm" in response, with people who "know" making sure they get it right....

I like Tyler, and David,,,, they just want to write "expose" style pieces, because that's thought to be serious journalism... The reality is that all govt programs, particularly defense programs are complicated, bloated, and overly expensive.

Politicians are responsible for most of these overly complex laws and standards, in particular liberals love the minutia, but some conservatives are into their power as well, the top brass in most of the services are of necessity politicians as well as soldiers, so it is what it is?

Chris Bogdan is a fine example of the serious labor that our fine military do everyday, keeping the faith, trying to procure the best tools for the warfighter, the best tool to keep us free.

being "paranoid" is no fun, I understand your situation, and where you grew up, and I absolutely agree with you. My Dad was far more honest and straight than anybody else I know personally, and he told it like it is. He taught me a deep respect for those who are doing their best, to do it right the first time, working on the farm and fixing the stuff we broke, taught me that all machinery has limitations, and that you had to learn to operate within those limitations or you took two days to repair the system you broke trying to "push it" outside of its design operating envelope.

on the other hand, a healthy dose of "skepticism" will keep you from falling prey to "scam artists", I was an early critic of the F-35, a serious critic, but research and the terminal results we are seeing now have won me over...

Click to expand...

In addition I am and was heartsick over the cancellation of the F-22, there has never been, nor will there likely be among current crop of upstarts, such a fine aeroplane just on aerodynamics/kinematics alone. Add the very superior all aspect stealth, and you have the one aeroplane that has the alltitude, speed, and stealth to go all the way down town, take out its target, and provide you an exit somewhere.

All of this end of the world negativity regarding the F-35, is real threat on capitol hill as well as in the executive branch, because nobody ever forgets anything bad about you? whether true or false??? and they seldom ever remember anything positive you ever did, so these negative nabobs get an inside the beltway pass? and the political class isn't really living in a real world, its all about the next "pressor", I know my Sister in Law was the "Press Agent" for the Illiniois State Treasurer, he was spending a lot of time in Chicago and replaced her with a Latina Chick behind her back, and told her after everybody else in the office already knew?? She kept her salary and was "promoted" to another department..... That's Illinois politics, you are in, until you're out!

Sad, but true, in the political world, perception is reality, that's why there's such a huge disconnect. The F-35 beat out the F-22 because in the real world, there was lots of "PORK", which is a word that describes "political meat on the bone"!

That's why two Senators who in the real world "know jack diddly"?? (John McCain and Lindsey Graham), are the "experts" in the Senate, on military affairs and even weapons systems. It really is scary to have these ill informed Senators who think and speak "sound bytes", basically giving thumbs up, or thumbs down to the most important weapons the world has ever known? They are important because in todays "long cycle" weapons procurement, it is fantastically expensive to get a new aircraft or series of ships, tanks, etc, into the system, and once gone, they are gone forever! the B-1 that Jimmy Carter killed being the exception?